3 car fgw 158

[387star]

Just saw one on the afternoon Brighton train usually two coaches. This should have been only two?

 

[ainsworth74]

Just to confirm you're asking why the train was 3 coaches rather than 2?

In which case could be a number of reasons, one of the likely ones is that the unit that was supposed to run the service was unavailable and a 3 coach 158 was all that was available to run it.

 

[MCR247]

Or the diagrams had to be swapped for some reason

 

[BestWestern]

Stock variations on that particular service are quite commonplace, sometimes a 150 will turn up. Pot luck! :roll:

 

[TEW]

Seems to be a 3 car 158 more often recently. There was still a Portsmouth-Cardiff diagram running as a 2 car today though.

 

[142]

Probably due to todays unit shortage. The SWT hire in did not operate on its booked diagram if at all! 158955 (2 car) operated in its place. I have also noticed that 158751 has been made as 2 car from 158950. There seems to be a lot of messing about when it comes to 158s at the moment.

 

[Dreadnought]

Probably due to todays unit shortage. The SWT hire in did not operate on its booked diagram if at all! 158955 (2 car) operated in its place. I have also noticed that 158751 has been made as 2 car from 158950. There seems to be a lot of messing about when it comes to 158s at the moment.

I only saw 158950 last Friday (04/03) at Cardiff and it was 3 car then. Also, the coaches from 158751 were split, with 57751 & 158761 forming 158950 and 52751 & 158764 forming 158951.

One possibility is that 158751 has been reformed and another unit has been split to keep the 3 car units running, this has happened in the past.

Or, they reformed all the units to make 3 x 2 car units.

 

[Arriva158]

Stock variations on that particular service are quite commonplace, sometimes a 150 will turn up. Pot luck! :roll:

Whilst on a West Mids Day Ranger approx. a month back I was hoping for a FGW 158 on the Gt. Malvern - Brighton route, and what turns up... 150229, a flaming ATW hire in which had only gone there the night before after working one of my services the previous day! Really is potluck!

 

[BestWestern]

There is indeed a lot of chopping and changing of the 3 car sets; you should see the state of the unit number labels in some of the cabs, they've been changed so many times you'd have to take a wild guess at what number you're running with today! There's been a 2 x 150/2 formation on the Pompey - Cardiff runs for the past few days from what I've seen, and a 2 car 158+150/2 on today. 955 seems to have been running as a 2 car for while now, not sure if the remaining third is out of traffic for some reason or it's been reformed into something else. I heard that we were running 3 sets down a few days ago, not good!

 

[387star]

I thought they were converting remaining 2-car examples to 3-car? Although I was surprised today's 12:35 departure from Fratton heading to Cardiff was only two coaches! Perhaps it is because of the refurbishment currently ongoing?

 

[BestWestern]

There have been various rumours about more three cars, I heard one a while ago that they were all going back to two car to be run in pairs, etc etc... But in reality I don't think there are any anticipated changes soon, just the everyday business of reshuffling them due to maintenance requirements etc.

 

[142]

There have been various rumours about more three cars, I heard one a while ago that they were all going back to two car to be run in pairs, etc etc... But in reality I don't think there are any anticipated changes soon, just the everyday business of reshuffling them due to maintenance requirements etc.

You heard right there I think, 158751 is now back as a 2 car set, as are 158953/158955

 

[BestWestern]

Do you mean 951? I'm not aware of any current plans to reduce the 'hybrid' sets back down to two cars, and I'm sure this would have been the subject of a staff notice - and a great deal of disdain! - if it was going ahead. Portsmouth - Cardiff still requires three car sets on many journeys, and I believe, as with most stock decisions nowadays, the DfT had some sort of involvement in the shuffling that was required to obtain enough stock to create the hybrid sets. In which case FGW presumably wouldn't be able to just decide to undo it all. It's not uncommon for the hybrids to be released into traffic in two car format, and although generally the missing car is replaced fairly swiftly there have been some instances where this has taken quite a while. I'd also imagine that any permanent 'conversion' back to two car units would also involve reinstating the original unit numbers.

 

[heart-of-wessex]

158749 was taken out of a 3 car set sometime last year, and is now permanently 158749, with new numbers included. However the 3 car set remained, just 749 was taken off an replaced for another 2 car 158 to become part of the 158/9 instead.

Why? I have no idea, seemed a bit pointless to me.

As for the Brighton being a 3 car 158, I thought this was booked for a 3 car anyway, or at least some time ago it was booked one on the Brighton to Great Malvern?


Cheers,

James.

 

[thefab444]

The Great Malvern - Brighton working is usually a 2 car 158, on weekdays anyway.

 

[Yew]

Whilst EMT was refurbishing one of its trains. we had a 2 carrige 156 with a 153 in tow :/

 

[TEW]

The Great Malvern - Brighton working is usually a 2 car 158, on weekdays anyway.

The 0900 Brighton-Great Malvern is booked for a 3 car 158 though.

 

[moonrakerz]

I live on the Cardiff - Portsmouth line; there does seem to have been a bit of a hotch-potch of rolling stock of late - everything from 1 to 5 cars. One Five everythings ...............

Haven't seen a Pacer ----- Yet !

 

[heart-of-wessex]

The closest I've had out of Trowbridge is a 143 on the morning Bristol - Pompey about 3-4 years ago, and had Swansea on the front! It was of course duly swapped for a 158 at Westbury as 143s cannot enter 3rd rail land, though the dispensation was temporarily lifted when they went to Eastleigh works

 

[BestWestern]

Yep, was going to say that 143's are forbidden to stray onto those precious Southern metals! 153's also barred beyond Southampton due to clearance issues. Although that didn't stop one getting there on the back of a 158 a couple of years ago... Ooops!!

 

[NXEA!]

The closest I've had out of Trowbridge is a 143 on the morning Bristol - Pompey about 3-4 years ago, and had Swansea on the front! It was of course duly swapped for a 158 at Westbury as 143s cannot enter 3rd rail land, though the dispensation was temporarily lifted when they went to Eastleigh works

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure the idea that Pacer's can not run on lines with third rail present is a myth, as they run over them on a daily basis in the North somewhere where it adjoins Merseyrail, although the location escapes me.

 

[BestWestern]

You may well be right, I'm not entirely certain of the reason for their being banned on the Southern, but they most definitely are! I always believed it was down to risk of contact with the juice, but perhaps not. There are some rather odd route restrictions, the aforementioned one about 153's not being allowed between Southampton and Portsmouth is a slightly odd thing when you consider that they used to do it daily when they ran in pairs and called themselves 155's! The ban is to do with the modifications which were carried out during the 153 conversion, but it's bizarre how they're ok everywhere else. So perhaps the Pacer ban is to do with something else, who knows...!!

 

[ainsworth74]

Pacers are categorically not banned from working over third rail lines and I'm not aware of any restriction on pacers theoretically operating on Southern region metals (but that doesn't mean there isn't of course).

 

[NXEA!]

Ahh fair enough, I didn't realise they were actually banned from the Southern region, again, I just thought it was a myth. The thing about the 153's is strange, the only real change that was made to the 155's was the addition of a second cab to each vehicle to make them 153's nothing else has really changed. Would be interesting if someone could shed some light.

 

[TEW]

Pacers are definitely banned from the Southern. There refurbishment at Eastleigh and moves there were a one off. The issue with 153s is steps I believe, I don't know if they were fitted when converted to 153s from 155s but they are the problem now. The last time a 153 made it to Portsmouth I believe the steps had to be removed before it returned.

 

[BestWestern]

Pacers are definitely banned from the Southern. There refurbishment at Eastleigh and moves there were a one off. The issue with 153s is steps I believe, I don't know if they were fitted when converted to 153s from 155s but they are the problem now. The last time a 153 made it to Portsmouth I believe the steps had to be removed before it returned.

That's right, it's the 'new' crew steps which had to be added to the previously non-cab end bogie when the conversion was done. There is an issue with them clobbering platform edges somewhere between Southampton and Fareham I believe. I've also heard that the toilet water tank can cause the unit to sway out of guage because it's on the roof, but that might be railwayman's license! As for the Pacers, I think it's a pretty safe bet that if they were permitted to operate down to Portsmouth, it would have happened by now, with all the disruption on Portsmouth - Cardiff in past years.

 

[142]

As for the Pacers, I think it's a pretty safe bet that if they were permitted to operate down to Portsmouth, it would have happened by now, with all the disruption on Portsmouth - Cardiff in past years.

I know pacers dont go past Warminster because the crew that join the train at Westbury to Portsmouth dont sign pacers! Its not a case of them being banned. The Warminster terminating service is operated by Bristol/Gloucester crew.

 

[BestWestern]

I know pacers dont go past Warminster because the crew that join the train at Westbury to Portsmouth dont sign pacers! Its not a case of them being banned. The Warminster terminating service is operated by Bristol/Gloucester crew.

That isn't the case; the service to Portsmouth is operated by either Bristol, Westbury or Fratton crew. Both Bristol and Westbury currently sign Class 143 traction. Fratton used to sign it when their diagrams included a trip to Weston Super Mare, but this stopped a few years back. If the 143's were permitted to operate on the Portsmouth run the crews would sign them, no doubt at all. It would make no sense to introduce an operational hurdle over something so trivial; traction training would take one day.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---

Three car 158 newsflash...

158951 is now a three car again, running around numbered as 158955 on one end as it seems to have gained one of it's cars, while 955 is currently still a two car set. Any Western spotters are officially allowed cheat and 'cop' them both if they see 951 Where the missing original bit of 951 has gone is a mystery; anyone checked ebay?!

 

[Lampshade]

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure the idea that Pacer's can not run on lines with third rail present is a myth, as they run over them on a daily basis in the North somewhere where it adjoins Merseyrail, although the location escapes me.

That would be Hunts Cross, the section of the line from there to Liverpool South Parkway is electrified third rail and 142s use it on a daily basis.

I think the issue is more straightforward than Pacers just not being permitted because 'they may come into contact with the juice rail', Pacers have never worked into Waterloo/Victoria, so maybe they're just not route cleared. Or even more straightforward - the government needs an excuse to keep them away from the capital.