LNER query

[kez19]

I bought an off peak return £86.60 Dundee-Newcastle my original train was cancelled by LNER (this was back in November), I have emailed LNER twice (since November) on trying to claim a partial refund (I ended up getting an earlier train direct) but on the day in question the app wasn't allowing me to change train and ended up buying a single back.

Happy to be corrected if I am in the wrong somewhere but any ideas why no reply? First was done through the normal delay repay process and just a couple weeks ago have sent another email through but nothing (my account with LNER still says on the ticket in question "case in progress" - 3-4 months on surely thats not right?)

 

[Haywain]

I bought an off peak return £86.60 Dundee-Newcastle my original train was cancelled by LNER (this was back in November), I have emailed LNER twice (since November) on trying to claim a partial refund (I ended up getting an earlier train direct) but on the day in question the app wasn't allowing me to change train and ended up buying a single back.

Happy to be corrected if I am in the wrong somewhere but any ideas why no reply? First was done through the normal delay repay process and just a couple weeks ago have sent another email through but nothing (my account with LNER still says on the ticket in question "case in progress" - 3-4 months on surely thats not right?)

Can you be clearer about what happened please? I find your post a little confusing.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Feb 2023 ==

You had a return ticket, so which train was cancelled? And why did you feel the need to buy a new ticket? Also did you claim Delay Repay for a delayed journey?

 

[Watershed]

I bought an off peak return £86.60 Dundee-Newcastle my original train was cancelled by LNER (this was back in November), I have emailed LNER twice (since November) on trying to claim a partial refund (I ended up getting an earlier train direct) but on the day in question the app wasn't allowing me to change train and ended up buying a single back.

Happy to be corrected if I am in the wrong somewhere but any ideas why no reply? First was done through the normal delay repay process and just a couple weeks ago have sent another email through but nothing (my account with LNER still says on the ticket in question "case in progress" - 3-4 months on surely thats not right?)

What was the date and time of the train(s) you originally planned to use, and what was the date and time of the train(s) you ended up taking?

What additional ticket did you buy?

It is possible you are entitled to some money back, but without further information it is difficult to say exactly what.

 

[kez19]

What was the date and time of the train(s) you originally planned to use, and what was the date and time of the train(s) you ended up taking?

What additional ticket did you buy?

It is possible you are entitled to some money back, but without further information it is difficult to say exactly what.

Train booked originally was the 1053 (ticket was part of an off peak), the train I got back was the 0847 from Newcastle.

The ticket I bought to return was an advance single.

Date was 25/11/2022

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Feb 2023 ==

Can you be clearer about what happened please? I find your post a little confusing.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Feb 2023 ==

You had a return ticket, so which train was cancelled? And why did you feel the need to buy a new ticket? Also did you claim Delay Repay for a delayed journey?

The 1053 that morning, LNER train was cancelled to Edinburgh (according to the LNER app my connection to Edinburgh was cancelled with Scotrail but on refreshing the app the Scotrail train was running as normal)

The reason I felt the need to buy a new one was a) I panicked and b) was wanting to return home

I also followed through with the delay repay on return home but it seems to be nothing from LNER on the refund hence why I thought to ask on her, just to add however whenever I have claimed a refund from LNER through delay repay (going back couple years back it wasn't an issue I got refunded without a problem but I am just lost as to why I haven't heard anything from LNER on this other than on my LNER account displaying "case in progress" even few months on).

 

[Skymonster]

So, as the return portion of a Dundee-Newcastle Offpeak return is not valid on the 08:47, the simplest approach might have been to ask the Newcastle ticket office to excess the ticket to an Anytime - or travel on a train of your choosing after 09:30, which the original ticket would have entitled you to do. However, that’s water under the bridge now. There’s no money back due on the replacement Advance you purchased of your own volition, unless the trains you actually used were late. You should be given fee-free refund (not delay repay) for the return portion of your original Offpeak return on the basis you elected not to use it due cancelation / disruption. If you claimed for delay repay, that might be what’s holding up resolving the situation. Note there’s different qualifying circumstances, and a different process, for refunds versus delay repay.

 

[Watershed]

Train booked originally was the 1053 (ticket was part of an off peak), the train I got back was the 0847 from Newcastle.

The ticket I bought to return was an advance single.

Date was 25/11/2022

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Feb 2023 ==



The 1053 that morning, LNER train was cancelled to Edinburgh (according to the LNER app my connection to Edinburgh was cancelled with Scotrail but on refreshing the app the Scotrail train was running as normal)

The reason I felt the need to buy a new one was a) I panicked and b) was wanting to return home

I also followed through with the delay repay on return home but it seems to be nothing from LNER on the refund hence why I thought to ask on her, just to add however whenever I have claimed a refund from LNER through delay repay (going back couple years back it wasn't an issue I got refunded without a problem but I am just lost as to why I haven't heard anything from LNER on this other than on my LNER account displaying "case in progress" even few months on).

Ok. So you weren't delayed, but rather you travelled earlier than planned. This means that unfortunately you won't be entitled to any Delay Repay - this is only paid when you are delayed.

It is also unfortunate that you bought an additional Advance rather than just asking LNER whether you could travel earlier, or alternatively just taking another train after 09:30, for which your ticket would have been valid - or indeed paying the excess to the Anytime Return, which likely would have cost less than the new Advance you bought.

As it stands, you're entitled to a partial refund of your Off-Peak Return but as you used the Advance you bought, and presumably weren't delayed by more than 30 minutes on that journey, you can't claim back anything for that.

It's probably worth getting in touch with LNER's customer services to ask them to consider a gesture of goodwill in the circumstances, as the partial refund you receive on your Off-Peak Return is likely to be considerably less than the cost of your Advance. And even if they're not willing to provide any goodwill gesture, they do at least owe you the partial refund - provided you've submitted that application correctly.

 

[kez19]

Ok. So you weren't delayed, but rather you travelled earlier than planned. This means that unfortunately you won't be entitled to any Delay Repay - this is only paid when you are delayed.

It is also unfortunate that you bought an additional Advance rather than just asking LNER whether you could travel earlier, or alternatively just taking another train after 09:30, for which your ticket would have been valid - or indeed paying the excess to the Anytime Return, which likely would have cost less than the new Advance you bought.

As it stands, you're entitled to a partial refund of your Off-Peak Return but as you used the Advance you bought, and presumably weren't delayed by more than 30 minutes on that journey, you can't claim back anything for that.

It's probably worth getting in touch with LNER's customer services to ask them to consider a gesture of goodwill in the circumstances, as the partial refund you receive on your Off-Peak Return is likely to be considerably less than the cost of your Advance. And even if they're not willing to provide any goodwill gesture, they do at least owe you the partial refund - provided you've submitted that application correctly.

That’s what I thought I had done was right, I might as well add was when I was trying to rebook that morning using the original ticket the app wasn’t allowing me so I then bought the advance at short notice (I checked the night before for any cancellations but nothing was posted, I only had the notification that morning).

Thank you for answering but one part remains unanswered is why I have had no response from LNER?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 7 Feb 2023 ==

So, as the return portion of a Dundee-Newcastle Offpeak return is not valid on the 08:47, the simplest approach might have been to ask the Newcastle ticket office to excess the ticket to an Anytime - or travel on a train of your choosing after 09:30, which the original ticket would have entitled you to do. However, that’s water under the bridge now. There’s no money back due on the replacement Advance you purchased of your own volition, unless the trains you actually used were late. You should be given fee-free refund (not delay repay) for the return portion of your original Offpeak return on the basis you elected not to use it due cancelation / disruption. If you claimed for delay repay, that might be what’s holding up resolving the situation. Note there’s different qualifying circumstances, and a different process, for refunds versus delay repay.

I never thought of that in regards to 0847 train (that might explain why I couldn’t get it on the original ticket), in terms of refund I’m not asking for the refund on the new ticket I purchased but it was with the other ticket I was due to use on the cancelled train but as I say I’m familiar with LNER refunding and usually it’s quick but this is dragging out and feels like I’m going nowhere with it.

 

[WesternLancer]

I never thought of that in regards to 0847 train (that might explain why I couldn’t get it on the original ticket), in terms of refund I’m not asking for the refund on the new ticket I purchased but it was with the other ticket I was due to use on the cancelled train but as I say I’m familiar with LNER refunding and usually it’s quick but this is dragging out and feels like I’m going nowhere with it.

Apols if I have missed it - but have you sent them any chasing e-mails to find out what is goin on in the light of their long delay to conclude the matter with a response to you?
I'd be doing that.
It looks like they have put your claim in the 'too hard to work out' pile and left it there...

EDIT - apols - I see you had sent them 2 e-mails. I think you need to send another one and/ or try the frustrating task of ringing them.

 

[Watershed]

That’s what I thought I had done was right, I might as well add was when I was trying to rebook that morning using the original ticket the app wasn’t allowing me so I then bought the advance at short notice (I checked the night before for any cancellations but nothing was posted, I only had the notification that morning).

When you say rebooking, what are you referring to here? An Off-Peak Return is valid on any train, subject to the relevant time restrictions (not before 09:30 in this case). So you didn't have to rebook in order to use your Off-Peak Return on anothe train. Even if you had an Advance, this is automatically valid on the next train (and usually also the previous train) that complies with the relevant route or operator restriction, so you wouldn't have to rebook anything to use those services.

Essentially I'm just a bit puzzled as to why you bought the additional Advance, unless your arrival was time critical and there was no way of getting there with a train departing 09:30 or later?

As to why you've not heard back from LNER, obviously they are taking far too long here, but unfortunately long waits for refund or customer service enquiries are not unheard of at current. I'm still waiting to get back money I'm owed from one TOC for a journey at the start of December!

 

[kez19]

When you say rebooking, what are you referring to here? An Off-Peak Return is valid on any train, subject to the relevant time restrictions (not before 09:30 in this case). So you didn't have to rebook in order to use your Off-Peak Return on anothe train. Even if you had an Advance, this is automatically valid on the next train (and usually also the previous train) that complies with the relevant route or operator restriction, so you wouldn't have to rebook anything to use those services.

Essentially I'm just a bit puzzled as to why you bought the additional Advance, unless your arrival was time critical and there was no way of getting there with a train departing 09:30 or later?

As to why you've not heard back from LNER, obviously they are taking far too long here, but unfortunately long waits for refund or customer service enquiries are not unheard of at current. I'm still waiting to get back money I'm owed from one TOC for a journey at the start of December!

When I say rebooking I mean as at the time when I seen my train had been cancelled I panicked to get the earliest one home as I was beginning to think others would be cancelled.

As regards times of get trains home prior to one being cancelled, I remember rightly though when I tried to book even the earlier one I was being told on the app either it was full or being cancelled (I’m sure on that Friday there was more cancellations than I had seen and it was being limited as wasn’t there a strike on the Saturday?)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Feb 2023 ==

Apols if I have missed it - but have you sent them any chasing e-mails to find out what is goin on in the light of their long delay to conclude the matter with a response to you?
I'd be doing that.
It looks like they have put your claim in the 'too hard to work out' pile and left it there...

EDIT - apols - I see you had sent them 2 e-mails. I think you need to send another one and/ or try the frustrating task of ringing them.

I think you are right I’ll try and push again with another email if need be I’ll have to phone.

 

[Watershed]

When I say rebooking I mean as at the time when I seen my train had been cancelled I panicked to get the earliest one home as I was beginning to think others would be cancelled.

As regards times of get trains home prior to one being cancelled, I remember rightly though when I tried to book even the earlier one I was being told on the app either it was full or being cancelled (I’m sure on that Friday there was more cancellations than I had seen and it was being limited as wasn’t there a strike on the Saturday?)

OK, appreciate that you were worried at the time - but just for future reference, there's no absolute requirement to be booked on a particular service, or indeed to have a seat reservation, to use it. Despite LNER's best efforts, the railway is not an airline (yet)!

If you did want to obtain a seat reservation for a different service, this can be obtained through the LNER or GWR websites without needing to change your ticket or buy a new one.

 

[kez19]

OK, appreciate that you were worried at the time - but just for future reference, there's no absolute requirement to be booked on a particular service, or indeed to have a seat reservation, to use it. Despite LNER's best efforts, the railway is not an airline (yet)!

If you did want to obtain a seat reservation for a different service, this can be obtained through the LNER or GWR websites without needing to change your ticket or buy a new one.

That’s what confuses me in terms of booking as I have always felt with LNER in particular it’s mandatory to reserve a seat (haven’t used Lumo let alone Cross Country either!)

I think even for myself for future reference I may as well either stick to just booking 2 singles (away/return) or split tickets

 

[Feuillesmortes]

EDIT - apols - I see you had sent them 2 e-mails. I think you need to send another one and/ or try the frustrating task of ringing them.

ideally with bullet points because this thread is not too easy to read

 

[Haywain]

I think even for myself for future reference I may as well either stick to just booking 2 singles (away/return) or split tickets

Or perhaps take advice from this forum. However, the problem wasn't in what you bought it resulted from the cancellation and that can happen no matter what tickets you buy.

 

[kez19]

Or perhaps take advice from this forum. However, the problem wasn't in what you bought it resulted from the cancellation and that can happen no matter what tickets you buy.

That’s true, think also next time try not to panic, at the time I probably was in fight/flight mode as I didn’t want to become stuck.

 

[Haywain]

at the time I probably was in fight/flight mode as I didn’t want to become stuck.

Appreciate that but, especially with the cancellation being early in the day, that wasn't likely to happen. And, in any event, the railway's conditions and the law afford significant protections against being left stranded even if they are occasionally problematic rights to exercise.

 

[Watershed]

That’s what confuses me in terms of booking as I have always felt with LNER in particular it’s mandatory to reserve a seat (haven’t used Lumo let alone Cross Country either!)

I think even for myself for future reference I may as well either stick to just booking 2 singles (away/return) or split tickets

LNER mark their services as 'reservations compulsory' in the timetable data, which means that booking sites cannot sell tickets in conjunction with itineraries involving LNER services unless they are able to issue reservations for the LNER services. But reservations are not actually compulsory in practice and so LNER are, in essence, misleading people when they set the reservation flag in this manner.

So if you find yourself in this situation again in the future, rest assured that obtaining a new seat reservation is optional and does not require you to make any changes to your ticket

 

[Feuillesmortes]

So if you find yourself in this situation again in the future, rest assured that obtaining a new seat reservation is optional and does not require you to make any changes to your ticket

There's still some scope for confusion as the return portion did need to be changed to be able to travel on the 0847.

 

[kez19]

There's still some scope for confusion as the return portion did need to be changed to be able to travel on the 0847.

I believe that the 0847 would probably fall foul that I wouldn’t get on that with that portion as that’s outwith off peak (or am I mistaken here?)

Hence I bought the single as the earliest and direct (without changing at Edinburgh).

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Feb 2023 ==

LNER mark their services as 'reservations compulsory' in the timetable data, which means that booking sites cannot sell tickets in conjunction with itineraries involving LNER services unless they are able to issue reservations for the LNER services. But reservations are not actually compulsory in practice and so LNER are, in essence, misleading people when they set the reservation flag in this manner.

So if you find yourself in this situation again in the future, rest assured that obtaining a new seat reservation is optional and does not require you to make any changes to your ticket

I know LNER when onboard tell you that the unreserved coach could be used but I’m not familiar with what coach that is and would it be as simple to hop on board and pick a random seat?

 

[WesternLancer]

I know LNER when onboard tell you that the unreserved coach could be used but I’m not familiar with what coach that is and would it be as simple to hop on board and pick a random seat?

Yes, it would be that simple. Even if said seat was in any other carriage than the one they do not reserve any seats in (apart from 1st class with a std class ticket of course)

But really frustrating that they make passengers think that it is not that simple....you have my sympathies

 

[kez19]

Yes, it would be that simple. Even if said seat was in any other carriage than the one they do not reserve any seats in (apart from 1st class with a std class ticket of course)

But really frustrating that they make passengers think that it is not that simple....you have my sympathies

If I remember correctly it’s been this way since COVID hasn’t it? I can’t remember it prior?

 

[Watershed]

I believe that the 0847 would probably fall foul that I wouldn’t get on that with that portion as that’s outwith off peak (or am I mistaken here?)

Hence I bought the single as the earliest and direct (without changing at Edinburgh).

Yes, that's correct. This particular Off-Peak ticket is only valid from 09:30. However, you could have paid the difference to the Anytime ticket (an "excess") at the ticket office, or onboard the train (without penalty). This would likely have cost you less than the new ticket you bought. You could also have waited until the first train departing at 09:30 or later, although I appreciate that this may not have been a direct service.

 

[WesternLancer]

If I remember correctly it’s been this way since COVID hasn’t it? I can’t remember it prior?

Yes, LNER decided they could 'get away' with maximum reservations as it suited them and have not seen fit to go back to previous arrangements. It is not beneficial for passengers who have to travel spur of the moment or just walk up - but try to buy tickets on line. Tho they have a system that aims to sort this, but for 1 person needing one seat at short notice it's a pain.

 

[Skymonster]

Any permitted Offpeak return presumably £86.60 would need to be excessed to £115.00 Anytime return. OP will know whether the Advance bought was cheaper or more costly than the £28.40 difference. Either way there should still be a refund due for the unused portion of the Offpeak return which wasn’t used due to the cancelation.

 

[kez19]

Any permitted Offpeak return presumably £86.60 would need to be excessed to £115.00 Anytime return. OP will know whether the Advance bought was cheaper or more costly than the £28.40 difference. Either way there should still be a refund due for the unused portion of the Offpeak return which wasn’t used due to the cancelation.

Saying that as a casing point, I noticed that if I was to do a similar to Newcastle next month (unsure if I’m going), but I wouldn’t pay £115 for an anytime return, I’d either try 2 singles or just split ticket.

As for refund I agree but in my mind I thought I went wrong somewhere (ok I partly did).

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Feb 2023 ==

Yes, that's correct. This particular Off-Peak ticket is only valid from 09:30. However, you could have paid the difference to the Anytime ticket (an "excess") at the ticket office, or onboard the train (without penalty). This would likely have cost you less than the new ticket you bought. You could also have waited until the first train departing at 09:30 or later, although I appreciate that this may not have been a direct service.

Being honest I don’t mind splitting the journey up but when I look at gaps on arrival at Edinburgh Waverley of say 18 min (or less), I am not going to run for a train where as having a gap of half an hour I don’t mind (I’m not familiar with Edinburgh Waverley layout until recently and just managed to work out where some platforms are..)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Feb 2023 ==

Yes, LNER decided they could 'get away' with maximum reservations as it suited them and have not seen fit to go back to previous arrangements. It is not beneficial for passengers who have to travel spur of the moment or just walk up - but try to buy tickets on line. Tho they have a system that aims to sort this, but for 1 person needing one seat at short notice it's a pain.

I’m terms of this I wasn’t sure what to do as I’ve seen the signs plastered over the place at stations ie book up to 10 mins before departure (was trying to do this on the LNER app on return ticket but bounced back), so took the chance with the new ticket/direct.

 

[Wallsendmag]

Yes, that's correct. This particular Off-Peak ticket is only valid from 09:30. However, you could have paid the difference to the Anytime ticket (an "excess") at the ticket office, or onboard the train (without penalty). This would likely have cost you less than the new ticket you bought. You could also have waited until the first train departing at 09:30 or later, although I appreciate that this may not have been a direct service.

Or even a new advance ticket if that was cheaper than the X/S

 

[Deerfold]

Or even a new advance ticket if that was cheaper than the X/S

That's what they did do.

 

[Wallsendmag]

That's what they did do.

I was meaning this could be the cheaper option.

 

[kez19]

I thought to update this post but got email from LNER confirming of refund of £43.30 today.