Liz Truss and the Conservative Party.

[Perthsaint]

What nonsense? It is a documented fact that large corporations and wealthy individuals indulge in tax avoidance. Using the example of Amazon above, they paid an effective tax rate of 0.37% on their UK sales in 2020.

Uncovered: How much tax Amazon pays in the UK

Jeff Bezos is the world's richest man and operates one of its largest companies, but both are constantly under attacked for their tax dealings.

www.walesonline.co.uk

Tax avoidance is perfectly legal. If you have evidence that companies or individuals have paid less tax than they are legally obliged to have you taken it to the police and HMRC?

 

[najaB]

Tax avoidance is perfectly legal. If you have evidence that companies or individuals have paid less tax than they are legally obliged to have you taken it to the police and HMRC?

Where did I make any such claim?

 

[Perthsaint]

Where did I make any such claim?

I didn't say that you did.

 

[Yew]

Please cease this nonsense.

When you start earning that much, employing a wealth manager or accountant to ensure you are conducting your affairs in a tax-efficient manner is highly cost effective.

Whilst I might not go as far as saying "very few" people don't do it, it's certainly a common practice.

 

[brad465]

Tax avoidance is perfectly legal. If you have evidence that companies or individuals have paid less tax than they are legally obliged to have you taken it to the police and HMRC?

Just because something is legal doesn't mean it's morally okay. With wealth comes huge power potential, and there are non-doms in the UK press ownership and other circles around the world who will use their power to stop Governments closing the relevant tax loopholes. Remember what Jimmy Carr faced when he was uncovered, and he was one of the minor tax avoiders, where it could be said he was targeted much harder to distract from the more serious offenders being exposed at the time (not that Carr should have been let off lightly).

 

[Perthsaint]

Just because something is legal doesn't mean it's morally okay.

Sure. But the tax system operates according to the law of the land. If you don't like it get the law changed.

 

[Yew]

Sure. But the tax system operates according to the law of the land. If you don't like it get the law changed.

That's our plan.

 

[najaB]

Sure. But the tax system operates according to the law of the land. If you don't like it get the law changed.

Glad to see you've finally caught up.

 

[Perthsaint]

That's our plan.

One of the less remarked-upon points in Kwarteng's "fiscal event" was the abolition of the Office of Tax Simplification.

Glad to see you've finally caught up.

Likewise.

 

[Nicholas Lewis]

If Truss and Kwarteng are attempting to buy the next election they've not done enough to woo the middle classes with these tax cuts but doesn't mean they won't vote for them. Labour will want to show it can deal with the NHS and other failing public services but that will need more taxation and however laudable restoring the 45% rate is if they get back it won't raise anywhere enough so they will have to push up tax and NI rates as borrowing won't be an option. The Tories will then attack them over this and the middle ground will be divided. Labours big risk here is to think this is in the bag and without working with other parties they risk allowing Truss back in.

 

[brad465]

With Asian markets open, the £ is falling again against the Dollar, Euro and Yen, albeit not by much for the first 2 as the more significant markets haven't opened yet (it's down over 1% against the Yen as Japan's market is open). But this does suggests further falls tomorrow without further remarks/interventions in the other direction. If it goes below £1:$1.06, this will be a record low.

 

[YorkshireBear]

With Asian markets open, the £ is falling again against the Dollar, Euro and Yen, albeit not by much for the first 2 as the more significant markets haven't opened yet (it's down over 1% against the Yen as Japan's market is open). But this does suggests further falls tomorrow without further remarks/interventions in the other direction. If it goes below £1:$1.06, this will be a record low.

Record low achieved.... Good start for them.

 

[DelayRepay]

Britain faces a simple and inescapable choice - stability and strong Government with me, or chaos with Ed Miliband
David Cameron, May 2015

If this is stable and strong, I would hate to see what chaos looks like!

 

[birchesgreen]

Quite extraordinary how the wheels have come off this new regime so quickly.

 

[Perthsaint]

Quite extraordinary how the wheels have come off this new regime so quickly.

Yet how predictable.

 

[philosopher]

Record low achieved.... Good start for them.

Britain takes a pounding! I’ll get my coat.

 

[birchesgreen]

Yet how predictable.

Well yes but i thought they'd at least get to October before the first crisis

 

[nlogax]

So glad I'm back in the US this week, where my money is worth diddly squat. Happy memories of $2 to the pound in the long hot summer of 2008 which now feels like multiple lifetimes ago.

Someone want to explain to me why the government and this new PM in particular are so absolutely desperate to double down on such **** decisions?

 

[DelayRepay]

Someone want to explain to me why the government and this new PM in particular are so absolutely desperate to double down on such **** decisions?

Some suggest it's to help their mates make lots of money by shorting the Pound.

It could be that or it could just be incompetence.

 

[birchesgreen]

A rather large flaw in the British political system has been revealed, psychopaths without a mandate are now intent in destroying the economy and there doesn't seem to be anything anyone can do about it. Which is quite annoying.

They certainly are going to level Britain thats for sure.

 

[DarloRich]

Imagine, if you will, the press hysteria if the pound was crashing to record lows against the dollar under a labour government. Compare that with the current reporting. I am starting to think we might have an issue with the media in this country!

 

[DelayRepay]

Imagine, if you will, the press hysteria if the pound was crashing to record lows against the dollar under a labour government. Compare that with the current reporting. I am starting to think we might have an issue with the media in this country!

Indeed. Whilst I am no fan of Corbyn, it makes the suggestions that appeared in the Murdoch owned press, that electing him as Prime Minister would cause a run on the Pound, look rather, erm, odd.

 

[Typhoon]

What has surprised me is not the number of posts on here that reckon the budget was a bad move, but the number of financial professionals, including ones that you would expect to be sympathetic to the Conservative cause, who are concerned.

Peter Escho, co-founder of investment firm Wealthi, said: "All currencies are getting sold off against the US dollar, so there is a large element of US dollar strength."

Trading volumes in Asia have also been low which can make movements in currency trading appear more pronounced.

But Mr Escho said: "But with the pound, it has really been exacerbated by news that the new government will be cutting taxes, which is inflationary.

"Add to that recent energy subsidies and news that the Bank of England might need to have an emergency rate-hike meeting, this all results in a sense of panic," he added.

Some investors think the Bank of England will be forced to take emergency action to halt the pound's slide.

"To stop the bleeding even temporarily, the Bank of England may well enter 'whatever it takes' territory to bring inflation down. An emergency meeting rate hike could happen as soon as this week to regain credibility in the market. We could even see a hike today," Stephen Innes, managing partner at SPI Asset Management told the BBC.

The latter quote is the sort of prediction that would have been made had Corbyn been elected PM. Inflation rising will just push mortgage rates up, so reducing the benefits of the stamp duty cut and making the cost-of-living crisis even more difficult for those who are just about getting by. It could be that economics has changed significantly since I last studied it half a century ago. it may have but not that much.

Quote from https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63030208

Still, there will be high-fives in the Johnson household!

Britain faces a simple and inescapable choice - stability and strong Government with me, or chaos with Ed Miliband
David Cameron, May 2015

If this is stable and strong, I would hate to see what chaos looks like!

Unfortunately, Trussconomics is a world away from Osborne's 'Fix the roof while the sun is shining', it seems rather closer to 'It's pi$$ing down, time to take the tiles off."

 

[brad465]

Some suggest it's to help their mates make lots of money by shorting the Pound.

It could be that or it could just be incompetence.

The Sunday Times was reporting alleged insider trading on this, so yes I'd say it's the former, although the latter does also exist to an extent.

 

[Typhoon]

The Sunday Times was reporting alleged insider trading on this, so yes I'd say it's the former, although the latter does also exist to an extent.

I hope they will follow this up!

BBC political editor Chris Mason said that while ministers were not saying anything publicly: "The impression I am left with is they want to ride this out. They hope it is short-term volatility. "
However, he said one Conservative MP told him: "This is very worrying. All the wheels could come off."

This doesn't surprise me. If I was a junior minister, I would be looking for the nearest refrigeration unit. Someone is going to be sent out to defend this - the indefensible.

It will be a tough time for traditional Conservative MPs, this goes against their very instincts.

 

[JamesT]

What has surprised me is not the number of posts on here that reckon the budget was a bad move, but the number of financial professionals, including ones that you would expect to be sympathetic to the Conservative cause, who are concerned.


The latter quote is the sort of prediction that would have been made had Corbyn been elected PM. Inflation rising will just push mortgage rates up, so reducing the benefits of the stamp duty cut and making the cost-of-living crisis even more difficult for those who are just about getting by. It could be that economics has changed significantly since I last studied it half a century ago. it may have but not that much.

Quote from https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-63030208

Still, there will be high-fives in the Johnson household!


Unfortunately, Trussconomics is a world away from Osborne's 'Fix the roof while the sun is shining', it seems rather closer to 'It's pi$$ing down, time to take the tiles off."

Osborne’s austerity was criticised for choking off the recovery from the financial crisis. Sunak’s tax rises could likely have had a similar effect.
What are derided as Trussonomics is relatively normal Keynesian economics. Borrow and spend to promote growth when the economy is depressed (which it is post-COVID), then retrench once things have improved.

 

[SuspectUsual]

I hope they will follow this up!

I wonder if Crispin Odey is involved

 

[Perthsaint]

Osborne’s austerity was criticised for choking off the recovery from the financial crisis. Sunak’s tax rises could likely have had a similar effect.
What are derided as Trussonomics is relatively normal Keynesian economics. Borrow and spend to promote growth when the economy is depressed (which it is post-COVID), then retrench once things have improved.

Nonsense. Orthodox Keynesian prescribes borrowing and spending when the economy suffers from low demand, evidenced by low inflation and high unemployment. This is simple lunacy.

It's been a fun morning in the gilts market.

 

[JamesT]

I wonder if Crispin Odey is involved

Claims of insider trading are mostly the fevered dreams of people like Jolyon Maugham. Liz Truss cutting taxes was hardly a state secret. The offences related to insider trading only apply to financial instruments such as shares, not currency trading.

 

[jon0844]

What has surprised me is not the number of posts on here that reckon the budget was a bad move, but the number of financial professionals, including ones that you would expect to be sympathetic to the Conservative cause, who are concerned.

The world (UK anyway) has gone mad. Even people who will benefit from this crazy 'mini' budget are concerned, and elsewhere the vast majority of people are supportive of strike action despite being inconvenienced.