Wrong ticket on Thameslink (English not first language)

[Luisshady]

Morning,

I have an issue today, I took mi Girlfriend ticket today in Thameslink and she has a railcard, we work in London, and I have a ticket for today as well but 2 hrs after, anyway I use her ticket and the officer caught me with my girlfriend ticket and she make lots of questions English is not my first language so I may answer wrong, so I may be prosecuted, but I want to settle this as I have company travel that pay for my expenses plus mine private travel, so I don’t try to false my identity or nothing like that just , we never think this will be a problem. Is any tip to avoid any court problems ?

 

[Metro95]

Where were you coming from?

 

[WesternLancer]

Morning,

I have an issue today, I took mi Girlfriend ticket today in Thameslink and she has a railcard, we work in London, and I have a ticket for today as well but 2 hrs after, anyway I use her ticket and the officer caught me with my girlfriend ticket and she make lots of questions English is not my first language so I may answer wrong, so I may be prosecuted, but I want to settle this as I have company travel that pay for my expenses plus mine private travel, so I don’t try to false my identity or nothing like that just , we never think this will be a problem. Is any tip to avoid any court problems ?

Please can you clarify more information about what happened eg,

a)-where it happened,
b) - and what journey you were on (to and from),
c) - and the details of the ticket you used (name of ticket type - eg 'Anytime' / 'Off Peak' and where ticket was to and from).

d) Are you saying you bought a ticket with a Railcard discount for your Girlfriend, but then used that ticket yourself, and you do not have a Railcard?

If so that means you used a ticket that was not valid, so they treat this as possible fare evasion.

e) Did they take your name and address and did you state that correctly and check they write it down correctly?

If so they will write to you asking for 'your version of events' - you need to wait for that letter and then reply to it promptly - when you get it, people on here can help you draft a reply that will be suitable to send by way of an apology and a request not to be taken to court. As English is not your first language you can perhaps ask someone who writes good English to help you write it, or if you post your draft here people will help check it for you I'm sure.

 

[Luisshady]

We both work in London so we buy a ticket Brighton to London Bridge, my girlfriend has railcard and I don’t , but I have company app to buy my tickets , we buy the tickets a different times and we start the job at different times , then I went to work first I take her ticket thats has railcard, by accident and she went to work with my ticket that’s is a normal ticket but 2 hours later then me, so I was alone in the train with her ticket and then when the officer ask for tickets, I find out was my girlfriend ticket because the inspector ask me for railcard, anyway I didn’t realise at first but after they give me the paper with the offence I understand I use my girlfriend ticket, and was all a mistake, but now can end wrong ?? I’ll wait for the later and then ask for advice with the letter .

 

[WesternLancer]

We both work in London so we buy a ticket Brighton to London Bridge, my girlfriend has railcard and I don’t , but I have company app to buy my tickets , we buy the tickets a different times and we start the job at different times , then I went to work first I take her ticket thats has railcard, by accident and she went to work with my ticket that’s is a normal ticket but 2 hours later then me, so I was alone in the train with her ticket and then when the officer ask for tickets, I find out was my girlfriend ticket because the inspector ask me for railcard, anyway I didn’t realise at first but after they give me the paper with the offence I understand I use my girlfriend ticket, and was all a mistake, but now can end wrong ?? I’ll wait for the later and then ask for advice with the letter .

Thanks

It would help if you had answered my questions a,b,c, d etc in a clear and ordered list. But I think I get the drift. However, not knowing the answers to my questions (esp point c) might mean the advice given is wrong....

But, basically your error will have resulted in you using a ticket that was not valid for you to use. The type of ticket is important because of the time you are allowed to use a Railcard on (so if you used it early in the morning that could be another, separate validity breach which might make things worse). They won't really care that your girlfriend used a ticket that effectively cost more than she probably needed to pay, this is just bad luck sadly.

But yes, wait for the letter from them, then if you can upload a copy with any of your personal details removed - and then you can get help on how best to reply. The letter could take up to 6 months to arrive, but is more likely to be with you in a few weeks. Then you get a brief time to reply - 14 days or less usually.

However, Thameslink/Southern are usually prepared to offer settlements without court action if you engage with them, so there is a good chance this will not go to court. You might expect to have to pay the full Anytime Single Fare from Brighton to London plus an 'admin fee' of maybe £100.

Can I ask if this has even happened before to you? Because if the case is as straightforward as you explain I'm surprised they did not ask you to pay a 'Penalty Fare' at the time they stopped you instead. Which would probably have been cheaper.

Can you upload an image of the bit of paper they gave you (with no personal details showing)? Make sure you keep this safe whilst this matter progresses.

Head back when you need more advice.

 

[Luisshady]

Thank you for your advice,
This never happen to me, is my first time, as I say I don’t need to use someone else ticket as my company pay my expenses, was a silly mistake.
To be honest the inspector make me nervous, she stay close to me for almost half of the journey, lots of people around me and was embarrassing and just replying yes or no , without even understanding the questions, I’m happy to pay for it, as is my mistake and settle asap and don’t go to court.
Thank you for your advise

 

[Luisshady]

Forgot to attach the ticket apologise

 

[AlterEgo]

Were you travelling on Advance tickets, too? If so, did they bring up the matter that your ticket was not valid two hours earlier than it stated?

 

[WesternLancer]

Were you travelling on Advance tickets, too? If so, did they bring up the matter that your ticket was not valid two hours earlier than it stated?

Indeed an important question, but do Thameslink sell Advance tickets now? I didn't think they used to, in the past at least (whilst Southern Trains did). It seems probable that the OP was on a Thameslink service.

 

[Luisshady]

The ticket was anytime day single ( only Thameslink service ) the problem was, my girlfriend give me her ticket, she buy it from Trainline. I don’t even think about the railcard but they caught me with her ticket and I have not that kind of railcard 16-24
I’m 35 but the way so been give this notice from the inspectors.

 

[AlterEgo]

The ticket was anytime day single ( only Thameslink service ) the problem was, my girlfriend give me her ticket, she buy it from Trainline. I don’t even think about the railcard but they caught me with her ticket and I have not that kind of railcard 16-24
I’m 35 but the way so been give this notice from the inspectors.

As they’re both anytime day singles not restricted by time, why did you take her ticket and not use yours? This is a relevant question the prosecutor will want answered.

 

[najaB]

This seems pretty straightforward. You had a Railcard discounted ticket, but no Railcard.

Expect a letter in the post in the next few weeks asking for your side of events.

When this happens, write back to them explaining that you picked up the wrong ticket, apologise for the mistake and ask for the matter to be resolved out of court.

This will likely be resolved by GTR requesting the full fare for the journey you made, plus an administration fee of around £100.

 

[WesternLancer]

As they’re both anytime day singles not restricted by time, why did you take her ticket and not use yours? This is a relevant question the prosecutor will want answered.

OP addressed this in post #4. Took the wrong ticket by accident. Made a mistake.
Assuming the OP can evidence this and evidence their girlfriend's valid Railcard it will show there has been no financial loss to the railway.

 

[Luisshady]

As they’re both anytime day singles not restricted by time, why did you take her ticket and not use yours? This is a relevant question the prosecutor will want answered.

I use her ticket, she has railcard 16-25 with discount , I don’t have railcard because, I use my company app to buy tickets, this morning I went to work for her and use her ticket, with her discount from Brighton to London, we never think about the railcard or I’ll be ask for it, never not one ask almost for a year, I use my app she use her railcard, but for once o use her ticket, she stay at home and I use her ticket, then the inspector caught me using her ticket and give the paper to present the railcard but I can’t because I don’t have one

 

[AlterEgo]

I use her ticket, she has railcard 16-25 with discount , I don’t have railcard because, I use my company app to buy tickets, this morning I went to work for her and use her ticket, with her discount from Brighton to London, we never think about the railcard or I’ll be ask for it, never not one ask almost for a year, I use my app she use her railcard, but for once o use her ticket, she stay at home and I use her ticket, then the inspector caught me using her ticket and give the paper to present the railcard but I can’t because I don’t have one

Ok, thanks. @najaB has already described what will happen next, which is likely they you’ll get a letter asking for your side of the story, you’ll need to apologise by reply and they usually settle for £100 plus any fare avoided.

If you have proof of purchase of the other ticket which you bought on your corporate provider you should definitely attach it when you write to them.

 

[Luisshady]

As they’re both anytime day singles not restricted by time, why did you take her ticket and not use yours? This is a relevant question the prosecutor will want answered.

Basically today she should work at 9 am and I should start at 11am, we swap shift so she give me her ticket and I travel alone , and then I give her my ticket, the problem is she has a railcard and I don’t , we went different times . But I was caught with a ticket that’s was buy with a railcard discount that don’t belong to me.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Mar 2023 ==

This seems pretty straightforward. You had a Railcard discounted ticket, but no Railcard.

Expect a letter in the post in the next few weeks asking for your side of events.

When this happens, write back to them explaining that you picked up the wrong ticket, apologise for the mistake and ask for the matter to be resolved out of court.

This will likely be resolved by GTR requesting the full fare for the journey you made, plus an administration fee of around £100.

I’ll thank you.

 

[WesternLancer]

Basically today she should work at 9 am and I should start at 11am, we swap shift so she give me her ticket and I travel alone , and then I give her my ticket, the problem is she has a railcard and I don’t , we went different times . But I was caught with a ticket that’s was buy with a railcard discount that don’t belong to me.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Mar 2023 ==


I’ll thank you.

Yes, you will now understand that you can't do that as the ticket with the railcard discount can only be used by the person with that Railcard.

Have you ever done this before? for example if you have swapped shifts in the same way. It could be a problem if you have, if they can find out about it that is.

 

[30907]

As they’re both anytime day singles not restricted by time, why did you take her ticket and not use yours? This is a relevant question the prosecutor will want answered.

I imagine the OP would normally use the appropriate Offpeak Single.

 

[Luisshady]

Yes, you will now understand that you can't do that as the ticket with the railcard discount can only be used by the person with that Railcard.

Have you ever done this before? for example if you have swapped shifts in the same way. It could be a problem if you have, if they can find out about it that is.

I never use her ticket before, I always use my regular tickets from my company app, is first time this happen.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Mar 2023 ==

I imagine the OP would normally use the appropriate Offpeak Single.

I imagine the OP would normally use the appropriate Offpeak Single.

Yes, she use my ticket off peak single.

 

[WesternLancer]

I never use her ticket before, I always use my regular tickets from my company app, is first time this happen.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 21 Mar 2023 ==

Thanks - for clarifying. I think this should be fairly straightforward to sort out with them. Just a question of explaining things systematically and clearly in your reply to their letter when it comes, so that they can understand the mistake you made.

I preparation for that -
- keep copies of your ticket or purchase record for that day
- keep copies of your girlfriends ticket or purchase record for that day
- keep a copy of your girlfriends valid Railcard for that day (ie her current Railcard)

These can all be enclosed with your reply as evidence of the mistake you made and how the Railway has not lost out financially and there was no deliberate intention to evade the correct fare.

Head back here when you need help with the reply. The letter you get will probably start off threatening you with prosecution at court, but in reality it will actually be asking for your version of events before they decide about prosecution. It's this you will need to reply to quickly.

 

[reb0118]

A point of clarification if I may: when was the non discounted ticket purchased? I.e. before or after you were stopped & questioned by a railway official.

 

[najaB]

A point of clarification if I may: when was the non discounted ticket purchased? I.e. before or after you were stopped & questioned by a railway official.

To make it a little easier, since English isn't your first language, can you put the events in the correct order (even better if you can give approximate times):

• You bought a full price ticket (no discount)
• You travelled using a discounted ticket
• Your girlfriend bought a discounted ticket
• Your girlfriend travelled using the full price ticket
• You were stopped and questioned by a ticket officer

Thanks.

 

[Luisshady]

afternoon, the letter has arrive and yes they want to get me to court so please if anyone can help me to redact the letter as English is not my first language.
any advice before I respond ??

 

[najaB]

afternoon, the letter has arrive and yes they want to get me to court so please if anyone can help me to redact the letter as English is not my first language.
any advice before I respond ??

Take a photo of the letter they have sent you, use Paint or similar to blank out your name, address and any other personal information and then post it here so that we can see exactly what the TOC (train operating company) are intending to do.

 

[Snow1964]

In meantime keep both tickets, you will need evidence of both to show you both had a ticket, one with railcard discount, one without, and had accidently swapped them over.

You will also need evidence of the railcard, to show one of the tickets was discounted correctly, and a valid railcard exists. (but railcard wasn't with the ticket).

I am guessing you will need to explain the swapped ticket, as GTR didn't have an equal and opposite case for your girlfriend (incorrectly travelling with full ticket, and with railcard). But they wouldn't take action where money in their favour

 

[Bertie the bus]

I might be being dense but there is something I don’t understand about this situation, and I suspect GTR won’t either.

The OP says their tickets are issued on an app, therefore presumably there is no physical ticket so how can they have accidentally picked up their girlfriend's ticket?

There is also a blatant contradiction in their story:

We both work in London so we buy a ticket Brighton to London Bridge, my girlfriend has railcard and I don’t , but I have company app to buy my tickets , we buy the tickets a different times and we start the job at different times , then I went to work first I take her ticket thats has railcard, by accident ...

The ticket was anytime day single ( only Thameslink service ) the problem was, my girlfriend give me her ticket, she buy it from Trainline.

 

[Haywain]

The OP says their tickets are issued on an app, therefore presumably there is no physical ticket so how can they have accidentally picked up their girlfriend's ticket?

I read it as the tickets being bought through an app.

 

[najaB]

There is also a blatant contradiction in their story:

I'm not seeing the contradiction. The key facts as stated in both of the quotes are the same: the OP left before the girlfriend, used the girlfriend's ticket rather than their own, and that ticket had a railcard discount that the OP wasn't entitled to.

The only potential contradiction is that in one post they say they took the ticket, in the other they say that the girlfriend gave them the ticket - but that's much more likely a result of English not being their first language than an attempt at dissemblance. Especially since they are independent posts, any sign of contradiction only appears when the two posts are read together.

 

[Bertie the bus]

You don't see a contradiction between accidentally taking somebody else's ticket and deliberately swapping it because they have swapped shifts and the person who had an Anytime ticket now only needs an Off Peak one and the one who had an Off Peak one needs an Anytime?

 

[najaB]

You don't see a contradiction between accidently taking somebody else's ticket and deliberately swapping it because they have swapped shifts and the person who had an Anytime ticket now only needs an Off Peak one and the one who had an Off Peak one needs an Anytime?

If I "give" you something then you "take" it. The "accident" could well be referring to not realising that the ticket had a discount.