NR carry out Sth Wales electric study

[merlodlliw]

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/w...ation-programme-91466-28145353/#ixzz1Db6EdRZE

this may interest a few Huntos

Bob the Gog

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Hmmm... the top brass have been reading this forum and pinching our ideas again!

 

[WatcherZero]

Whose sponsoring the NR study? WAG or Cardiff?

 

[Clip]

Whose sponsoring the NR study? WAG or Cardiff?

Jesus

 

[merlodlliw]

Jesus

The current Rail Minister walks on water, somebody must have a good pile of dosh if its NR, probably the funding is European via WEFO.

Bob

 

[Solaris]

It is likley that NR would wish to electrify when the current rolling stock expires in eight or nine years. The assumption would be that electric vehicles from elsewhere in the UK would cascade to the valley network...... but is this the best strategy for the valleys network. Given its relative compactness and regular stops, perhasp a pure tram, tram-train or Newcastle Metro type rolling stock strategy would be more appropriate. This would allow light rail extensions to new locations in and around Cardiff as set out in this report www.cardiffbusinesspartnership.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/iwa_metroreport.pdf

 

[Greenback]

It is likley that NR would wish to electrify when the current rolling stock expires in eight or nine years. The assumption would be that electric vehicles from elsewhere in the UK would cascade to the valley network...... but is this the best strategy for the valleys network. Given its relative compactness and regular stops, perhasp a pure tram, tram-train or Newcastle Metro type rolling stock strategy would be more appropriate. This would allow light rail extensions to new locations in and around Cardiff as set out in this report www.cardiffbusinesspartnership.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/iwa_metroreport.pdf

Perhaps the conversion to tram or light rail might be worth the loss of through ticketing, 'proper' trains with toilets, and the disruption caused by the conversion and the building of sectiosn of street running.

On the other hand, perhaps there should just be electrification of what is there now!

 

[Gareth Marston]

Perhaps the conversion to tram or light rail might be worth the loss of through ticketing, 'proper' trains with toilets, and the disruption caused by the conversion and the building of sectiosn of street running.

On the other hand, perhaps there should just be electrification of what is there now!

Heavy rail electrification is needed with the exception of the Cardiff Bay branch which should go light rail and be extended.

 

[swt_passenger]

Electrification of the Valley lines was covered in the NR Electrification RUS published in 2009, but it is only a tier 5 priority on a scale of 1-6.

No news here then...

 

[Greenback]

Heavy rail electrification is needed with the exception of the Cardiff Bay branch which should go light rail and be extended.

Yes, you are right Gareth, the Bay branch is the only line I would say could be converted and extended. The others are non starters in my opinion.

 

[anthony263]

Maybe the coryton branch could be extended to radyr then we could have a city circular route. also maybe this could use high fllor trams like those working on the metrolink in manchester.

If the Severn Tunnel Jct - Cheltenham route is wired and the line to swansea is wired then we could have a hourly Swansea - Cardiff - Gloucester - Cheltenham service providing a 20 minutes frequency between Swansea & Cardiff .


Maesteg could then have a hourly service to Ebbw Vale with the current services leaving Masteg at 15 minutes past the hour either running as a shuttle to Bridgend or if a path can be found crosover at Bridgend and work via the vale to Cardiff & Aberdare.

 

[Greenback]

The Coryton branch used to be longer and conencted up to another line somewhere, but off the top of my head I cannot remember where!

 

[Pacerpilot]

The Coryton branch used to be longer and conencted up to another line somewhere, but off the top of my head I cannot remember where!

It joined the Radyr - Pontypridd Section, north of Radyr.

 

[Greenback]

Thanks a lot, my memory is fading, I'm getting old!

 

[Pacerpilot]

No worries. The alignment can be seen clearly on Google earth, and its not been built on/encroached. It would need a Southern Chord line to make it a circular route but its not beyond the realms of possibility. It was Double tracked along the Coryton branch too.

 

[anthony263]

I think it might be a good idea to use tram style vehicles on such a circular service since a lot of times the services along the city line a quiet apart from when there are cardiff city matches & peak hours etc. Then again would it be allowed to run tram-train's especially since there will be running along with other rail vehicles and heavy freight trains if you consider the Cwmbargoed coal trains

 

[Greenback]

I disagree. I see the provision of a tram style vehicle a retrograde step when compared with 'real' trains. The only reason for having a tram would be to increase capacity (through having fewer seats and more standing room), and that doesn't seem to be an issue on the Coryton line.

As an aside, I find the bendy nuses in Swansea, with their hard plastic seats and increased standing room, to be far less comfortable than traditional buses, even though they can carrty more people!

 

[Nym]

Given its relative compactness and regular stops, perhasp a pure tram, tram-train or Newcastle Metro type rolling stock strategy would be more appropriate. This would allow light rail extensions to new locations in and around Cardiff as set out in this report

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! </dramatic>

Really, it's one of the biggest mistakes thats happened in Manchester, yes some of the Metrolink lines are good, such as Eccles, Droylsden, East Didsbury (although the core could be heavy and light combined 4 track) etc. But the Bury and Altringham routes are now struggling with only having 2 carrage trams when it used to have 3 or 4 carrage electric trains, and through ticketing. Even the E dids line is being screwed up, the Station in E Disburys is a good 5min walk from the Rail Staion.

Just electrify the valley lines, if thats the idea, or if it's easyer to electrify somwhere else and release diesel stock to work it, then do that...

 

[anthony263]

The FTR's used in Swansea are ok although i think trams would have been better. That said the service is well used at peak times. Only downside is that they are not used on sundays which i think would be a better idea than using conventional buses

 

[paul1609]

The politics aside 25 kv electrification of the valley lines would be very inefficient , something along the lines of the T&W Metro would be the ideal engineering solution.

 

[Greenback]

The FTR's used in Swansea are ok although i think trams would have been better. That said the service is well used at peak times. Only downside is that they are not used on sundays which i think would be a better idea than using conventional buses

Yes, they are Ok but when compared to the comfort of the buses I used to catch when I lived on the route they are not so good, in my opinion.

I would have preferred trams, but the interior is very tram like and that is my point. Although Pacers are disliked, I would prefer to travel on one of them than a tram. At least the trains have toilets and upholstered seats - from a passenger comfort point of view they are far better than most trams I've been on!

 

[WatcherZero]

People never seem to remember that the Tyne Metro rolling stock are actually German trams with a heavy rail bodyshell produced by Metro-Cammel bolted on top. That is why its known as a Light Rail system.

This is the same vehicle as the Tyne and Wear Metro stock with a different bodyshell:

 

[Rhydgaled]

If the Severn Tunnel Jct - Cheltenham route is wired and the line to swansea is wired then we could have a hourly Swansea - Cardiff - Gloucester - Cheltenham service providing a 20 minutes frequency between Swansea & Cardiff .

Maesteg could then have a hourly service to Ebbw Vale with the current services leaving Masteg at 15 minutes past the hour either running as a shuttle to Bridgend or if a path can be found crosover at Bridgend and work via the vale to Cardiff & Aberdare.

My thoughts exactly, the Swansea-Cheltenham would be an all stations stopper (taking over Swanline services and giving those stations a doubling of service frequency) and Maesteg's service would go to Ebbw Vale instead of Cheltenham. These would give a half-hourly service for the Minor Intermediate Stations (MISes) between Bridgend and Cardiff. If Maesteg is to go half-hourly I would, as you have, suggest the other service each hour go via the Vale of Glamorgan line as an extension of the Merthyr service (though I would eventually also extend that, once an hour, over a new line to Brecon). North-south premier express trains would also go up the Brecon line, but that's another story.