Trivia: unwritten etiquette as a railway passenger

[SussexSeagull]

Babies cry. Unfortunately can't be helped.

 

[Mikey C]

As a dad and grandad I can assure every childless traveller that the adult with the crying baby absolutely doesn't want it to cry either! Sometimes, they just cry, and every parental trick in the book doesn't seem to work. We're deeply conscious too that others might find it difficult to deal with as well, but escape from the confines of home and travel to family/friends/holiday is part of normal life that everyone is entitled too.

The crying baby problem tends to occur more often on aircraft. The changes of pressure in particular can cause them severe discomfort that they simply don't understand. With everyone confined to a small tube and little chance of moving seat, it can be excruciating for all including the parents.

In the case of flying though, how many of those journeys are essential? Why not holiday at home for a few years, rather than dragging babies around so that you can holiday like you did when childless?

 

[Peter0124]

Babies cry. Unfortunately can't be helped.

It can be helped if they weren't allowed in the quiet coach though!

 

[SussexSeagull]

It can be helped if they weren't allowed in the quiet coach though!

I suspect that would be a legal minefield.

 

[AM9]

With the price of train tickets, a lot of families would find it cheaper to go by car...

Assuming they can afford a car and can drive!

 

[61653 HTAFC]

It can be helped if they weren't allowed in the quiet coach though!

A "quiet coach" is a luxury that's only possible if there are several coaches. If there are only two or three coaches on the train, less so.

Perhaps rather than a "Quiet coach" there should be a "noisy coach" with quiet being the default. Though I wouldn't expect parents with young children to be banished to there.

 

[Peter0124]

I suspect that would be a legal minefield.

How so? What about hidden disabilities eg autism and sensory processing disorder? The quiet coach should be able to cater for the aforementioned.

The sound of babies crying causes me sensory distress and it's unfair if it's literally a quiet coach. What's the point in having one then?

 

[bramling]

That I would love. There have always been passengers (especially commuters) who have their favourite seats, and treat them as if they have a permanent reservation on them. Those who think that they can bully me with a facial expressions will be disappointed, and most of them are far too cowardly to actually say anything.

Nice to be able to agree on something, I have a bugbear on this. If someone wants a particular type of seat, then turn up early. Good old first-come-first-serve. I find it extremely rude when people turn up at the last minute and expect others to move to accommodate their desires.

I wouldn’t say commuters are the worst for this though. On the contrary it’s the self-entitled family types who travel on a weekend. There is no specific reason why a family should need to, nor expect, a bay of seats if they are all already taken, especially when there are plenty elsewhere on the train and they expect the first one they come to or can’t be bothered to walk.

 

[SussexSeagull]

How so? What about hidden disabilities eg autism and sensory processing disorder? The quiet coach should be able to cater for the aforementioned.

In essence parents with babies would be denied access to a service.

 

[Peter0124]

In essence parents with babies would be denied access to a service.

I disagree because they can use other coaches, unless the train is busy of course, then by all means give them a free upgrade into Standard Premium or First Class. The quiet coach should be literally what it says, quiet.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

How so? What about hidden disabilities eg autism and sensory processing disorder? The quiet coach should be able to cater for the aforementioned.

We're getting into an oppression hierarchy here... who should the railway be more accommodating to? Young children or adults on the spectrum...

Speaking as someone on the spectrum, once you're an adult it is still up to you to find ways to cope with environments that you find stressful. You can't expect everyone else to bend over backwards to accommodate you. I certainly wouldn't put my own creature comforts above those of a baby or the parent with the baby.

 

[185143]

I disagree because they can use other coaches, unless the train is busy of course, then by all means give them a free upgrade into Standard Premium or First Class. The quiet coach should be literally what it says, quiet.

Strongly disagree on upgrades to First.

I'm not saying First Class should be a library, but don't think it's unreasonable to expect to be able to work in relative peace in there, particularly when the credit cards being used to pay for tickets end in "Ltd."

 

[Bletchleyite]

Speaking as someone on the spectrum, once you're an adult it is still up to you to find ways to cope with environments that you find stressful. You can't expect everyone else to bend over backwards to accommodate you. I certainly wouldn't put my own creature comforts above those of a baby or the parent with the baby.

I think that depends. Babies cry, that's natural and you can't prevent it. However playing music or TV shows out loud even if to placate a baby is never acceptable.

 

[Peter0124]

But what happens if the literal sound of a baby/toddler crying / screaming is distressing to listen to? Ive had this since I was young myself! The earphone option is there but why should I have to do that when I'm in the quiet coach? It can still be stressful even with earphones, It's different if I was in a normal coach but it's the quiet coach for a reason!

 

[Bletchleyite]

But what happens if the literal sound of a baby/toddler crying / screaming is distressing to listen to?

I think it naturally does distress people (we're conditioned to want to comfort the baby) but I think that's just life, it's not solely an autistic thing.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

I think that depends. Babies cry, that's natural and you can't prevent it. However playing music or TV shows out loud even if to placate a baby is never acceptable.

We're talking about whether babies and young children should be barred from quiet coaches- using an electronic device to placate said infant is another matter altogether.

The suggestion that I, as an adult on the autism spectrum, require more special treatment than an infant is patronising in the extreme. If I was easily offended, I'd find the very suggestion offensive!

 

[Peter0124]

I think it naturally does distress people (we're conditioned to want to comfort the baby) but I think that's just life, it's not solely an autistic thing.

For me though it's more of an "I need out of here" feeling than comforting the baby. Normal coaches, then yes it's unavoidable and can't be helped but quiet coaches should be different.

 

[AM9]

Nice to be able to agree on something, I have a bugbear on this. If someone wants a particular type of seat, then turn up early. Good old first-come-first-serve. I find it extremely rude when people turn up at the last minute and expect others to move to accommodate their desires.

I wouldn’t say commuters are the worst for this though. On the contrary it’s the self-entitled family types who travel on a weekend. There is no specific reason why a family should need to, nor expect, a bay of seats if they are all already taken, especially when there are plenty elsewhere on the train and they expect the first one they come to or can’t be bothered to walk.

My experience is more of commuters who regard their regular travel on the same train entitles them to lay claim on a particular seat irrespective of whether they were there first. Wa back in the early '70s the third train in my regular commute home was the 18:05 from Chelmsford to Colchester. It was Clacton service using class 309s and I regularly travelled in the buffet car as I would get a hot drink, - especially in the winter. There was a group of four or five who regularly had a card school that took up the first table n the buffet. It effectively reduced the seating capapcity by 25%.
Occasionally, I had to travel to South Hampshire and caught the same train at it's origin, Liverpool St.. It's formation was pretty consistent and Knowing where to stand, there was the lead character of this group who had a jacket and overcopat already over his arm. When the train pulled in he opened the (slam)door, went straight to the first table and threw the coat over one pair of seats and the jacket over the other. He then went to get a cup of tea. I observed this a few times, so one day I arrived at the spot on the platform just before him. I sat by the window and his face was a picture. Major tutting there at least as far as Shenfield.

 

[LowLevel]

I think that depends. Babies cry, that's natural and you can't prevent it. However playing music or TV shows out loud even if to placate a baby is never acceptable.

I suggest you avoid going to Skegness on the train

In my younger, more foolish years I did try and keep a lid on the electronic nonsense blaring away but after getting more verbal abuse and threats of violence than on a Saturday night drunkex I don't bother - the long suffering residents of Boston and Sleaford and other such environs who have to share the trains unfortunately have had to learn to live with it!

 

[bramling]

I suggest you avoid going to Skegness on the train

In my younger, more foolish years I did try and keep a lid on the electronic nonsense blaring away but after getting more verbal abuse and threats of violence than on a Saturday night drunkex I don't bother - the long suffering residents of Boston and Sleaford and other such environs who have to share the trains unfortunately have had to learn to live with it!

Sounds like the definition of hell!

 

[Mikey C]

Assuming they can afford a car and can drive!

Go around working class suburbia, such as former council estates, nearly families all have a car. Old cars, knackered cars, but that's how they get around, especially as a family, as train travel for a family is really expensive.

There's a slight difference in much of inner London and the cities, where many younger people don't drive, but that's no representative of the rest of the country.

 

[miklcct]

Please never consume own-purchased hot food on board (or ideally, bring it on board unless in a sealed plastic or other container). Maccas, Burger King (Hungry Jacks in my country), fish'n'chips, Indian, Chinese or other Asian food...no.

Should be a capital offence to eat an orange onboard a train. For some reason there's always one left over on any pull down table on every XC Voyager I've ever been on, stinking out the carriage in the process.

If it is a durian instead I may barely agree - but do you really want to ban eating on trains? Even those places where eating on trains are prohibited don't have such prohibition on intercity trains!

In a similar vein, if you’re waiting to leave the train and there’s people behind you, push the bloody button when it lights up instead of daydreaming.

I’ve had to reach over people once or twice to push the button myself as they were completely oblivious... they may have also got an eye roll off me

Pushing a button to get on / off the train is an abnormal thing to me that isn't common sense at all. When a train arrives at a station, doors should be automatically opened. London Underground and Thameslink core already do that, it should be made standard for all other networks as well.

Quite, crying and screaming babies and noisy children on trains shouldn’t be so socially acceptable imo. But it seems these days, anything goes.

Crying is babies' nature and can't be avoided.

 

[6Gman]

So a teenager should offer their seat to a woman of age X, but a twenty-something should not?

You may be taking it a little more seriously than intended.

It's a rule of thumb not a prescription.

 

[fwsmVor]

You may be taking it a little more seriously than intended.

It's a rule of thumb not a prescription.

It's a ridiculous and sexist prescription. Women are very much capable of standing.

 

[6Gman]

I can't imagine what I'd do at the age of 37 if 12-year-olds started offering me their seat! When I'm of an age where I'm so infirm that I can't stand on a train, I'll ask for a seat, not demand that one be vacated for me like I'm a dictator.

It did give me a bit of a jolt when a 20-ish lady offered me her seat on a Merseyrail service a few years ago.

I didn't think I looked old enough (still don't ... do I?)

 

[Wolfie]

Again, that would be more inconvenient for both the carrier and everyone around them. They'll be slower and more of a hindrance. Just be aware of how they'll move, just as how if you're a cyclist you need to be aware of how large vehicles behave when making turns.

I'm going to start taking my large rucksack even if I don't need it, just to see how many people I can "whack" because they were impatient or not paying attention.

Do that on the tube and, based on my practical observations, you will get a whack back in the face.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 15 Sep 2022 ==

I was in First once, and had somehow been booked on a four-table by myself. Four ladies boarded; three took the seats around me, the other sat across the aisle. I offered to swap with her so that the four friends could sit together. Underneath this gruff, surly, northern exterior beats the heart of a gentleman. A gentleman who was hoping to pull...

Also: if you're used to travelling on the Underground and no other sort of heavy rail, don't stand near the doors when you arrive at your station. The doors will not open automatically, and everyone queued up behind you will think you're Little Lord Fauntleroy waiting for someone to press a button for him.

Re your last para, it's amazing how many regular tube users who only use the Overground occasionally do exactly that.....

 

[bleeder4]

I remember being on a packed Avanti to Scotland once where a young guy sitting at a table across the aisle from me produced a small knife, a pack of garlic and a pack of beetroot. He then proceeded to slice them on the table and eat them raw, slice by slice. I'm sure some people reading this like raw garlic and beetroot but I'm not one of them. The smell was atrocious, the whole carriage was covered with it, an absolute stench. Pretty much everyone around him, including me, the 3 others at his table, and a sizeable chunk of people at the seats surrounding him, all left our seats and went to stand in the vestibule of the next coach. On a train that was full and standing, he then had most of a whole coach to himself. It's the most effective method of guaranteeing a table to yourself that I've ever come across!

 

[Bantamzen]

What annoys me is

People who eat and drink on trains. Ever. And people who have eaten or drink before they get on. Ever. In their lives. You either exist through the processing and consumption of foods and liquids or you get the train. Make a choice.

If you’ve reserved a seat, for God’s sake take it home with you. Got on an Azuma the other day and the filthy buggers had left over 300 on it. Makes me sick.

The Penge West Feather Duster Bandits (though their numbers have been thinned out by first to last gatelines)

Staff pass holders who travel in the passenger accommodation instead of sprawled on the front of the train like Buster Keaton WHERE THEY BELONG

Guards on the South WCML who never come out of the middle cab but spend the whole time lying recumbent on the driver’s seat sniffing a loaf of stale bread and mumbling segments of the songs of Showaddywaddy to themselves

People who have an on train seance and don’t wipe up the ectoplasm after them

People who disrespect the atmosphere of the quiet carriage! Honestly is it so hard to do your sacrificial chants to Lucifer in the vestibule?! And they ALWAYS do them in a guttural East Midlands accent it just sounds so wrong!! Satanism was aspirational in my day now it’s all “come out your eternal pit me duck”. Kids….

When people turn round with large bags they always leave the zips open and artefacts come flying out, I was at Salford Crescent the other week and this inconsiderate LOUT caught a nice old lady in the face with the Holy Grail, you never used to see this before the 319s came in, bloody northern powerhouse

That thing you have to do on Class 323s with the duck and the xylophone just to be able to get past the Gatekeeper and sit down, I won’t even write it out here but honestly I’d rather get the bus

The endless chirpy but damaging voice I hear in the toilets of Pendolinos (namely my conscience telling me an exhaustive list of all the social faux pas I made when I was 14)

That nobody at Euston ticket office will sell me a ticket for this mythical train called the “Pizza Express” I’ve heard so much about

When people are sat in the seat someone else reserved and they just dissolve into stardust and are shifted outside the astral plane as the passenger who has stolen their seat absorb their consciousness and memories, leaving a withered husk of their corporeal vessel in the aisle that is really hard for the trolley attendant to get past

Sensory stimulation on trains. It shouldn’t be socially acceptable to have such damaging intrusions on my senses. Literally all the way to Glasgow one year I was touching something pretty much the whole time. I stripped naked and jumped up in the air a few times but it didn’t last. Unacceptable.

I stopped reading any comments after yours. There was simply no need, you have won The Internet!!

 

[Beebman]

SBB double-deck Inter City sets have family accomodation designed for youngsters, maybe we should have something along those lines in the UK? The Swiss company Pixelfarm which designed the interiors has a webpage in English showing their work for these:

https://pixelfarm.ch/en/illustration/sbb-familienwagen/

 

[Thebaz]

In the name of satirising certain types of passenger I have often thought that a good skit would be for a chap to get on a train with a flask of hot water, a bowl and mirror and as soon as they sit down, get out the shaving kit. I'm actually surprised that no sketch artists have attempted this before!