Lockdown effects now killing/harming more people than Covid

[Eyersey468]

Very interesting indeed. The difference between “from Covid” and “with Covid” is certainly something that never received sufficient attention, and this is something which still needs some serious retrospective scrutiny, though of course we’re probably never going to know the true answer. It’s probably fair to say that a proportion of the above are likely to have had an undiagnosed and/or unknown underlying condition.

As an aside, it’s also interesting to see the disposition between male and female. Significantly more male deaths than female ones. I suppose it may be the case that males are more likely to be in certain occupations which are less conducive to good health, but nonetheless still strange to see this still being the case in very young age groups too.

I agree

 

[greyman42]

This is a very interesting table, resulting from a FOI request (not by me I should add). Even accepting that the raw statistics don’t tell the full story, they are certainly striking, and not something I thought we’d ever see to be honest.

Table 1: Number of deaths where COVID-19 was the only cause mentioned on the death certificate, 1 February 2020 to 31 December 2021, by sex and age group, England and Wales

Age group	Males	Females
<1	1	0
1-4	0	0
5-9	0	0
10-14	0	1
15-19	1	0
20-24	4	1
25-29	12	3
30-34	24	7
35-39	42	15
40-44	52	24
45-49	87	43
50-54	138	52
55-59	234	92
60-64	254	102
65-69	279	119
70-74	357	204
75-79	395	252
80-84	492	402
85-89	470	533
90+	520	971

COVID-19 deaths and autopsies Feb 2020 to Dec 2021 - Office for National Statistics

Could someone tell me what that adds up to regarding total deaths from covid alone?

 

[30907]

How many death certificates in general mention only one cause of death?

I am not a GP (and cannot check with one right now) but "From Covid" (ie Covid being significant) was consistently around 90% of "With Covid" deaths until early this year, when the figure statprted declining to around 60-65%.

 

[yorkie]

The excess deaths are largely going to be from things such as cancer and heart disease. The NHS pretty much told everyone to eff off for the best part of 18 months, so diseases treatable in their early stages have reached the point where they are now life ending.

Exactly

I am sure most of us generally agree on that so why are some people looking to blame the vaccine?

Because those with an anti-vax agenda are looking for anything that may support their claims, even if the evidence doesn't actually say what they claim it says.

 

[DustyBin]

Could someone tell me what that adds up to regarding total deaths from covid alone?

6,183.

 

[greyman42]

6,183.

Was it worth locking down for months on end and shafting the economy?

 

[Eyersey468]

Was it worth locking down for months on end and shafting the economy?

No, though for a long time only Covid seemed to matter. Never mind the economic damage, the harm to children's education, suspending other treatments, the damage to mental health etc, none of that mattered

 

[Freightmaster]

Was it worth locking down for months on end and shafting the economy?

If it saves one life™

/s




MARK

 

[greyman42]

If it saves one life™

/s




MARK

That does not justify it.

 

[DustyBin]

Was it worth locking down for months on end and shafting the economy?

Err…… No.

 

[Hans]

Anti vaxx agenda?

Since when does the request for a discussion on excess deaths which has coincided with lockdowns (therefore lack of NHS/GP care) in addition to the use of a new vaccine (remember it is not a traditional type of vaccine and only licenced for use during an emergency) be deemed anti vaxx?

More people are dying, that is not disputed, there are a number of reasons for this, one of which has to be the use of the vaccines, the constant mantra of these vaccines do not cause death or side effects is foolish, let there be discussions and investigations as to the effect of the vaccines, if the outcome is it is not causing excess deaths then fine, but until then shouting down anyone who questions the vaccine as anti vaxx achieves nothing.

 

[Razorblades]

Anti vaxx agenda?

Since when does the request for a discussion on excess deaths which has coincided with lockdowns (therefore lack of NHS/GP care) in addition to the use of a new vaccine (remember it is not a traditional type of vaccine and only licenced for use during an emergency) be deemed anti vaxx?

More people are dying, that is not disputed, there are a number of reasons for this, one of which has to be the use of the vaccines, the constant mantra of these vaccines do not cause death or side effects is foolish, let there be discussions and investigations as to the effect of the vaccines, if the outcome is it is not causing excess deaths then fine, but until then shouting down anyone who questions the vaccine as anti vaxx achieves nothing.

I would also note that those whose partners/ elders/ children have been potentially harmed (or worse) by the injections, and who are now seeking answers as to why and how this has happened (that's even before we think about the aspect of compensation for partners of the deceased) have in the majority of cases had the injections themselves.

Is it not disingenuous to refer to such injured parties as 'anti-vaxx,' when they took the injections in good faith, only to witness tragedy befall their nearest and dearest. It's heart-wrenching to see the unharmed recipients of the jabs decry the victims' heartfelt pleas for help, and label them somehow as traitorous.

 

[Hans]

I have previous said Christopher Chope MP has ensured the government have agreed to vaccine damage payments being made - that alone is an assertion these vaccines are causing damage for some. The drug companys have all been granted immunity to any damage the vaccines have caused, so those damaged will only receive the current maximum payment of 120k. For some the side effects are such that this amount will only help for a short time, and for those who have died, it is a small amount for their families.

So many have placed all their eggs in the vaccine basket hence the efforts to discredit anyone who questions the efficacy of them and/or the damage they may cause.

 

[Freightmaster]

That does not justify it.

I agree totally (hence the /s) - I was just quoting the 'virtue signalling' justification that people trotted out repeatedly in 2020.


And if you tried to explain that shutting down all 'non essential' businesses for months at a time would cripple the economy
for years to come, they just started babbling on about "people's lives are more important than profits"


I really hope they now realise the consequences of their calls for "longer and harder" lockdowns on their cost of living in 2022.





MARK

 

[Eyersey468]

I agree totally (hence the /s) - I was just quoting the 'virtue signalling' justification that people trotted out repeatedly in 2020.


And if you tried to explain that shutting down all 'non essential' businesses for months at a time would cripple the economy
for years to come, they just started babbling on about "people's lives are more important than profits"


I really hope they now realise the consequences of their calls for "longer and harder" lockdowns on their cost of living in 2022.





MARK

I agree they had no concept of the damage that was to come, it appears to me a lot of the ones that were screaming for longer and harder lockdowns then are now the ones moaning loudest about the consequences of them

 

[Hans]

I agree they had no concept of the damage that was to come, it appears to me a lot of the ones that were screaming for longer and harder lockdowns then are now the ones moaning loudest about the consequences of them

Many appear to be suffering from selective amnesia.

 

[kez19]

I agree they had no concept of the damage that was to come, it appears to me a lot of the ones that were screaming for longer and harder lockdowns then are now the ones moaning loudest about the consequences of them

I wonder how long before we will hear the media will begin to portray themselves as saints? I see on the odd occasion Devi even tries to wriggle her way out of it on twitter to then see some responses on her tweets to be blown out the water (public anger going against her), oddly enough she doesn't respond!..

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Sep 2022 ==

Many appear to be suffering from selective amnesia.

agree may as well give the media an award for this too.

 

[Eyersey468]

I wonder how long before we will hear the media will begin to portray themselves as saints? I see on the odd occasion Devi even tries to wriggle her way out of it on twitter to then see some responses on her tweets to be blown out the water (public anger going against her), oddly enough she doesn't respond!..

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 11 Sep 2022 ==



agree may as well give the media an award for this too.

I noticed on one of her tweets she mentioned about trade offs, ironic considering her views around Covid and the fact no form of cost benefit analysis was done for any of the measures we took

 

[kez19]

I noticed on one of her tweets she mentioned about trade offs, ironic considering her views around Covid and the fact no form of cost benefit analysis was done for any of the measures we took

Also she still peddles UK bad... she supposedly advises Sturgeon, she needs to look closer to Scotland first than autopilot blame the UK for all its faults (but of course I forget, she is good for the likes of the BBC for her opinion so as long as she can give a kick in to the UK government nothing else matters).

As for her opinion on stuff such as the NHS mental health etc - for me personally she shouldn't be the one to talk as all she cared about was zero covid and throwing everything else under a bus, but like I say we don't see the media asking her on interviews on her lets say predictions to be wrong to be hauled up about it, its more of just give us your opinion and we won't question you (on anything you said previous was right... or wrong), similar to that Ferguson guy as well as the SAGE(s). I am glad in one retrospect whilst its social media but some people are at least realising things.

 

[Eyersey468]

Also she still peddles UK bad... she supposedly advises Sturgeon, she needs to look closer to Scotland first than autopilot blame the UK for all its faults (but of course I forget, she is good for the likes of the BBC for her opinion so as long as she can give a kick in to the UK government nothing else matters).

As for her opinion on stuff such as the NHS mental health etc - for me personally she shouldn't be the one to talk as all she cared about was zero covid and throwing everything else under a bus, but like I say we don't see the media asking her on interviews on her lets say predictions to be wrong to be hauled up about it, its more of just give us your opinion and we won't question you (on anything you said previous was right... or wrong), similar to that Ferguson guy as well as the SAGE(s). I am glad in one retrospect whilst its social media but some people are at least realising things.

I agree those including her that only cared about zero covid are now in no position to start bleating on about mental health etc

 

[kez19]

I agree those including her that only cared about zero covid are now in no position to start bleating on about mental health etc

Yet the media give them the limelight, that’s what is wrong with this in my mind, I’m all for difference in opinion but I don’t see any of the media pushing for a debate on both sides to talk about it I wonder why?

I didn’t watch but was aware of is it Mark Steyn? Did a segment on GB News? Whilst I understand GB News may not be everybody cup of tea but at least it’s looking into things that the likes of BBC and Sky (ITV) would cover but don’t (or will we see them jump on the bandwagon soon?)

 

[nw1]

I agree those including her that only cared about zero covid are now in no position to start bleating on about mental health etc

Mental health issues were a big problem during lockdown, but of course, nobody seemed to care.

 

[Eyersey468]

Mental health issues were a big problem during lockdown, but of course, nobody seemed to care.

I agree they didn't because only Covid mattered.

 

[nw1]

I agree they didn't because only Covid mattered.

Indeed, that did seem to be the dogma.

And of course, for many people, mental health issues (such as depression, OCD, and others) are far more destructive than being infected with Sars-Cov-2.

 

[DustyBin]

Indeed, that did seem to be the dogma.

And of course, for many people, mental health issues (such as depression, OCD, and others) are far more destructive than being infected with Sars-Cov-2.

What's annoying is that many of us spoke out on here but our concerns were often completely disregarded. (Some) people were very quick to say "where's your evidence" and/or "anecdotes don't count" when it was quite obvious what was happening. The issues were suppressed at the time, as you'd expect. Those who caused them, who also controlled the narrative, weren't going to advertise the fact. I would have thought that was obvious!

 

[Eyersey468]

What's annoying is that many of us spoke out on here but our concerns were often completely disregarded. (Some) people were very quick to say "where's your evidence" and/or "anecdotes don't count" when it was quite obvious what was happening. The issues were suppressed at the time, as you'd expect. Those who caused them, who also controlled the narrative, weren't going to advertise the fact. I would have thought that was obvious!

Agreed

 

[kez19]

Mental health issues were a big problem during lockdown, but of course, nobody seemed to care.

For me before COVID and still waiting on, is looking into if I have ADHD/Autism to at least see if I’m on the spectrum (had letter couple months ago to say going through as quick as we can but no date given… NHS Scotland just to point out).

I have done the test online and it appears I’m on the spectrum but I rather it be official in a way. I wonder how much has been missed during this? Give it time we’ll see the BBC/ITV etc jump on the bandwagon.

 

[northwichcat]

Many GPs don't seem to want to see patients any more and patients either no longer feel welcome to visit GPs or (in some cases) have been scared away or it's just been made too difficult for them.

This partly relates to a triage system that many practices introduced towards the end of 2019. They decided to let doctors decide who gets the most urgent appointments, plus decided that for certain things you don't need another appointment and a brief phone call can cover off what's needed e.g. if prescription medication is working but you need another course.

When I called the doctor's surgery in 2019 with a fairly urgent problem it was a Wednesday. The receptionist said the problem had to be either urgent or routine. An urgent one would get put through a triage system, while a routine one would be dealt with in around 2 weeks. There was no longer an option of saying I needed an appointment this week but it didn't need to be today, like was the case previously. So I had to opt for the urgent triage. This meant I got a phone call from the doctor late Wednesday morning. He decided a face-to-face appointment was needed ideally tomorrow (that afternoon the surgery was closed for training). But his schedule was full for Thursday, so it ended up being Friday afternoon.

When I followed the same process earlier this year, again I got a phone call from the doctor. He kept the call short as he needed to look inside my ear to diagnose the problem and invited me in for an appointment a couple of hours later. The difference was then that everyone else in the waiting room seemed to waiting for an appointment with the nurse.

 

[MikeWM]

Anti vaxx agenda?

Since when does the request for a discussion on excess deaths which has coincided with lockdowns (therefore lack of NHS/GP care) in addition to the use of a new vaccine (remember it is not a traditional type of vaccine and only licenced for use during an emergency) be deemed anti vaxx?

More people are dying, that is not disputed, there are a number of reasons for this, one of which has to be the use of the vaccines, the constant mantra of these vaccines do not cause death or side effects is foolish, let there be discussions and investigations as to the effect of the vaccines, if the outcome is it is not causing excess deaths then fine, but until then shouting down anyone who questions the vaccine as anti vaxx achieves nothing.

Yes, I agree with all of that. As you say, it is simple fact that significantly more people are dying, a year or so after the vast majority of the population had a medical treatment which had had very little time for testing, zero medium- or long-term testing, and based on new technology not widely used previously, and that we already know has caused at least a small number of people to die. It would be totally bizarre to dogmatically rule out some degree of causation occurring here, until and unless we get good evidence that it isn't. That's not 'anti-vaxx', that's science, as we used to do it before 'The Science' took over.

Were people who pointed out there were a lot of people dying from strokes and heart attacks after taking Vioxx 'anti-pill'? In the end Vioxx killed tens of thousands of people, possibly hundreds of thousands, so it was rather a good job that they did actually look into whether there was a connection, discovered that yes there was, and withdrew it before anyone else was killed.

Maybe there is no connection between the excess deaths and the mass vaccination (or indeed between the fall in birth rates and the mass vaccination, as I mentioned a few days ago). Or maybe there is. It should be investigated, and urgently, as people like John Campbell (about as far from an 'anti-vaxxer' as you can get) are calling for.

 

[Hans]

I agree @MikeWM. My concern is too many people have a vested interest in the vaccines being 100% safe. For the drug companies there is the financial and future funding/production which could be damaged, for those who staked their reputations on delivering a safe and effective vaccine they stand to lose their standing and probably the most damaging is those of the general population who believe in the vaccine , believe without it they will die and those who took it as they believed it was the way to achieve "freedom" (The vaccine passport). Many do not like admitting they may have been fooled. There is more to be gained (in the opinion of many) to ensure the vaccines are deemed safe and effective, rather than admitting there are issues.

The standard rules for withdrawing drugs due to side effects seem to have been ignored which is a dangerous precedent.

The whole covid narrative has been built on silencing any opposition, I sadly think the vaccine is no different.