"Covid rising in England" - let's stop the fear mongering

[Hans]

I agree with the many posts on here I do not trust Starmer one single bit. The so called change to the Labour position is nothing more than reacting to the ever increasing change in the media about the covid actions taken - many are now seeing the economic damage and health issues the restrictions caused and I expect there will shortly be various spin coming from the opposition that they never were in favour of the lockdown! They will most probably airbrush away their even stronger stance than the Tories for lockdowns so they can ensure they played no part in causing the problems the country is facing.

 

[bramling]

Considering that we're going to be living with this virus permanently just as we do with many other viruses I'm not entirely sure what the relevant criteria are for making the "its all over!" announcement are? Indeed I'm not sure there are any!

Meanwhile the rest of us are just getting on with life rather than continuing to obsess over the numbers of cases and whether this party or that individual is pro or anti restriction especially seeing as no-one is actually talking about it. It's nice, you should try it

Two issues with that. Firstly all the stuff from Johnson about how removing restrictions was “irreversible”, which of course turned out to be nonsense. A clumsy choice of wording on his part.

But the more concerning event was what happened last December. We already ended up with an element of measures, which caused a mini economic shock to some industries just when they really didn’t need it. Likewise it may well have deferred an interest rate rise. We seem to have avoided even more in the way of restrictions only because of backbench pressure on Johnson. None of this is consequence-free, and it’s fair to say we could probably have done without all of this at that point.

The difficulty seems to be that the easy message to put out was “we won’t hesitate to go back to restrictions if necessary”, whereas the more difficult but realistic one should have been “we *have* to get back to normal as the cure is now worse than the disease”.

Unfortunately the more reminders there continue to be plastered all around us, in whatever form, the easier it is for us to too readily slip back into restrictions at the relative drop of a hat, especially as we are going to have another PM who isn’t made for the role.

It’s doing none of us any good, nor is a lack of confidence good for our already shot economy, if we’re all still living with the nagging feeling that at any moment some new variant is going to come along or case numbers start climbing (as at times they’re going to) and there’s suddenly going to be concern about the NHS not being able to cope. We simply can’t keep having this hung over us as a dark cloud.

I suspect cost of living is going to be a more salient issue for many through the autumn in any case.

 

[Cdd89]

Meanwhile the rest of us are just getting on with life rather than continuing to obsess over the numbers of cases and whether this party or that individual is pro or anti restriction especially seeing as no-one is actually talking about it. It's nice, you should try it

It certainly would be nice, but speaking as someone particularly badly affected by lockdowns, it’s hard to do.

I’m guessing based on the above (possibly incorrectly/unfairly?) that you weren’t particularly badly impacted by lockdowns.

 

[Hans]

For the majority of the population, they have hung onto the word of the BBC about covid and therefore the narrative being fed to them, until there are in words of one syllable in a press conference which states " it is all over, there will never be a return to any restrictions, there is no need to test, social distance, wear a mask" people will still call for restrictions to return when someone sneezes, and they will cling onto their masks thinking their lives depend on it.

 

[greyman42]

Whilst in general I agree, some of us are concerned at the prospect of sleepwalking into further restrictions in a couple of months time. As nonsensical as it would be, I’m not 100% confident that it won’t happen. I think it’s more a case of being aware of the danger rather than obsessing.

I don't think there is any chance of further restrictions regarding covid with a Conservative government. Both candidates have made that clear.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 22 Aug 2022 ==

people will still call for restrictions to return when someone sneezes, and they will cling onto their masks thinking their lives depend on it.

And a Conservative government and the vast majority of people will tell them where to go.

 

[Hans]

It certainly would be nice, but speaking as someone particularly badly affected by lockdowns, it’s hard to do.

I’m guessing based on the above (possibly incorrectly/unfairly?) that you weren’t particularly badly impacted by lockdowns.

It is not good to hear you were badly impacted by lockdowns, my family were impacted very badly, particularly financially and employment wise, the way we got through it was actually to ignore everything the government said. I make no bones about the fact we took no notice of any restrictions, have never tested and most certainly have not been vaccinated. It was this behaviour which enabled us to not let the actions of a government and the majority of the population destroy us.

So returning to normal may be difficult for you due to the impact of lockdowns but I agree with other posters, the sooner you return to normal the better life will be the longer you do not, you are allowing the lockdown restrictions to continue to impact you.

 

[bramling]

I don't think there is any chance of further restrictions regarding covid with a Conservative government. Both candidates have made that clear.

The problem is that the nature of our political system (no formal constitution, no government can bind its successor) is that whatever they say, it’s not *guaranteed*.

So we have to *trust* our politicians on this, and, let’s be honest, trust in our politicians is pretty much rock bottom at the moment, for a number of reasons.

This is a problem as it simply doesn’t inspire confidence that we’ve drawn a line under this, even if much of Joe Public has, in the way they live their daily life at least.

 

[Hans]

I don't think there is any chance of further restrictions regarding covid with a Conservative government. Both candidates have made that clear.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 22 Aug 2022 ==


And a Conservative government and the vast majority of people will tell them where to go.

The government hopefully will do, the population I am not too sure, 97% of the population readily accepted all the restrictions, many snitched on friends and family, many supported draconian retribution against those who did not following the narrative or take a vaccine - I wouldn't be so confident a portion (I agree lower than 97% though) would not return to the same behaviour if told to do so.

 

[greyman42]

The problem is that the nature of our political system (no formal constitution, no government can bind its successor) is that whatever they say, it’s not *guaranteed*.

So we have to *trust* our politicians on this, and, let’s be honest, trust in our politicians is pretty much rock bottom at the moment, for a number of reasons.

This is a problem as it simply doesn’t inspire confidence that we’ve drawn a line under this, even if much of Joe Public has, in the way they live their daily life at least.

I have complete trust that the present government will not re-introduce restrictions.

 

[DustyBin]

I don't think there is any chance of further restrictions regarding covid with a Conservative government. Both candidates have made that clear.

I’d very much like to believe this myself, but I could see something like mask wearing on public transport, for example, creeping back in. Some people will argue that it isn’t a restriction, and plenty more will go along with it as it’s “no biggie”. I’ll be very happy to be proven wrong on this; I’m not saying I think it will happen, but I certainly think it could.

 

[greyman42]

I’d very much like to believe this myself, but I could see something like mask wearing on public transport, for example, creeping back in. Some people will argue that it isn’t a restriction, and plenty more will go along with it as it’s “no biggie”. I’ll be very happy to be proven wrong on this; I’m not saying I think it will happen, but I certainly think it could.

I would like to think that the public would not be daft enough to go along with mask wearing again.

 

[Eyersey468]

Starmer was vehemently against the relaxation of restrictions in July 2021 - he didn't get his way, and it turned out to be the right thing to do. He was also in favour of stronger restrictions in winter 2021. Let's also not forget the virtue signalling mask show the whole Labour benches did in Parliament as we were trying to get back to normal life.

If Labour had been in charge, I have no doubt we would have had European-style longer masking, harsher masking, longer travel restrictions, and longer restrictions on life in general, which would have made this economic crisis even worse. If they truly were a non-restriction party, they would have opposed the government.

So, no, I will not trust or forgive Labour in their current guise (nor the Conservatives), and there is no chance either party will get my vote at the next election.

I agree. The chance of me voting for any of the main political parties at the next election is zero based on the last 2 years.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 22 Aug 2022 ==

Whilst in general I agree, some of us are concerned at the prospect of sleepwalking into further restrictions in a couple of months time. As nonsensical as it would be, I’m not 100% confident that it won’t happen. I think it’s more a case of being aware of the danger rather than obsessing.

I am not 100% confident it won't happen either

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 22 Aug 2022 ==

The problem is that the nature of our political system (no formal constitution, no government can bind its successor) is that whatever they say, it’s not *guaranteed*.

So we have to *trust* our politicians on this, and, let’s be honest, trust in our politicians is pretty much rock bottom at the moment, for a number of reasons.

I'm afraid my trust in politicians is completely gone

 

[Howardh]

I would like to think that the public would not be daft enough to go along with mask wearing again.

Think people with a cold/flu should wear them on public transport, as a nod to those that want to avoid illness themselves?

 

[yorkie]

Think people with a cold/flu should wear them on public transport, as a nod to those that want to avoid illness themselves?

Certainly not; that's absurd in my opinion.

Everyone is going to be exposed to Sars-CoV-2, along with the many other commonly circulating respiratory viruses, multiple times in our lifetimes.

Our immune systems are designed such that regular exposure to pathogens gives our immune system a 'boost'.

Many of us work in close proximity to many other people, including people with such viruses, and yet we have very little time off work.

If anyone wishes to "avoid illness" their best bet is probably to actually allow themselves to be regularly exposed to such viruses, however if they wish to go down the alternative path of not being exposed to pathogens, they are welcome to wear a tightly-fitting FFP3 mask, which - if worn/stored/replaced/handled in accordance with the recommended instructions - would offer excellent protection, for as long as it is worn.

Note that anyone doing this would need to wear such a mask whenever they are in proximity to any other human (and even animals!) otherwise they are merely delaying their exposure to viruses.

 

[Hans]

Think people with a cold/flu should wear them on public transport, as a nod to those that want to avoid illness themselves?

The fact the standard blue surgical mask is of no use?

 

[kez19]

I would like to think that the public would not be daft enough to go along with mask wearing again.

I would think the public has upped its game, but we know the media and some politicians/scientists will find some way to scare us again…

 

[bramling]

Think people with a cold/flu should wear them on public transport, as a nod to those that want to avoid illness themselves?

Getting ill is a fact of life, and indeed for most people is an essential part of maintaining their immune system. For those with specific vulnerabilities there are other mitigations, such as vaccination, FFP masks, etc.

 

[yorkie]

The face the standard blue surgical mask is of no use?

Indeed those type of masks are not designed to filter virus particles; anyone wanting to do that would need to wear an FFP2 mask at least.

 

[bramling]

I have complete trust that the present government will not re-introduce restrictions.

I hope you are right, but I’m afraid I simply don’t have that trust, for a number of reasons, one of which being that there seem to be few amongst them who have sufficient gumption about their persona to feel confident defending a position, or to put it another way they are liable to crack under pressure from something like sage or even the media.

The current lot will crack if that is the most politically expedient option, though the situation with the backbenchers does raise the bar, but I don’t believe it quite removes it altogether.

 

[VauxhallandI]

Think people with a cold/flu should wear them on public transport, as a nod to those that want to avoid illness themselves?

Have you learnt nothing from all this?

Don’t bother giving me a “nod”. What a pointless weak reason to justify total theatre.

 

[Razorblades]

Think people with a cold/flu should wear them on public transport, as a nod to those that want to avoid illness themselves?

Whatever floats your boat. It's in reality no better than wearing a badge or a beanie hat.

 

[DustyBin]

The fact the standard blue surgical mask is of no use?

And yet some people still won’t accept it……

 

[Silver Cobra]

One more step closer to proper normality now. As of today, anyone who isn't classified as having a weakened immune system and is not showing any Covid symptoms will no longer be tested upon being admitted into hospitals, according to the BBC.

NHS and care homes in England to pause routine Covid testing

Most hospital patients and care home residents will no longer be tested unless they fall sick.

www.bbc.co.uk

Most hospital patients and care home residents in England will no longer be tested for Covid unless they have symptoms, the government has said.
From 31 August, NHS and social care staff will also not be offered lateral flow tests unless they fall sick.
Free testing for the general public ended in April in England, but continued in some high-risk settings.
The government said UK Covid rates have fallen, meaning most testing could be paused.
It said individuals would continue to be protected through vaccination and antiviral treatments and it would keep the situation under close review.
The Department of Health said that, under the new rules, routine asymptomatic Covid testing of staff and existing patients or residents would be paused in:

• the NHS
• adult social care and hospice services
• parts of the prison estate and some places of detention
• certain domestic abuse refuges and homelessness settings

All new admissions into care homes and hospices will continue to be tested for Covid, as will patients with weakened immune systems who are admitted to hospital or transferred between wards.
Staff and patients will also still be tested if they have Covid symptoms such as a fever, persistent cough or loss of smell.

 

[Hans]

One more step closer to proper normality now. As of today, anyone who isn't classified as having a weakened immune system and is not showing any Covid symptoms will no longer be tested upon being admitted into hospitals, according to the BBC.

NHS and care homes in England to pause routine Covid testing

Most hospital patients and care home residents will no longer be tested unless they fall sick.

www.bbc.co.uk

Interesting use of the word pause though.

 

[Eyersey468]

Interesting use of the word pause though.

Yes it implies it could restart in the future

 

[nw1]

Regarding Labour and restrictions: Labour are now in a favourable position with the most likely replacement of Johnson being the dire and utterly unappealing Liz Truss whose policies seem to basically be calling the UK population lazy, unfavourably comparing our culture to sweatshop cultures like that of China, starting a trade war with the EU, and taking a hardline position on immigration.

I very much doubt Labour will call for any kind of restrictions now, as people will be more concerned about financial matters in the coming winter and restrictions are only going to do more damage to the economy.

Starmer will I suspect act like a typical politician and adjust his position based on the times. Perhaps in 2021 there was still a perception by Labour that restrictions were supported by much of the population, and they used that to put a clear line in the sand between thenselves and Johnson. However, I suspect he will now recognise that restrictions are no longer supported by most of us, and therefore not support them this coming winter with an election on the horizon. He wants to win and I suspect is smart enough to know that a pro-restriction line from here on is throwing away a golden opportunity to beat a weak opponent, much weaker than Johnson. (Johnson was a dubious character IMO but - he had personality going for him. Truss most certainly does not).

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Aug 2022 ==

I agree with the many posts on here I do not trust Starmer one single bit. The so called change to the Labour position is nothing more than reacting to the ever increasing change in the media about the covid actions taken - many are now seeing the economic damage and health issues the restrictions caused and I expect there will shortly be various spin coming from the opposition that they never were in favour of the lockdown! They will most probably airbrush away their even stronger stance than the Tories for lockdowns so they can ensure they played no part in causing the problems the country is facing.

But should we trust Truss, who seems to think we are a culture of bonidle scroungers and seems to want worse, not better, relations with the EU than Johnson?

I think the chances of Truss screwing up the country over non-Covid matters are much, much higher than Starmer, should he win the next election, screwing up the country with further harsh restrictions. By the next election I suspect economic and financial matters will be at the forefront of people's minds and the Tories' handling of that (or lack of handling, more likely - I get the impression Truss doesn't really care) will more heavily influence their voting decision than the record of the parties over Covid.

 

[duncanp]

Beware - the locktivists and maskivists haven't given up as this article shows.

Fortunately I don't think there is any chance of a return to COVID style restrictions, as most people will be worried about how to keep warm and putting food on the table this winter.

NHS ‘could need Covid-style measures to cope with winter crisis’

Chief executive of NHS Confederation calls for ‘honest conversation’ with public about capacity of health service this winter

www.telegraph.co.uk

NHS ‘could need Covid-style measures to cope with winter crisis’​

Chief executive of NHS Confederation calls for ‘honest conversation’ with public about capacity of health service this winter

An NHS boss has said some measures taken by hospitals at the height of the Covid pandemic could be needed again to deal with the winter crisis.

Matthew Taylor, the chief executive of the NHS Confederation lobbying group, called for an “honest conversation” with the public about the capacity of the health service this winter.

Mr Taylor admitted the health service may not be able to provide “some of the services that we would like to”, urging people to appreciate the pressures on doctors and nurses with hospitals already experiencing levels of strain usually seen in winter.

Likely measures include services being moved between hospitals to free up capacity and internal market competition being put aside to enable more collaboration.

Hospitals may also be encouraged to focus on specific treatments where appropriate, helping to keep patients away to prevent overcrowding.

The Telegraph understands that they will be urged to prioritise protecting patients, which could mean not following all the regulations that would normally be covered.

For example, trusts will not be judged “harshly” when patients are left in corridors while waiting for beds because this eases pressure on ambulances and avoids them not being brought in at all.

In an interview with Times Radio on Sunday, Mr Taylor said: “The two things that were critical about Covid were, first of all, we said in a sense, ‘don’t worry about the rules, the regulations and the targets – do whatever you need to do to solve the problem’.

“I think we need that similar spirit at the moment. We need to devolve to local leaders to do whatever it is they need to do to deal with the really pressing problems, like ambulance waiting times, for example.

“The second thing we did in Covid was we, the public, made a really big contribution. We tested ourselves, we stayed at home, we wore masks, we did things to try to relieve the pressure on the health service.”

Mr Taylor accepted that IVF treatment was among the services that could face delays, but stressed patients must still come forward when they feel they need to, adding: “It may be that some of the services that we would like to be able to provide, we won’t be able to in the face of the challenges.”

He suggested virtual care, in which patients are encouraged to receive treatment at home using technology including wearables, would play a central part in efforts to ease the worst of the expected crisis.

“As I’m sure you’ve heard people say, we’re in August and it feels, in the health service, like we’re in the middle of winter,” he said. “We’ve got winter to come and there are worries about flu and about another Covid variant, so there’s huge pressure.”

Mr Taylor, a former political adviser to Sir Tony Blair, was criticised for “over-dramatising” the cost of living crisis in a letter to ministers last week.

Describing the situation as a “humanitarian crisis”, he warned: “Many people could face the awful choice of skipping meals to heat their homes and having to live in cold and very unpleasant conditions.

“This could lead to outbreaks of illness and sickness around the country and widen health inequalities, worsen children’s life chances and leave an indelible scar on local communities.”

Last October, Mr Taylor called for the introduction of “Plan B” Covid restrictions some 50 days before the measures were imposed by Boris Johnson.

He also urged Mr Johnson to draw up a tougher package of “Plan C” measures, which was never introduced, and this April suggested restrictions would be needed to help the health service cope with a rise in cases.

But the NHS Confederation has now said it does not want to see any return to Covid curbs as the number of positive tests continues to fall.

 

[Razorblades]

Beware - the locktivists and maskivists haven't given up as this article shows.

Fortunately I don't think there is any chance of a return to COVID style restrictions, as most people will be worried about how to keep warm and putting food on the table this winter.

NHS ‘could need Covid-style measures to cope with winter crisis’

Chief executive of NHS Confederation calls for ‘honest conversation’ with public about capacity of health service this winter

www.telegraph.co.uk

If the authorities want an 'honest conversation' about "Covid" it will be a first! One hopes they're ready for the backlash about all their hyped-up failures including face coverings, track and trace, lockdown and doubtful, ineffectual injections.

 

[kez19]

Beware - the locktivists and maskivists haven't given up as this article shows.

Fortunately I don't think there is any chance of a return to COVID style restrictions, as most people will be worried about how to keep warm and putting food on the table this winter.

NHS ‘could need Covid-style measures to cope with winter crisis’

Chief executive of NHS Confederation calls for ‘honest conversation’ with public about capacity of health service this winter

www.telegraph.co.uk

Unless I have misread here, at the start it’s about having an honest conversation but by the end of it they say they don’t want to bring back the COVID curbs - so which is it?

Again why are the media giving this lot attention?

Edit: media favourite word “could” - so reality it probably won’t need too (so it’s just speculation nothing factual, plus the media can spin this more negatively than positive but we all know that?)

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 29 Aug 2022 ==

If the authorities want an 'honest conversation' about "Covid" it will be a first! One hopes they're ready for the backlash about all their hyped-up failures including face coverings, track and trace, lockdown and doubtful, ineffectual injections.

I better not suggest that Devi woman either, reading some of her stuff recently it’s more of a deflection of blame but people are pulling her up on there (basically Devi is digging a hole for herself).

 

[43096]

If the authorities want an 'honest conversation' about "Covid" it will be a first! One hopes they're ready for the backlash about all their hyped-up failures including face coverings, track and trace, lockdown and doubtful, ineffectual injections.

What is really needed is an honest conversation about the NHS. It's an utterly appalling organisation that needs ripping apart and starting again.