Locomotive names which may be unacceptable these days

[Merthyr Imp]

I remember one of the 47s was called "Appleby-Frodingham", that sounds rather like a company of some sort... was it?

Steelworks in or near Scunthorpe. Not sure if it's Corus now.

 

[John Luxton]

I twice travelled on that ship. It's a shame it's gone, as it was wonderful.

Yes same here did three trips on BLACK WATCH and two on her sister BOUDICCA.

Olsen's have a B naming policy all their ships begin with B.

 

[Benters]

This pub gets by just fine under that name: https://www.mcmullens.co.uk/cockothenort

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Sep 2022 ==

This pub gets by just fine under that nam

ww.mcmullens.co.uk/cockothenorthThe

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 16 Sep 2022 ==

The pub is down south. But the locomotive name is traditionally associated with Scotland.

 

[Rick1984]

An old pub in Northampton causes consternation whenever a picture of it appears in nostaglia articles: "The Black Boy". Nothing to do with race, its name is a reference to Charles II.

Similarly, The Black Bitch pub in Linlithgow had its name changed by the Greene King group. Obviously in reference to a dog!

 

[lyndhurst25]

I remember one of the 47s was called "Appleby-Frodingham", that sounds rather like a company of some sort... was it?

Appleby-Frodingham Steel Company is what is now known as British Steel Scunthorpe works.

 

[47296lastduff]

Some more unacceptables (now), all from the LNER family:
60043 Brown Jack, 62440 Wandering Willie, and a whole batch of names named after Hunts (i.e. fox hunting societies).

 

[Senex]

Though now days coloured is seen as an offensive word. My gran used to use it all the time. However, people of colour is seen as acceptable and the now favoured word to use.

Seems a bit contradictory to me.

What does the expression "of colour" actually mean?

 

[Western Lord]

The Sirhowy Railway (a really pioneering line in South Wales and possibly only the third to be built under Act of Parliament for general conveyance) had a very early steam locomotive named 'F*nny'.

Assuming that your * is an "a", Fanny is a perfectly respectable female given name, albeit not much used today. There was a popular 1961 film called Fanny, which saw the name on cinema billboards up and down the country.

 

[Loppylugs]

Fanny Cradock, along with husband Johnnie was a regular on tele a few years ago displaying cooking skills.

When I was on the railway a member of our fraternity was rather prone to making horrific noises from his rear end (and smells to match). He would shout out "60116" which was of course "Hal o' the Wynd" and everyone would do a runner!

 

[joebassman]

What does the expression "of colour" actually mean?

The phrase 'people of colour' is a representation of groups of people who are not white or of European parentage (Oxford Dictionary, 2019).

 

[Calthrop]

When I was on the railway a member of our fraternity was rather prone to making horrific noises from his rear end (and smells to match). He would shout out "60116" which was of course "Hal o' the Wynd" and everyone would do a runner!

[Humourless pedant mode on]> As mentioned by me in the earlier thread referenced in post #16: the loco concerned was named Hal o' the Wynd after a character in Sir Walter Scott's novel The Fair Maid of Perth: a smith and armour-maker whose Perth workshop is situated in a "wynd" -- Scots for back-street or alley, and pronounced like "wined" -- nothing in fact to do with wind(s) of any kind. <[Humourless pedant mode off]. Being thus faithful to Scott, would obviously spoil the above-recounted robust joke !

 

[Zamalek]

Western Invader was named for a battleship.

No such battleship or any other warship for that matter ....

 

[Loppylugs]

[Humourless pedant mode on]> As mentioned by me in the earlier thread referenced in post #16: the loco concerned was named Hal o' the Wynd after a character in Sir Walter Scott's novel The Fair Maid of Perth: a smith and armour-maker whose Perth workshop is situated in a "wynd" -- Scots for back-street or alley, and pronounced like "wined" -- nothing in fact to do with wind(s) of any kind. <[Humourless pedant mode off]. Being thus faithful to Scott, would obviously spoil the above-recounted robust joke !

Sadly @Calthrop this guy had no respect for Sir Walter and everyone knew what he meant! Aforementioned villain was a Welshman and if he happens to be on this forum and recognises himself....Hello Pete !!
Sir Walter Scott's wonderful character names were of course fortunately portrayed on LNER locos, the wonderful Luckie Mucklebackit springs to mind, unfortunately there was no Mrs. Shortcake.

 

[Calthrop]

Again, something mentioned by me on the other thread: the North British and later the LNER were a bit unusual in, at all "big-time", naming locos after characters in literature (appropriate to area of the country served by their system) -- in this case, those of Sir W.S. This seems to be something which on the whole, British railway undertakings "didn't do" -- rather a pity, I feel: a potentially rich source of names -- and of more interesting ones than often came about in, as it were, mass-produced-quantity naming procedures.

 

[CarltonA]

New York, and several places in North America with York or Albany in their name, are named after James II who was Duke of York (and Albany in Scotland) before becoming king.
He was also run out of the country in 1688 for being catholic, in the Glorious Revolution.

Being Catholic was not the reason he had to leave. It was replacing Protestant officials with Catholic ones in spite of saying that being a Catholic would have no bearing on the way he acted as Monarch that led to his departure, amongst other matters. The Act of Settlement and Bill of Rights came afterwards as a result of his actions, after being replaced by his son-in-law and daughter.

 

[Calthrop]

Computer weirdness -- something which I (not too bright with computers) am rather often afflicted by in various ways -- small "edit" to my post #74, has for some reason led to unsought crossing-out of half of the text.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 17 Sep 2022 ==

Computer weirdness -- something which I (not too bright with computers) am rather often afflicted by in various ways -- small "edit" to my post #74, has for some reason led to unsought crossing-out of half of the text.

Kind fellow-participant has explained remedy to me -- thank you.

 

[Rescars]

Again, something mentioned by me on the other thread: the North British and later the LNER were a bit unusual in, at all "big-time", naming locos after characters in literature (appropriate to area of the country served by their system) -- in this case, those of Sir W.S. This seems to be something which on the whole, British railway undertakings "didn't do" -- rather a pity, I feel: a potentially rich source of names -- and of more interesting ones than often came about in, as it were, mass-produced-quantity naming procedures.

The LNER attraction to racehorses produced some pretty exotic names too. The Southern did quite nicely with names from the Arthurian legends, but I bet they had fun checking the spelling of some of them.

 

[Harvester]

The LNER attraction to racehorses produced some pretty exotic names too.

And also some appalling ones, especially on the A2s. Steady Aim, Straight Deal, Herringbone and Bachelor’s Button spring to mind. The latter never even won a Classic. Of the Scott characters ‘Madge Wildfire‘ allocated to A1 60135 was an excellent choice for a Pacific steam loco.

 

[Calthrop]

And also some appalling ones, especially on the A2s. Steady Aim, Straight Deal, Herringbone and Bachelor’s Button spring to mind. The latter never even won a Classic. Of the Scott characters ‘Madge Wildfire‘ allocated to A1 60135 was an excellent choice for a Pacific steam loco.

At the risk of becoming a bore -- I have a great liking for the racehorse-name theme: find it a stroke of genius on the part of whoever thought of it. Names of racehorses are, and always have been, gloriously random -- sometimes getting towards crazily poetic realms (and, it would appear to me that most people basically like horse-racing -- some opponents of gambling, nonetheless see the racing itself as a stirring spectacle). Different folks, different preferences: but for me, the LNER's loco-naming was definitely the most entertaining, out of the Big Four -- what with racehorses, and sundry wildlife. This may be considered heresy: but for me, the GWR was particularly drab and unimaginative, in its loco-naming involving endless blocks of stately piles.

 

[Western Sunset]

As I'm watching the funeral service of HM Queen Elizabeth II, the thought crossed my mind if (in a parallel universe) 6027 King Richard I would be renamed, King Charles III.

 

[Ashley Hill]

As I'm watching the funeral service of HM Queen Elizabeth II, the thought crossed my mind if (in a parallel universe) 6027 King Richard I would be renamed, King Charles III.

I expect there will be something named after King Charles III soon. Probably a GWR IET or GBRF 69!

 

[Calthrop]

As I'm watching the funeral service of HM Queen Elizabeth II, the thought crossed my mind if (in a parallel universe) 6027 King Richard I would be renamed, King Charles III.

I'm perhaps being dim: but why that particular loco, as bolded by me?

 

[Gloster]

At the risk of becoming a bore -- I have a great liking for the racehorse-name theme: find it a stroke of genius on the part of whoever thought of it. Names of racehorses are, and always have been, gloriously random -- sometimes getting towards crazily poetic realms (and, it would appear to me that most people basically like horse-racing -- some opponents of gambling, nonetheless see the racing itself as a stirring spectacle). Different folks, different preferences: but for me, the LNER's loco-naming was definitely the most entertaining, out of the Big Four -- what with racehorses, and sundry wildlife. This may be considered heresy: but for me, the GWR was particularly drab and unimaginative, in its loco-naming involving endless blocks of stately piles.

I suspect that in the 1920s and 1930s many people had a vague knowledge of racing and would have been familiar with successful racehorses; nowadays many people probably can’t think of any but Shergar and Red Rum (it would be Premiership footballers instead). Although George V had an interest in racing, I don’t think it was as great as his father (fast horses and faster women), but the legacy of Edward VII would have lived on in an era when there was so much royalty-worship. The LNER was therefore tapping in to a theme which was familiar to both the better-heeled, who might have some connection with the owner of a horse of which the name had been used, or others who would have seen the name in the paper.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 19 Sep 2022 ==

I'm perhaps being dim: but why that particular loco, as bolded by me?

Because after the arrival of Edward VIII the GWR renamed the last King (6029) after him. They did the same with 6028 when George VI took over and so the next King back for the next King is 6027.

 

[Calthrop]

I suspect that in the 1920s and 1930s many people had a vague knowledge of racing and would have been familiar with successful racehorses; nowadays many people probably can’t think of any but Shergar and Red Rum (it would be Premiership footballers instead). Although George V had an interest in racing, I don’t think it was as great as his father (fast horses and faster women), but the legacy of Edward VII would have lived on in an era when there was so much royalty-worship. The LNER was therefore tapping in to a theme which was familiar to both the better-heeled, who might have some connection with the owner of a horse of which the name had been used, or others who would have seen the name in the paper.

Interesting -- thanks. I'd never really thought of the "royal connection" with horse-racing, in this context; knew of course, that the "Royals" had always been keen on it, but had imagined that a lot of people of all classes (including non-gamblers), had and have some liking for it for its own sake. To be honest, the notion of the LNER's consciously going for a theme which would particularly strike a chord with a wide range of the population, had not occurred to me -- had envisaged private railway companies choosing as name themes for their motive power, whatever their "head honchos" had happened to fancy: disregarding here, what the non-railway-interested majority of their fellow-citizens might or might not like or identify with !

Because after the arrival of Edward VIII the GWR renamed the last King (6029) after him. They did the same with 6028 when George VI took over and so the next King back for the next King is 6027.

Thank you -- a process about which I hadn't known.

 

[Rescars]

At the risk of becoming a bore -- I have a great liking for the racehorse-name theme: find it a stroke of genius on the part of whoever thought of it. Names of racehorses are, and always have been, gloriously random -- sometimes getting towards crazily poetic realms (and, it would appear to me that most people basically like horse-racing -- some opponents of gambling, nonetheless see the racing itself as a stirring spectacle). Different folks, different preferences: but for me, the LNER's loco-naming was definitely the most entertaining, out of the Big Four -- what with racehorses, and sundry wildlife. This may be considered heresy: but for me, the GWR was particularly drab and unimaginative, in its loco-naming involving endless blocks of stately piles.

The GWR was rather more imaginative and varied back in the days of the broad gauge. Wikipedia offers explanations of the various names of the Iron Duke class. Wasn't one of the smallest BG locos actually named "Tiny"?

 

[Gloster]

The GWR was rather more imaginative and varied back in the days of the broad gauge. Wikipedia offers explanations of the various names of the Iron Duke class. Wasn't one of the smallest BG locos actually named "Tiny"?

Tiny, which I think is the only broad-gauge loco to survive, was built for the South Devon Railway. I think, although I am far from sure, that the name was more of a nickname for many years.

 

[Calthrop]

The GWR was rather more imaginative and varied back in the days of the broad gauge. Wikipedia offers explanations of the various names of the Iron Duke class.

It appears to me that everyone was more imaginative and varied naming-wise, in the earlier days of railways. After the practice became "monolithic / en-bloc": re my personal feelings, most of the fun went out of it -- I'd have been content if Britain had, like most of the world as from roughly the turn of 19th / 20th centuries, largely given up on the whole thing of naming locomotives. (Just my personal "take", for me -- have no intention of waxing evangelistic about it.)

 

[Peter Mugridge]

At the risk of becoming a bore -- I have a great liking for the racehorse-name theme: find it a stroke of genius on the part of whoever thought of it. Names of racehorses are, and always have been, gloriously random -- sometimes getting towards crazily poetic realms (and, it would appear to me that most people basically like horse-racing -- some opponents of gambling, nonetheless see the racing itself as a stirring spectacle). Different folks, different preferences: but for me, the LNER's loco-naming was definitely the most entertaining, out of the Big Four -- what with racehorses, and sundry wildlife. This may be considered heresy: but for me, the GWR was particularly drab and unimaginative, in its loco-naming involving endless blocks of stately piles.

There's a few listed here that would certainly not be appropriate for use on a locomotive!

From Hoof Hearted to Onoitsmymothernlaw: 13 funny racehorse names

There are some strict rules around naming a racehorse, but there are some that have slipped through the net to give us some funny racehorse names

www.horseandhound.co.uk

There are around 250,000 names on the current register in the UK with Weatherbys, which is the organisation responsible for processing racehorse names. There are some strict rules around naming a racehorse too but there are some that have slipped through the net, both in the UK and overseas to bring us some fantastically funny racehorse names.

 

[Ligeraceaster]

May be veering off topic a bit here but are any of the names (especially LNER locos?) using the Eric Gill typeface? Perhaps a different level of unacceptable?

 

[DerekC]

I agree with @Calthrop that the LNER choice of racehorses as a source of Pacific names was excellent - although a quick look at mu 1959 spotter's book does bring up some more which look a bit odd out of context:

60039 - Sandwich (not curly in LNER days, of course)
60047 - Donovan (remember him?)
60074 - Harvester (so why not "Tractor" as well?)
60100 - Spearmint (but happily not "Bubble Gum")