Rishi Sunak and the Conservative Party.

[Bletchleyite]

However, the majority of the cost to a business is non-quantifiable: time of other employees mentoring, lower productivity while they build up experience, etc.

It would be possible to quantify that in law in some form.

 

[najaB]

It would be possible to quantify that in law in some form.

We've tried it, it didn't work.

 

[Bletchleyite]

We've tried it, it didn't work.

How does Germany deal with this issue? Its system of Berufsausbildungen is unrivalled near enough the world over.

An option is to fund apprentice development from taxation imposed on all businesses, so they're pressured to make use of it.

 

[Typhoon]

I completely agree, but then that's hardly the house builders fault (or problem)

These are problems for the central government to sort out and they have clearly failed in doing so for the past 15 years

Don't disagree with the general conclusion. I think some developers are taking advantage of the situation, some Local Authorities are inefficient, and some residents complain too much but, at the end of the day, central government is responsible for a system of providing and monitoring the provision of resources (whether it be in health, education, or elsewhere) which is disjointed and not meeting the needs.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

It would be possible to quantify that in law in some form.

I'm not sure that you practically could. In the first place, you have the challenge of getting a reasonable estimate (which itself will require lots of bureaucracy even if it's possible). And in the second place, if you insist that a person has to repay the full costs of their training, that could easily become unaffordable for the individual. You may well end up with people staying in jobs that they don't want to do for - maybe a couple of years, being very unproductive because they don't want that job, thereby harming their employer, just because they don't want to have to repay the cost of their training. I think you'd end up creating more problems than you solve with that kind of system.

I don't see any realistic alternative to the cost of training for generic jobs like 'engineer' or 'chef' to be borne by either the taxpayer or (in some cases) by the person who wants the training. (With an exception for company-specific, non-transferable, training such as learning the in-house computer software, which clearly should form part of a person's on-the-job training, paid for by the employer).

 

[Thirteen]

Surely any sort of work scheme should include non school leavers. I think there is a gap in the market for people who want to change careers but don't want to go the University route. I know there's apprenticeships but those tend to skew towards school leavers.

 

[Howardh]

Because you realise that the Government is responsible for hundreds of other things besides policy on Europe, and you have opinions about many of those things too?

Europe comes first!

 

[Yew]

A stable economy is much better than boom-and-bust.

But it makes less money for the speculators, will someone please think of the venture capitalists!

 

[Bletchleyite]

But it makes less money for the speculators, will someone please think of the venture capitalists!

Of course genuine, positive investment - buying into the success of a new or expanding company - could still work just fine. I've invested in a few small companies on that basis, I won't do negative investing. Short-selling, basically investing in failure, would do best to go away entirely.

 

[Phil56]

Surely any sort of work scheme should include non school leavers. I think there is a gap in the market for people who want to change careers but don't want to go the University route. I know there's apprenticeships but those tend to skew towards school leavers.

I agree, it's a massive gap. We used to have pretty good "adult education" FE Colleges (inc evening classes) for people wanting to do GCSE/A levels later in life, or learn new skills, etc., but all the FE colleges around here are now geared up for 16-18 year olds and there seems no provision at all for adults, certainly little in the way of evening classes. I think with the relatively new "apprentice" schemes, all efforts are aimed at school leavers rather than adults.

 

[Typhoon]

I agree, it's a massive gap. We used to have pretty good "adult education" FE Colleges (inc evening classes) for people wanting to do GCSE/A levels later in life, or learn new skills, etc., but all the FE colleges around here are now geared up for 16-18 year olds and there seems no provision at all for adults, certainly little in the way of evening classes. I think with the relatively new "apprentice" schemes, all efforts are aimed at school leavers rather than adults.

I endorse that. I managed HE and adult provision in an FE College until I retired getting on for 10 years ago. We were constantly hammered about our retention stats. Same benchmark as 16-19. Of course, we were worse 16-18year-olds have to be in education, apprenticeship or some form of work with training. Adults returning to education sometimes struggle with the workload (and I know, I took OU quals while working), getting to the College on time after work*, getting home at half-nine - if you were lucky. getting time off to do exams, I was even moaned at because a student left because his employers closed the local branch and moved a hundred miles away, he moved to keep his job (best bloody student in the class, too). We got worse resources - for instance, in one centre we only had access to specialist resources if sixth form didn't need them. The problem is that it is a stats business, and we had worse retention stats.

* - an example of this was that evening classes had the same policy as daytime (including 16-19), no admission after 5 minutes of start of session. I had a student speak to me (not my area), first day, stuck in traffic jam, couldn't find room, had been locked out. OK (perhaps) with 16-19 students, but someone who has done a day's work, dodging the traffic to arrive probably hungry, probably paid hundreds of pounds only to be shut out by a policy probably devised by someone who went home just before 4pm to avoid the students. I left shortly the place afterwards - this being the consequence of yet another bonkers policy - the straw that broke the camel's back, having told the class tutor that he will let the student in and if he has any problems get his manager to speak to me, leaving my name and role.

 

[nw1]

Hancock is one I fully expect to quit politics. Raab is 50/50 but I suspect he's losing his seat either way.

Raab might be parachuted in to nearby Reigate, given Blunt is standing down next time.

Reigate has a long history of right-wing Tory MPs so I suspect Raab would be high on the wish list of the local Tory association.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 23 Nov 2022 ==

With Starmer ruling out the single market/customs union, then to me Labour and the Tories are both UKIP. Voters like me hoping that Labour might pave the way back into SM/CU are now politically homeless unless there's a surge towards the Libdems and we can have a Libdem/SNP/Labour coalition and Labour would be forced to improve our relations with the EEA.

So as far as the thread title goes, Sunak will be laughing all the way to the election - why vote Labour when the policy on Europe is no different than Conservatives??

I will have to partly agree with @DynamicSpirit for once

I'm not impressed by this and believe they need to take a pro-CU and pro-FoM position (as discussed in the Brexit thread) but hoping they will change somewhat once they get in. But, critically, there are a whole range of other reasons (for me at least) why Labour is the better option compared to the Conservatives as they are more left-wing which for me personally is important.

I'm no Labour fanboy, but I see them as significantly the least-worst option. In all honesty I am cynical of most politicians, but I'm utterly fed up of the Tories and all they stand for.

 

[DynamicSpirit]

I will have to partly agree with @DynamicSpirit for once

Blimey! Has something gone wrong with the Universe or something? Am I now living in a parallel reality?

 

[brad465]

Of course genuine, positive investment - buying into the success of a new or expanding company - could still work just fine. I've invested in a few small companies on that basis, I won't do negative investing. Short-selling, basically investing in failure, would do best to go away entirely.

If there's a way of taxing short-term speculation then I'd look at that as a means to deter it and/or raise revenue, on the basis that it tends to be very costly when it goes wrong, as per 2008.

 

[Howardh]

Blimey! Has something gone wrong with the Universe or something? Am I now living in a parallel reality?

I sometimes wonder. Go back to 13/11/12, just after a successful Olympics, having a bit of austerity, pound doing OK, just about enough doctors/nurses/teachers/plumbers/electricians/builders etc and a Tory government (in coalition still with the LibDems) and you sat in a pub with a bloke who said..

"In November 2022, ten years later, they will have locked you in your homes for months on end, we'll have left the EU, there will be shortages of workers just about everywhere, hundreds are trying to boat themselves into the UK (not the other way round), we will need visas or waivers to enter Europe and be time limited including Gibraltar, Russia will have invaded Ukraine and be at war, and to heat your home will cost four times more....

.....and the Conservatives have been in government despite three general elections...."

Think you'd have that bloke carted away! Parallel universe just doesn't do it justice!

 

[Gloster]

The Grauniad has published the results of an investigation into the relationship between Baroness (Michelle) Mone, one of more ‘celebrity’ members of the House of Lords, and PPE Medpro, a supplier of PPE during the pandemic. Much as it seems to indicate a lot of of dubious actions, I suspect that the details are just too complicated for most people to absorb. However, it will probably add to the general feeling of grubbiness surrounding the Conservative Party and many of its actions regarding PPE during the pandemic. It may also add to the pressure on them to thoroughly investigate all the shenanigans and introduce proper ethical standards. Well, I can but hope...

(Sorry, I can’t do a link.)

 

[edwin_m]

If there's a way of taxing short-term speculation then I'd look at that as a means to deter it and/or raise revenue, on the basis that it tends to be very costly when it goes wrong, as per 2008.

A few years ago people were talking about putting a very small tax on such transactions, that would be negligible to "normal" investors but would significantly dent the profits of those making very large numbers of those transactions for speculative purposes. Seems to have gone quiet.

 

[Busaholic]

The Tories have a cunning plan to offer 'selected devolution' to Cornwall, Norfolk and Suffolk with a county unitary authority (already in place in at least one) and a directly elected mayor as a prerequisite. How about this as a line-up?

Cornwall - George Eustice
Norfolk - Liz Truss
Suffolk - Matt Hancock

Certainly the last two are narcissistic and delusional enough to think they'd win stunning victories (probably on a low turn-out) and, who knows, I no longer have any confidence that sense will prevail.

 

[yorksrob]

Lucy Fisher from Times Radio (https://twitter.com/LOS_Fisher?) predicts

which isn't altogether surprising.
MPs have to tell Conservative HQ whether or not they intend to leave or to stand again at the next election by 5 December, so expect a large number of them to announce their plans soon.

Why don't they do the country a favour and stand down now. That would at least be an act of integrity and force the general election that is due.

 

[306024]

Cornwall - George Eustice
Norfolk - Liz Truss
Suffolk - Matt Hancock

Essex - Priti Patel

 

[Tetchytyke]

The Grauniad has published the results of an investigation into the relationship between Baroness (Michelle) Mone, one of more ‘celebrity’ members of the House of Lords, and PPE Medpro, a supplier of PPE during the pandemic.

Trying to unravel the finances of Mone and her husband Doug Barrowman will be almost impossible. They're everything that's bad about the Isle of Man finance sector.

I also don't quite understand how she's able to sit in the Lords when she lives here and all her husband's businesses are based here.

On a more personal note, Michelle Mone is the single most unpleasant person I have ever had the misfortune of dealing with.

 

[JamesT]

Trying to unravel the finances of Mone and her husband Doug Barrowman will be almost impossible. They're everything that's bad about the Isle of Man finance sector.

I also don't quite understand how she's able to sit in the Lords when she lives here and all her husband's businesses are based here.

On a more personal note, Michelle Mone is the single most unpleasant person I have ever had the misfortune of dealing with.

As far as I can tell, the only restrictions on membership are being a UK, Irish, or Commonwealth citizen, over 21, and not a current bankrupt or convicted of high treason. She doesn’t appear to be a particularly frequent visitor to the
Lords, she voted on a couple of days in April this year, before that was October 2021. Her last speech was in 2020.

 

[nw1]

Essex - Priti Patel

Hampshire - Cruella Braverman
Surrey - Kwasi Kwarteng
Dorset - Christopher Chope

 

[Gloster]

In another of those things that a few years ago would have been ridiculous, but are now the new normal, the ludicrously expensive wallpaper put up for Johnson (or Mrs Johnson) has started to peel. For good measure, Truss had it painted over.

Source: The London Economic reporting (or quoting another source) on Hunt speaking at the Spectator magazine parliamentary awards. (Sorry, I can’t do a link.)

 

[Typhoon]

Hampshire - Cruella Braverman
Surrey - Kwasi Kwarteng
Dorset - Christopher Chope

Don't give them ideas! In Kent we'd have the dreadful Natalie Elphicke. who blames the French for everything (and doesn't understand that people are chanting against her).

If Cheshire became unitary, they might get Esther McVey. Shropshire Daniel Kawczynski. Somerset Rees Mogg (I'm surprised that isn't the name of one of his children). There can only be one candidate for Staffordshire, if Johnson has a say. Essex I would suggest Francois as an alternative to Patel. There are certainly enough of them.

The problem with most of those quoted is that they will struggle to get jobs outside parliament so are not likely to stand down and many are still likely to be returned. It is the decent ones who will leave or lose their seats; some (hopefully not too many) invariably will be replaced by clowns from the Momentum faction of Labour.

 

[SuspectUsual]

Somerset Rees Mogg (I'm surprised that isn't the name of one of his children).

It’s one of one of them’s middle names



Edit - Somerset is also his father in law’s first name

 

[nw1]

It’s one of one of them’s middle names

On a similar vein, I wonder if Annunziata "Tory at age five" Rees-Mogg was named after Torre Annunziata, Italy, a town and station on the Sorrento-Naples route.

 

[Typhoon]

In another of those things that a few years ago would have been ridiculous, but are now the new normal, the ludicrously expensive wallpaper put up for Johnson (or Mrs Johnson) has started to peel. For good measure, Truss had it painted over.

So, Truss is PM for forty something days and a priority is to paint over the previous occupants' wallpaper. Sums her up.

Boris Johnson and Liz Truss have launched a challenge to Rishi Sunak’s authority by joining a Tory rebellion backing wind farms to tackle the energy crisis.

Boris Johnson and Liz Truss both signed an amendment to the Government's Levelling Up and Regeneration Bill
In their first major interventions since leaving Downing Street, the two former prime ministers have demanded an end to the ban on new onshore wind farms.

They both signed an amendment to the Government's Levelling Up and Regeneration Bill, just days after Mr Sunak’s government was derailed by a separate Tory revolt on the same legislation.

The bill is designed to speed up housebuilding, which is crucial to Mr Sunak's growth agenda.

The two former prime ministers have had tense relationships with Mr Sunak.

Mr Johnson's supporters view Mr Sunak as having dealt the fatal blow to his premiership by resigning as chancellor.

Ms Truss and Mr Sunak clashed repeatedly during the leadership race.

It is unusual for former leaders to oppose their successors, with Theresa May choosing the issue of partygate to make a rare criticism of Mr Johnson.

Johnson, I can understand. He will make himself a nuisance to whoever is leader of the Conservatives because he (mistakenly) thinks the Great British Public are pining for the three-word slogans, bumbling persona, cos-play, lack of preparation and 'inaccuracies' that bedeviled his premiership. Truss needs to realise what a disaster her time in office was and nothing can disguise her position in the Guiness Book of Records as the shortest serving Prime Minister, she will go down alongside Chamberlain and Lord North as being a disaster in the role. Her opinions count for nothing more than the most junior MP in the house.

From https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/ukne...ebellion-challenge-to-rishi-sunak/ar-AA14wnBZ

It’s one of one of them’s middle names



Edit - Somerset is also his father in law’s first name

Ah, yes. Mr de Chair, a (former) MP for South West Norfolk and resident of Chilham Castle.

 

[Lost property]

Angela Rayner has a few well chosen words and observations with regard to the "generous funding arrangements " and a certain, well for now anyway...lady peer.

Lady Mone is accused and still the Tories won’t come clean about PPE. What are they hiding? | Angela Rayner

Ministers have learned nothing from earlier scandals, says Labour’s deputy leader, Angela Rayner

www.theguardian.com

 

[Acfb]

.........