Portsmouth - Cardiff service potential solutions?

[FGWHST43009]

Is it possible to increase the linespeeds in some places to reduce journey times?

 

[MattRat]

The St Denys curve is quite bendy and a I doubt that trains such as the length of coaches of the IET trains would be able to go round the curve easily.

I am beginning to think that a better idea would be new trains rather than using class 166/165 or units that other Operators are stopping leasing. I would say that perhaps a six coach version of Class 755/756 would be ideal with tri-mode capacity, especially if it included the luggage spaces and trolley spaces as mentioned above by 4-Sub 4732. However, I know that it would be difficult, if not impossible for any ROSCO to either get or provide finance for such trains.

If the DaFT do budge and allow new trains, they'll be 19X Civities. I don't think we'll see any Flirt orders for a long time, and even then only in Scotland and Wales due to devolution. The Government just isn't forthcoming with spending on the railway, due to 'the current financial situation'.

 

[HamworthyGoods]

If the DaFT do budge and allow new trains, they'll be 19X Civities. I don't think we'll see any Flirt orders for a long time, and even then only in Scotland and Wales due to devolution. The Government just isn't forthcoming with spending on the railway, due to 'the current financial situation'.

The government can’t just choose which new train - it has to go to competitive tender.

 

[Wychwood93]

Is it possible to increase the linespeeds in some places to reduce journey times?

There were proposals, in the early 90's, to increase the linespeed between Warminster and Salisbury to 90 vice 75. This would have yielded, at a guess, something over a minute and, were it not for the restrictions at Wishford and Wilton Jn, a touch more than that. Nothing happened. Likewise, quite a lot of the Salisbury to Romsey section could easily be more than 85 and the same for Romsey to Redbridge. Perhaps another minute or so. The curves at Milford and Romsey are an issue - ditto Tunnel Jn. There are problems whether the current signalling could cope? A Westbury to Southampton resignalling is more than likely not soaring to he top of Network Rails 'most do' list. Sadly.

By the way, ref post 171 - Bristol to Southampton is quicker direct than via Reading. Looking at tomorrow, the 1122 direct will see you in Southampton at 1302, 100 minutes, compared to the 1130 changing at Reading into the 1252 XC for Southampton arrival at 1343, 133 minutes.

 

[Annetts key]

One of the main issues with this route, of course, is the extremely bad signalling spacing.

Not being an important enough or busy main line at the time when the decisions were made in the past, means that the signalling provided was shall we say, based on keeping the cost low…

Hence the use of a lot of two aspect signals with the ‘stop’ signals spaced quite far apart…
The spacing of these limits the line capacity, but not the line speed. From the signalling side, what does limit the line speed, is the spacing of the colour light “repeater” (“distant”) from the “stop” signal.

As well as the other problems mentioned above, a lot of this route is on continuous curves, so then the dilemma is the cant (the ‘tilt’) of the track. For higher speeds, the cant has to be increased. But that’s then a problem if a train has to go significantly slower. And it may be problem with the structures like over bridges.

The other problem is that all level crossings have to be risk assessed again. Where crossing equipment is provided, this may need to be adjusted.

Before you know it, even without any track improvements that may be needed, it’s already costing a fortune. And then after all that, the time savings are not very spectacular…

I’m not saying it should not be looked at. Just that no one should get excited about something that is not likely to happen anytime soon.

 

[MattRat]

The government can’t just choose which new train - it has to go to competitive tender.

The tender will be for such a low price, only 19X will be able to be built for it.

 

[RobShipway]

If the DaFT do budge and allow new trains, they'll be 19X Civities. I don't think we'll see any Flirt orders for a long time, and even then only in Scotland and Wales due to devolution. The Government just isn't forthcoming with spending on the railway, due to 'the current financial situation'.

The government can’t just choose which new train - it has to go to competitive tender.

HamworthyGoods is correct and it would be down to in this case GWR to be speaking with the ROSCO's and putting out a tender, yes that would not happen unless their has been Government agreement , but who knows what might happen. GWR has in the last year put out a tender for EMU's whether as extra to class 387 units or to replace them. I am presuming that this got sanctioned by the government prior to release, if it did not then as some have said before it is down to the Train Operators as to what trains they operate on their routes still. If new trains are to be used on Cardiff - Portsmouth route, then you are looking at hybrid/Bi/Tri-mode versions of CAF Civities, Stadler Flirt, Hitachi AT200 and Alstom Aventra.

 

[Xavi]

Operation Churchward will determine the spec if GWR gets any regional trains.