Trivia : Bus services that don't accept concession cards

[Simon75]

Are there many services that don't accept concession cards (UK wide), and why don't they?

 

[duncombec]

Are there many services that don't accept concession cards (UK wide), and why they don't?

The criteria for not accepting concessionary passes are very well laid out in the documentation for ENCTS, and I presume the Scottish and Welsh systems too.

Without being able to reach for a link at the moment, these include things like sightseeing tours, express services and other services where there is a special amenity element.

 

[busestrains]

Are there many services that don't accept concession cards (UK wide), and why don't they?

I believe that the hotel routes at the various airports are excluded:

BM Coaches (Gatwick): GH1

Bus 4 Us (Stansted): HolidayInnShuttle NovotelShuttle PremierInnShuttle

Diamond Bus South East (Heathrow): H2A H2B H2C H2D H5A H5B H5C H5D H5E

United Minibuses (Gatwick): I7 I8

These are all registered public bus routes but i believe they are excluded from the ENCTS scheme.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

The criteria for not accepting concessionary passes are very well laid out in the documentation for ENCTS, and I presume the Scottish and Welsh systems too.

Without being able to reach for a link at the moment, these include things like sightseeing tours, express services and other services where there is a special amenity element.

Here you go https://www.gov.uk/government/publi...-england-national-concessionary-travel-scheme

Eligible services​

1.9 The ENCTS applies on eligible local bus services as defined by the ‘Travel concessions (eligible services) order 2002 as amended by the ‘Travel concessions (eligible services) (amendment) order 2009’.

1.10 The 2009 amendment order explicitly excludes the following types of services from the mandatory concession, these are:

• services on which the majority of seats can be reserved in advance of travel (such as coaches)
• services that are intended to run for a period of less than 6 consecutive weeks
• services operated primarily for the purposes of tourism or because of the historical interest of the vehicle
• bus substitution (rail replacement) services
• services where the fare charged by the operator has a special amenity element

1.11 The changes introduced by the 2009 amendment order explicitly exclude certain types of service that are outside of the spirit of the mandatory national concession, thus reducing the potential for any confusion over whether a service is eligible. Local authorities remain able to offer concessionary travel on any service affected by the changes on a discretionary basis.

 

[Mwanesh]

The Red Arrow was one. There was a furore about it a few years ago when pass use was banned. Don't know the present arrangement have not been around that area in a while

 

[Busaholic]

The Red Arrow was one. There was a furore about it a few years ago when pass use was banned. Don't know the present arrangement have not been around that area in a while

Which Red Arrow?

 

[Andyh82]

Which Red Arrow?

Derby to Nottingham run by Trent Barton

 

[Busaholic]

Derby to Nottingham run by Trent Barton

Ah, wasn't that the one where you could use them in one direction and not the other, because the two local authorities concerned had different interpretation of the regulations? A shame the matter was never tested in court.

 

[SSmith2009]

The Red Arrow was one. There was a furore about it a few years ago when pass use was banned. Don't know the present arrangement have not been around that area in a while

believe its now both ways they don't accept them meaning concessionary holders have to use i4 or indigo between Nottingham and Derby

 

[2192]

Or pay! Zigzag is cheapest and I think it's valid on Red Arrow after 0900.

 

[Ken H]

Some Dalesbus services are deemed to be 'scenic' and not valid for ENCTS. But there is a £3 concession all day pass for ENCTS holders (normal fare £10)
These are summer Sunday services. Not all Dalesbus services dont accept ENCTS. Confused? So am I

 

[markymark2000]

Stagecoach Merseyside, Cheshire and South Lancs (MCSL) do not accept passes on their X8 (Chorley - Preston - Windermere - Keswick) or X10 (Kirkby - Liverpool - Rhyl) services due to these being seasonal express routes. I think come under the special amenity thing. Bit daft for some parts of these routes whereby if passes were accepted in some parts, it may help patronage. X10 Kirkby to Eastham and X8 Chorley to Preston and Windermere to Keswick. Just makes sense to offer more journey opportunities in these areas. Get some extra local passengers. Why not, easy extra money in these areas.


Many Park and Rides don't permit concessionary passes as well as some Airport buses (like Bristol airport generally doesn't permit conc passes)

 

[bussnapperwm]

There's a couple of routes that wouldn't accept ENCTS by virtue of them being pre 0930 only routes (such as the Arriva Shrewsbury 524)

 

[Tetchytyke]

These are summer Sunday services. Not all Dalesbus services dont accept ENCTS. Confused? So am I

If I remember rightly, for a while the general position was that ENCTS was accepted on the year-round services but not the summer-only ones, but it now seems to be accepted throughout.

 

[Deerfold]

Or pay! Zigzag is cheapest and I think it's valid on Red Arrow after 0900.

It is - Zigzag is not available on any bus until 0900. It's £7 for a day. Zigzag plus for another £3.50 is valid at any time (and adds validity for Skylink Derby and Kinchbus's Loughborough network). (Better value tickets for more than 1 person are available).

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 4 Nov 2022 ==

If I remember rightly, for a while the general position was that ENCTS was accepted on the year-round services but not the summer-only ones, but it now seems to be accepted throughout.

They're not accepted on (at least) the 830 Preston -Ingleton - Richmond, 831 Middlesborough to Kirby Lonsdale, 822 Pocklington to Grassington, 881 Malham to Grassington. All are Summer-only routes.

 

[Ken H]

If I remember rightly, for a while the general position was that ENCTS was accepted on the year-round services but not the summer-only ones, but it now seems to be accepted throughout.

This from the summer booklet I got from wayback machine

Elderly and Disabled Concessionary Bus Fares​

Senior citizens and disabled people from throughout England are entitled to free local off-peak bus travel. In order to benefit from this entitlement an English National Concessionary Pass is needed - details of how to apply for a pass are available from your local council.

Concessionary free travel is available from 0930 onwards on Mondays to Fridays (from 0900 for North Yorkshire residents), and at anytime on Saturdays, Sundays and Bank Holidays.

Passes are however not validfor free travel on some demand responsive services nor on the following Sunday and Bank Holiday DalesBus services:

• DalesBus 822: Pocklington - York - Ripon - Fountains Abbey - Pateley Bridge - Grassington
• Eastern DalesBus 825: York - Harrogate - Brimham Rocks - Fountains Abbey - Masham - Leyburn - Richmond
• Northern DalesBus 830: Preston - Lancaster - Ribblehead - Hawes - Richmond
• Northern DalesBus 831: Middlesbrough - Richmond - Hawes - Kirkby Lonsdale (except in the Tees Valley area)
• Malham DalesBus 881: Lancaster - Settle - Malham

On these DalesBus services pass holders travel for a maximum fare of £3 single or £5 for a day ticket.

Passes may also be used for free travel on certain journeys on Mondays to Fridays before 0900 - including the 0720 service 24 bus from Pateley Bridge to Harrogate, the 0830 service 30 bus from Reeth to Richmond and Little White Bus services. For details contact North Yorkshire County Council or the bus operator.

 

[Man of Kent]

Stagecoach Merseyside, Cheshire and South Lancs (MCSL) do not accept passes on their X8 (Chorley - Preston - Windermere - Keswick) or X10 (Kirkby - Liverpool - Rhyl) services due to these being seasonal express routes. I think come under the special amenity thing. Bit daft for some parts of these routes whereby if passes were accepted in some parts, it may help patronage. X10 Kirkby to Eastham and X8 Chorley to Preston and Windermere to Keswick. Just makes sense to offer more journey opportunities in these areas. Get some extra local passengers. Why not, easy extra money in these areas

It is simpler to present to passengers a route as either accepting or not accepting concessionary passes. And avoids the confusion, as with the Red Arrow example quoted earlier, if the rules are different in each authority area. Plus there's the added bonus from the point of view of a cash-strapped local authority responsible for paying the reimbursement, of not shelling out more than they have to.

 

[TUC]

Stagecoach Merseyside, Cheshire and South Lancs (MCSL) do not accept passes on their X8 (Chorley - Preston - Windermere - Keswick) or X10 (Kirkby - Liverpool - Rhyl) services due to these being seasonal express routes. I think come under the special amenity thing. Bit daft for some parts of these routes whereby if passes were accepted in some parts, it may help patronage. X10 Kirkby to Eastham and X8 Chorley to Preston and Windermere to Keswick. Just makes sense to offer more journey opportunities in these areas. Get some extra local passengers. Why not, easy extra money in these areas.


Many Park and Rides don't permit concessionary passes as well as some Airport buses (like Bristol airport generally doesn't permit conc passes)

I do think that is particularly daft, given that most Park and Rides are set up by local authorities to seek reduce traffic in city centres. How is it in their interests for concessionary pass holders to be disincentivised from using them?

 

[pjnathanail]

Chelmsford Park and Ride does not allow free travel except for Essex County Council issued Mobility ENCTS holders after 09:00 Monday to Friday and any time at weekends. Howeve all ENCTS holders qualify for a reduced day ticket price of £1.50 at all times.

 

[Towers]

Stagecoach Merseyside, Cheshire and South Lancs (MCSL) do not accept passes on their X8 (Chorley - Preston - Windermere - Keswick) or X10 (Kirkby - Liverpool - Rhyl) services due to these being seasonal express routes. I think come under the special amenity thing. Bit daft for some parts of these routes whereby if passes were accepted in some parts, it may help patronage. X10 Kirkby to Eastham and X8 Chorley to Preston and Windermere to Keswick. Just makes sense to offer more journey opportunities in these areas. Get some extra local passengers. Why not, easy extra money in these areas.


Many Park and Rides don't permit concessionary passes as well as some Airport buses (like Bristol airport generally doesn't permit conc passes)

Presumably because the operator would prefer that they were conveying fare paying customers, rather than being swamped with passholders on a free day out every morning! Those routes sound scenic and vaguely touristy. Stagecoach are a very shrewd outfit so I'm sure they haven't been excluded by oversight.

 

[Deerfold]

Bit daft for some parts of these routes whereby if passes were accepted in some parts, it may help patronage. X10 Kirkby to Eastham and X8 Chorley to Preston and Windermere to Keswick. Just makes sense to offer more journey opportunities in these areas. Get some extra local passengers. Why not, easy extra money in these areas.


Many Park and Rides don't permit concessionary passes as well as some Airport buses (like Bristol airport generally doesn't permit conc passes)

Looks like they used to accept passes between Chorley and Preston. Perhaps it was more trouble than it was worth for drivers.

NoWcard: Express Bus Services in Cumbria and Lancashire

NowCard

www.nowcard.org

English National Concession Bus Passes ARE Accepted On The Following Services (for off peak travel).

...
X8 - Chorley & Preston - Central Lakes (for journeys in Preston and Chorley only) commences 23 March 2013

 

[Martin1988]

Am I right in thinking Greenline no longer accept them on the 757 service between Luton and London?