Semi-fast Manchester to Sheffield

[py_megapixel]

I think this would be a welcome addition as it's a good park and ride station. Is there space to fit in the pathing though? It's busy bit of line. The six-car unit fits the platforms as well.

Yes, I've been wondering for a while whether a semi-fast service from Manchester to Sheffield via Stockport (operated by Northern) would make sense once the capacity upgrade works at Dore are completed. I would probably have it stopping in Stockport, (possibly Davenport and Woodsmoor if it were replacing the existing Hazel Grove stopper), Hazel Grove, Chinley (for connections to the smaller Hope Valley stations) and maybe Dore if the timings fit. I have no idea whether this would be at all feasible, but it would certainly be handy for people from the Stockport area or the Buxton line wishing to travel in that direction, who then wouldn't have to double back via Manchester.

Also, from December, both Manchester-Sheffield services will be running to Liverpool, and an extra service would mean that disruption towards Liverpool wouldn't completely knock out the service to Sheffield.

 

[Pacco]

This would be good, definitely quicker than the alternative via Piccadilly and Marple for lots of South Manchester and Cheshire passengers.

But dropping the Hazel Grove stopper would mean losing a Buxton service, which is only once an hour outside the peak, so unless there is a Buxton shuttle from Hazel Grove I don't think that is an upgrade.

If there is an extra path for a once per hour service from Piccadilly, via Stockport (skipping Davenport & Stockport as both of those are within walking distance of Spt and Haz anyway) and ten over to Chinley and onwards.

That does give Marple another (admittedly circuitous) link to Stockport as well, maybe?

 

[py_megapixel]

But dropping the Hazel Grove stopper would mean losing a Buxton service, which is only once an hour outside the peak, so unless there is a Buxton shuttle from Hazel Grove I don't think that is an upgrade.

If there is an extra path for a once per hour service from Piccadilly, via Stockport (skipping Davenport & Stockport as both of those are within walking distance of Spt and Haz anyway) and ten over to Chinley and onwards.

It wouldn't - the service pattern on that line (from December) is 1tph to Buxton and 1tph terminating at HAZ. I am proposing, assuming no extra path is available between Manchester and Edgeley, extending the HAZ terminator through to Sheffield (possibly cutting out the Davenport and Woodsmoor stops) and whilst leaving the Buxton service untouched.

It's worth noting that in theory, a path currently exists for an extra 1tph through to Buxton, though the timetable change may be making use of that capacity for other purposes - I'm not sure. I'm also not sure whether any of this would line up with a path through the Hope Valley.

That does give Marple another (admittedly circuitous) link to Stockport as well, maybe?

I can't imagine rail will ever really be the best mode to serve journeys between Stockport and Marple (unless perhaps the line via Denton gets a proper service). The layout of the lines just doesn't serve that journey well unfortunately.

It would take approximately 15 minutes from Stockport to Chinley, plus a minimum 5 minute connection in Chinley, plus 10-15 minutes Chinley to Marple, so the absolute best case scenario, assuming the connections line up perfectly, is probably 30 minutes Stockport-Marple. As it stands, it's only about 25 minutes on the bus, which is also able to run more frequently.

 

[D365]

Agree that a 1tph semi-fast would be ideal. Only problem with extending the HAZ terminator is that it would be converting an electric service to diesel...

 

[Elecman]

Agree that a 1tph semi-fast would be ideal. Only problem with extending the HAZ terminator is that it would be converting an electric service to diesel...

Or a Bimode

 

[Kite159]

Agree that a 1tph semi-fast would be ideal. Only problem with extending the HAZ terminator is that it would be converting an electric service to diesel...

Although isn't the Hazel Grove terminators in the new timetable going to be diesels as they interwork with the Buxton trains at Piccadilly?

The wires to Hazel Grove once more returning to limited use.

 

[D365]

Or a Bimode

A 769 down the Hope Valley would be… entertaining.

 

[Pacco]

Although isn't the Hazel Grove terminators in the new timetable going to be diesels as they interwork with the Buxton trains at Piccadilly?

The wires to Hazel Grove once more returning to limited use.

Yeah, anything that removes electric traction is a retrograde step.

It's worth noting that in theory, a path currently exists for an extra 1tph through to Buxton, though the timetable change may be making use of that capacity for other purposes - I'm not sure. I'm also not sure whether any of this would line up with a path through the Hope Valley.

That would be the hope, if you excuse the pun.

 

[py_megapixel]

Although isn't the Hazel Grove terminators in the new timetable going to be diesels as they interwork with the Buxton trains at Piccadilly?

The wires to Hazel Grove once more returning to limited use.

If true, that'll be an awful downgrade. From pretty much guaranteed 6-car 331 to whatever clapped-out diesel rubbish Northern fancies churning out.

It also begs the question: if they're making it diesel anyway, why not just run the second Buxton service?

Although I suppose for the purposes of this thread, it's good, as it provides an ideal candidate for extension to Sheffield...

 

[Kite159]

If true, that'll be an awful downgrade. From pretty much guaranteed 6-car 331 to whatever clapped-out diesel rubbish Northern fancies churning out.

It also begs the question: if they're making it diesel anyway, why not just run the second Buxton service?

Although I suppose for the purposes of this thread, it's good, as it provides an ideal candidate for extension to Sheffield...

Agreed, after Hazel Grove calling at Chinley, Dore & Sheffield. Only to take the pressure from the local stopper on the times when EMR/TPE don't run.

 

[Cheshire Scot]

Circa 20 years ago I was an occasional (two or three times per month) commuter from Poynton to Doncaster.

On the return journey a good number of people alighted at Stockport but what I noted was quite a few then made their way over to platforms 1 / 2 to continue their journey home to e.g Cheadle Hulme (I began to recognise the regulars and I recall one regular travelling there) and other stations towards Wilmslow and Macclesfield, and quite possibly back towards Hazel Grove too.

A Hazel Grove call would have been very convenient to me and no doubt at least some of these others with the added bonus of good car parking at Hazel Grove - although oversubscribed at that time but since increased in capacity and suffering reduced useage post covid.

I firmly believe a Hazel Grove to Sheffield service would attract custom, Chinley could benefit from faster connections to/from both Manchester and Shefield whilst certainly pre covid there was a good volume of commuting from Dore to Manchester and extra train to Sheffield would be a plus for Dore too.

I recall too some school and college traffic from Chinley to Woodsmoor, Davenport, Stockport, the first two stations by changing off the East Mids which made a morning call at Hazel Grove. I assume they returned home via Stockport although in pre TPE days there was an evening peak Cleethorpes which called at Hazel Grove (and Chinley).