Northern TVMs selling Rovers and rangers

[northernman]

Hi all, I wanted to update you that we are now in pilot at 10 machines for our new feature on Northern TVMs to sell Rovers and rangers. The pilot sites are:

• Frizinghall
• Crossflats
• Penistone
• Irlam
• Darwen
• Disley
• Burley in Wharfedale
• Manchester Piccadilly Concourse
• Wombwell

On the home screen there is a new rovers and ranger button, that will permit access to the products, which we have grouped by relevance of location to the TVM in the first instance, but then also the ability to buy any rover or ranger. Currently they can be bought for "today", there is no advance purchase feature (we are working on that). The information button gives further guidance and also a QR code which when scanned by a smartphone hands off to the NRE site for further details including things like validity map. The pilot will last for 4 weeks, and subject to passing accreditation, we will roll out the the rest of the Northern TVM fleet by the end of March. Feel free to have a look if you are passing one of these stations, and any feedback on this thread would be very welcome

Ian Borthwick, Retail Operations Manager, Northern

 

[RPI]

Hi all, I wanted to update you that we are now in pilot at 10 machines for our new feature on Northern TVMs to sell Rovers and rangers. The pilot sites are:

• Frizinghall
• Crossflats
• Penistone
• Irlam
• Darwen
• Disley
• Burley in Wharfedale
• Manchester Piccadilly Concourse
• Wombwell

On the home screen there is a new rovers and ranger button, that will permit access to the products, which we have grouped by relevance of location to the TVM in the first instance, but then also the ability to buy any rover or ranger. Currently they can be bought for "today", there is no advance purchase feature (we are working on that). The information button gives further guidance and also a QR code which when scanned by a smartphone hands off to the NRE site for further details including things like validity map. The pilot will last for 4 weeks, and subject to passing accreditation, we will roll out the the rest of the Northern TVM fleet by the end of March. Feel free to have a look if you are passing one of these stations, and any feedback on this thread would be very welcome

Ian Borthwick, Retail Operations Manager, Northern

Thats fantastic news!

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi all, I wanted to update you that we are now in pilot at 10 machines for our new feature on Northern TVMs to sell Rovers and rangers. The pilot sites are:

• Frizinghall
• Crossflats
• Penistone
• Irlam
• Darwen
• Disley
• Burley in Wharfedale
• Manchester Piccadilly Concourse
• Wombwell

On the home screen there is a new rovers and ranger button, that will permit access to the products, which we have grouped by relevance of location to the TVM in the first instance, but then also the ability to buy any rover or ranger. Currently they can be bought for "today", there is no advance purchase feature (we are working on that). The information button gives further guidance and also a QR code which when scanned by a smartphone hands off to the NRE site for further details including things like validity map. The pilot will last for 4 weeks, and subject to passing accreditation, we will roll out the the rest of the Northern TVM fleet by the end of March. Feel free to have a look if you are passing one of these stations, and any feedback on this thread would be very welcome

Ian Borthwick, Retail Operations Manager, Northern

This sounds most welcome Ian. Thanks for alerting people here.

 

[NorthWestRover]

Woo hoo! I take it that includes the Northern 55 Explorer?

Amazing that this appears to include all rovers and rangers. Please do Wigan Wallgate next lol.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

"all Rovers and Rangers"

Does this include the All Line Rover, or is it just the Northern ones?

 

[northernman]

Woo hoo! I take it that includes the Northern 55 Explorer?

Amazing that this appears to include all rovers and rangers. Please do Wigan Wallgate next lol.

Yes that is included

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"all Rovers and Rangers"

Does this include the All Line Rover, or is it just the Northern ones?

Yes All line, first and standard class

 

[danm14]

but then also the ability to buy any rover or ranger.

Does this include those PTE products like the Merseytravel Saveaway and TfGM Wayfarer which are listed in the fares database as rovers/rangers?

 

[W-on-Sea]

Well done, Northern, this is excellent news. May other TOCs follow such an example...

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Yes that is included

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Yes All line, first and standard class

I'm impressed, genuinely.

 

[Watershed]

This is great news! When you say "any" rover or ranger, do you mean every single product that is valid at that location, or just rail-only products? For example, I imagine you won't be selling System One Travelcards or Derbyshire Wayfarers. But presumably you will sell GM Rail Rangers, FoNW, FoNE etc.?

 

[northernman]

Does this include those PTE products like the Merseytravel Saveaway and TfGM Wayfarer which are listed in the fares database as rovers/rangers?

Yes it includes Saveaway and the Manchester Wayfarer

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Feb 2023 ==

This is great news! When you say "any" rover or ranger, do you mean every single product that is valid at that location, or just rail-only products? For example, I imagine you won't be selling System One Travelcards or Derbyshire Wayfarers. But presumably you will sell GM Rail Rangers, FoNW, FoNE etc.?

GM Rail rangers, FoNW and FoNE are included. Derby Wayfarer can be bought but we currently don't have a solution for the self seal wallet it goes into

 

[Watershed]

Derby Wayfarer can be bought but we currently don't have a solution for the self seal wallet it goes into

I see. So will the TVMs actually allow you to buy it, or is it technically possible but just currently not enabled?

 

[northernman]

Some examples of the screens on the TVM at Disley

 

[sheff1]

Derby Wayfarer can be bought but we currently don't have a solution for the self seal wallet it goes into

Derbyshire Wayfarer no longer needs the sealed wallet.

********************
Agree this is excellent news from Northern. The issue I will have is that the Northern TVMs were removed from Sheffield many years ago and so I would need to go to Meadowhall. Even better of course if Northern would sell them on line - any plans for this ?

 

[AlterEgo]

This is very positive news! I’m not aware of any other TVMs selling such a wide range of rangers and rovers.

 

[Watershed]

Some examples of the screens on the TVM at Disley

This is great stuff. I think it might help to disambiguate phrases such as "CST PKS" - not sure how feasible this is though.

 

[The exile]

Yes it includes Saveaway and the Manchester Wayfarer

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GM Rail rangers, FoNW and FoNE are included. Derby Wayfarer can be bought but we currently don't have a solution for the self seal wallet it goes into

Derby station sell it on a normal orange card ticket - no self-seal wallet.
See I was beaten to it!

 

[negone]

Thats fantastic news!

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Could northern make a simple hand holding youtube video on how to use their tvm's ,etc
using someone like Chris Jeffery's format which are both clear and informative.

 

[Benjwri]

Some examples of the screens on the TVM at Disley

Interested by the ‘Bath Tour’ ticket in image 7, it does indeed appear in fares data, but there is no guidance anywhere I can find on its actual purpose or validity (Except it seems to be a bus ticket)

 

[Wallsendmag]

Interesting times

 

[CE142]

I bet they don't sell PRIV rovers....

 

[furlong]

1) Is there a search by station yet i.e. show me all the products with validity at the station I enter? (See railrover.org.) That seems to me to be the most natural entry point for the user interface, defaulting to the current station.

2) The (i) button should also provide a searchable list of all the stations at which the selected product has validity so people can easily check if it meets their needs.

3) Maps should also be shown on screen not just via a QR code.

4) Given 1 and 2, these products can then be offered as part of the results of the normal journey search whenever valid (in the same way some websites already do).

 

[Howardh]

Good news, but personally would rather like to buy them via the app. Would also like to but a Gtr M system 1 bus/rail via the app too!

One hole needs filling, if we buy a Manchester S1 bus/rail ticket, we can't use it on the train during the afternoon peak. Can we have a S1+ that covers the peak?

 

[NorthWestRover]

Life changing!

 

[northernman]

This is great stuff. I think it might help to disambiguate phrases such as "CST PKS" - not sure how feasible this is though.

The TVM takes the industry data feed as provided

I bet they don't sell PRIV rovers....

Hi, the TVMs don't offer any private discounted tickets

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I see. So will the TVMs actually allow you to buy it, or is it technically possible but just currently not enabled?

Yes you can buy the Derbyshire Wayfarer, and if EMR are issuing without the wallet then we no longer have a problem, happy days

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 17 Feb 2023 ==

1) Is there a search by station yet i.e. show me all the products with validity at the station I enter? (See railrover.org.) That seems to me to be the most natural entry point for the user interface, defaulting to the current station.

2) The (i) button should also provide a searchable list of all the stations at which the selected product has validity so people can easily check if it meets their needs.

3) Maps should also be shown on screen not just via a QR code.

4) Given 1 and 2, these products can then be offered as part of the results of the normal journey search whenever valid (in the same way some websites already do).

1. No, the TVM set up of software doesn't permit that, but good point food for thought for the future
2. Noted
3. We chose QR code because it avoids the TVM calling out into the world, also we took the view that if you can see the map on your phone, you can screen shot it and its there with you while you travel. We could look to display the map on the TVm for this without smartphones
4. Noted

 

[Wallsendmag]

You need to add Cramlington to your pilot list so I can easily have a look

 

[plugwash]

Good news, but personally would rather like to buy them via the app.

I'm no expert, but my understanding is that the problem is that the TOD specification doesn't allow for rangers and rovers and given that TOD is considered legacy it's unlikely to be extended to do so and issuing rovers as e-tickets would require a lot of parties to agree.

GWR do sell rovers online, but only for postal delivery.

 

[northernman]

I'm no expert, but my understanding is that the problem is that the TOD specification doesn't allow for rangers and rovers and given that TOD is considered legacy it's unlikely to be extended to do so and issuing rovers as e-tickets would require a lot of parties to agree.

GWR do sell rovers online, but only for postal delivery.

Northern is working with Trainline to look at how Rovers can be sold online, no timescales as yet

 

[WesternLancer]

In terms of general feedback here ref some of the points being raised - I think the operator has to strike a balance at the TVM between the info that can be given (maps etc) and the impact that could have at queueing time at the TVM. Whilst most forum users here will have an idea on area validity (or how to find it out) fir a rover - I would not fancy queuing behind someone who did not know spending a lot of time trying to work out which rover they wanted for what they wanted to do....

I already find Northern's TVMs slow enough what with the 'artificial' need to send purchasers down the line of selecting trains of choice on routes where many users are simply going to be buying a flexible walk up type ticket.

So I think directing people to other sources for some of the info is a reasonable compromise.

 

[theblackwatch]

That is excellent news, I look forward to them being rolled out over the rest of the Northern network in due course.