Slightly shrill pop-up on Transport for Wales's ticket website ...

[Bungaroosh]

Simmer down! Etc. Etc.

"Find out more" leads to this:



A bit redundant and somewhat ridiculous, I would suggest, to pitch this at customers who are in the payment section of their ticketing website ...

 

[Mcr Warrior]

A bit redundant and somewhat ridiculous, I would suggest, to pitch this at customers who are in the payment section of their ticketing website ...

Not necessarily, judging by the number of threads on the "Disputes & Prosecutions" forum from newbies complaining when they've been caught with an expired, or non existent, railcard.

 

[30907]

Not necessarily, judging by the number of threads on the "Disputes & Prosecutions" forum from newbies complaining when they've been caught with an expired, or non existent, railcard.

....and the number of times forum members have complained that there should be a flag-up before you buy!.

 

[skyhigh]

A bit redundant and somewhat ridiculous, I would suggest, to pitch this at customers who are in the payment section of their ticketing website ...

I'd go further. I think that first message could start with "You must have your in date railcard with you...". The second message again warns about the consequences of deliberate fare evasion - which includes people who short fare, doughnut, buy railcard discounted/child tickets when not entitled etc and therefore will be in the payment section. I think it's a perfectly reasonable place to have a warning.

....and the number of times forum members have complained that there should be a flag-up before you buy!.

Yep, there's been several complaints on here of that. Now a retailer gives a warning and there's a complaint!

 

[AngusH]

I actually think this is a very good thing.

I want everything made absolutely clear without assumptions being made as to what I know.

Maybe I do know all the details, but then maybe I've forgotten or never learned it.


Absolutely correct to include such a warning in my view and 100% the right thing to do.

Well done TFW.

 

[Adam Williams]

Seemingly a controversial take, but I agree with @Bungaroosh

It's one thing to have a simple reminder "You must have your railcard with you whilst travelling" and then there's the warning TfW have settled on, which to me comes across as quite fear-mongering and also communicates the worst-case possible scenario (which is misleading). In reality, if you own a railcard and simply forget it on one occasion, you'll be given the opportunity to buy a new ticket and get it refunded without any additional costs.

Adding warnings everywhere increases the cognitive load of the user interface, annoys experienced users and ultimately coneys things that should be pretty obvious and can be mentioned elsewhere in the flow. It also comes across as unfriendly and off-putting to immediately discuss the possibility of prosecution when it comes to something that could be a simple mistake.

If warnings that say the bloody obvious are a good thing, why don't we add them to the date pickers too?



Or hell, what about the passenger picker?



What about the station picker? I think it's possible some customers will deliberately try to doughnut or neglect to purchase tickets to cover their whole journey. Maybe we should add a warning there too?

....and the number of times forum members have complained that there should be a flag-up before you buy!

I think a great number of fare evaders who get caught will try and find any excuse to blame someone else rather than accept responsibility for their own actions...

 

[Starmill]

A bit redundant and somewhat ridiculous, I would suggest, to pitch this at customers who are in the payment section of their ticketing website ...

I'm not sure that's the way they see it. It's common for them to charge people for new tickets or threaten prosecution even when they've already bought a ticket, if they may have grounds to under the Byelaws.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Nov 2022 ==

I think that first message could start with "You must have your in date railcard with you...". The second message again warns about the consequences of deliberate fare evasion - which includes people who short fare, doughnut, buy railcard discounted/child tickets when not entitled etc and therefore will be in the payment section. I think it's a perfectly reasonable place to have a warning.

So you don't think that something which says "Please make sure that you are able to show this railcard with your ticket when you travel." would be more effective as a reminder than the wording choice in place there? Or to incorporate your example the warning may say: "Please check that your railcard is in date, and remember to show it with your ticket on the train. Thank you.". You don't think those might be more useful to the customer as well as more appealing?

 

[Watershed]

If warnings that say the bloody obvious are a good thing, why don't we add them to the date pickers too?

Or hell, what about the passenger picker?

What about the station picker? I think it's possible some customers will deliberately try to doughnut or neglect to purchase tickets to cover their whole journey. Maybe we should add a warning there too?

Brilliant!

Somehow I'm reminded of this:

(Extract from TV show, Parks & Rec, shows a "South American" politician describing all the minor misdeeds that can land one in jail in his country)

In all seriousness, I think it's perhaps reasonable to include some sort of warning when buying a ticket. But the TOCs' usual approach of going straight to citing imaginary £1000 fines is not particularly helpful.

 

[Adam Williams]

Somehow I'm reminded of this:

It was on my mind when doing the LNER one!

 

[Snow1964]

In all seriousness, I think it's perhaps reasonable to include some sort of warning when buying a ticket. But the TOCs' usual approach of going straight to citing imaginary £1000 fines is not particularly helpful.

Yes and warning should only appear if railcard option is selected.

Maybe more useful if the warning started with…. Please remember to carry railcard, and check it has not expired.

I agree citing the fine before polite reminder is customer unfriendly

Although out of scope of this thread, I do wonder if railcards should be abandoned and just adjust the off peak fares to the railcard prices. Probably not that high a percentage of tickets sold without a discount anyway.

 

[XAM2175]

If warnings that say the bloody obvious are a good thing, why don't we add them to the date pickers too?

Splendid work sir

 

[Bungaroosh]

Seemingly a controversial take, but I agree with @Bungaroosh

It's one thing to have a simple reminder "You must have your railcard with you whilst travelling" and then there's the warning TfW have settled on, which to me comes across as quite fear-mongering and also communicates the worst-case possible scenario (which is misleading). In reality, if you own a railcard and simply forget it on one occasion, you'll be given the opportunity to buy a new ticket and get it refunded without any additional costs.

Adding warnings everywhere increases the cognitive load of the user interface, annoys experienced users and ultimately coneys things that should be pretty obvious and can be mentioned elsewhere in the flow. It also comes across as unfriendly and off-putting to immediately discuss the possibility of prosecution when it comes to something that could be a simple mistake.

If warnings that say the bloody obvious are a good thing, why don't we add them to the date pickers too?

View attachment 123649

Or hell, what about the passenger picker?

View attachment 123650

What about the station picker? I think it's possible some customers will deliberately try to doughnut or neglect to purchase tickets to cover their whole journey. Maybe we should add a warning there too?

View attachment 123651



I think a great number of fare evaders who get caught will try and find any excuse to blame someone else rather than accept responsibility for their own actions...

Fantastic! Thanks very much for the laughs!

 

[Egg Centric]

No one other than the OP pick up on the "etc etc" bit? That smacks of a bit of malicious compliance by whoever was asked to put it there.

 

[py_megapixel]

No one other than the OP pick up on the "etc etc" bit? That smacks of a bit of malicious compliance by whoever was asked to put it there.

I can think of two reasons this might have occurred:

The intended text could have been too long to fit there and was automatically truncated (though usually an ellipsis rather than "etc etc" would be the normal thing to put in that case).
Or (I think more likely) someone in the revenue protection department emailed whoever is responsible for the website asking them to add the warning, without typing out the whole thing because they expected it to be completed with some standard phrasing about Railcards, but the recipient didn't do this.

 

[Egg Centric]

I can think of two reasons this might have occurred:

The intended text could have been too long to fit there and was automatically truncated (though usually an ellipsis rather than "etc etc" would be the normal thing to put in that case).
Or (I think more likely) someone in the revenue protection department emailed whoever is responsible for the website asking them to add the warning, without typing out the whole thing because they expected it to be completed with some standard phrasing about Railcards, but the recipient didn't do this.

I'm sure it's the second explanation. The question is why the "etc etc" wasn't replaced with the correct text. It's either incompetence or unprovable malevolence disguised as incompetence and in my experience, the latter is (marginally) more likely.