Substantive bus service withdrawals post-Covid

[duncombec]

local media reporting that KCC have found a magic money pot of a few million quid, and are putting off their proposed mass culling of services after, of all things, a tory rebellion - it turns out some parents weren't too happy that their child's only school bus was to be cut! No official announcement from KCC AFAIK.

source: https://www.kentonline.co.uk/kent/news/reckless-bus-cuts-delayed-after-tory-rebellion-272136/

It's a touch more complicated than that. The cabinet decision was 'called in' to the scrutiny committee on Thursday, and resolved to send the decision back for reconsideration on various grounds. The cuts could still happen, just perhaps not at the end of October, and the budget is officially overspending in that area. The next full council meeting is mid-September. (From the brief explanation given, the cabinet member has to reconsider it, and unless he rescinds it - unlikely - it will go to full council. They also can't rescind it, but they can strongly recommend a course of action, or, so I understand it, permit a budget variance in one way or another. It then goes back to cabinet member again for final decision.)

In fairness, the supported services cuts, which include some school routes that will have to be replaced in some way as they carry legally entitled scholars, were somewhat conflated with commercial changes, especially in west Kent, which certainly helped some of the non-school supported services.

The full two-hour scrutiny meeting is on the Kent County Council website as a webcast should anyone be interested!

 

[JD2168]

I’ve not heard or seen any announcements about this around the Mansfield area. Where has it been announced. The Travel South Yorkshire list of service changes for Sheffield states that the 53 is to continue unchanged. This was updated today.

It would be the end of an era if that service was withdrawn. I remember travelling on it from Mansfield to Sheffield as a child in the 1960’s to visit relatives in Sheffield. I’m sure in those days it was a number 3 and not 53. Definitely was hourly and operated by East Midland Motor Services double deckers and regularly used to have a change of driver at Clowne bus depot.

When I posted this the Travel South Yorkshire website said the 53 was withdrawn with a timetable showing only the 53a as running, it appears the 53 has had a reprieve for a while.

 

[ChrisC]

When I posted this the Travel South Yorkshire website said the 53 was withdrawn with a timetable showing only the 53a as running, it appears the 53 has had a reprieve for a while.

Thanks. I thought that was probably what had happened when the website had been updated yesterday. I think it’s another one of those routes where if people don’t use it more it won’t last much longer.

 

[DelayRepay]

Can you park somewhere where you can walk to work, or where you can get a more regular bus?

Sorry, I know I'm replying to an old post but I missed it originally.

The point was that pre-covid, I used the bus because there was a good service, including in the evening, and there was nowhere to park.

Now there is a very poor bus service and lots of empty parking spaces outside my office, so I drive instead.

The bus has lost my fare which, if repeated, will no doubt lead to further cuts.

 

[Ken H]

Sorry, I know I'm replying to an old post but I missed it originally.

The point was that pre-covid, I used the bus because there was a good service, including in the evening, and there was nowhere to park.

Now there is a very poor bus service and lots of empty parking spaces outside my office, so I drive instead.

The bus has lost my fare which, if repeated, will no doubt lead to further cuts.

This is the double whammy. People go to work less (working from home), so the roads are quieter. So one of the main selling points of public transport - congestion avoidance - has gone. so the residual traffic drives.

 

[Dai Corner]

This is the double whammy. People go to work less (working from home), so the roads are quieter. So one of the main selling points of public transport - congestion avoidance - has gone. so the residual traffic drives.

Yep. Public transport, particularly local buses, is becoming less a way of squeezing everyone who needs to travel in urban areas at peak times onto the limited infrastructure and more a social service for those who have no alternative.

 

[RT4038]

Yep. Public transport, particularly local buses, is becoming less a way of squeezing everyone who needs to travel in urban areas at peak times onto the limited infrastructure and more a social service for those who have no alternative.

Outside of the Cities it has been like that for quite a long time already.

 

[RELL6L]

An update to my schedule of cuts, some added including a few I have found reference to elsewhere but not on this forum at all.

Operator & route	Between	Outcome	Funded
Go Cornwall 11	Liskeard to Bodmin Parkway, hourly	Reprieved, mostly hourly, temporary. Through route to Bodmin town, Wadebridge and Padstow lost but still connections. Now back to hourly throughout (Sep 22)
Stagecoach South West 92	Totnes to Dartmouth, roughly two hourly	Reprieved, similar timetable	Devon
Stagecoach West 32,132	Newent to Ross & Ledbury, each two hourly	Withdrawn except school journeys to Ross. Gloucester to Newent remains
Stagecoach South / Reading 7	Aldershot to Reading, hourly, connecting at Hartley Wintney	Withdrawn. Some remains Aldershot to Fleet and Hartley Wintney, Reading Buses have covered Reading to Riseley, both much reduced
Arriva Kent 308	Gravesend to Sevenoaks, every 90 minutes	Reprieved, operated by Redroute to same times	Kent
Arriva Kent 155	Chatham to Maidstone, hourly through service	Still runs Chatham to Borstal, rest cut back to school journeys, very occasional shopper bus
Metroline 84	Barnet to St Albans via Potters Bar, 30 minutes	Reprieved between Potters Bar and St Albans by Sullivan, withdrawn Potters Bar to Barnet	Hertfordshire
Stagecoach Oxford 200	Banbury to Daventry hourly	Reprieved temporarily, extended to Jan 2023	Oxfordshire & Northamptonshire
Stagecoach East 41	Bedford to Northampton, currently 90 minutes	Still running every 90 minutes
Centrebus 19	Melton Mowbray to Nottingham, two hourly	Withdrawn
Travel Wright	All services ceased, not sure if anything was commercial or substantive.	Some been taken over. 367 Newark to Collingham and beyond remains, Gem Mini Travel. Some lost?
Hulley X57	Snake Pass, Ladybower to Glossop, two hourly	Withdrawn. Maybe a special case as introduction was so recent.
Arriva Midlands North 9	Wolverhampton to Bridgnorth, hourly	Temporary reprieve, unchanged	Shropshire
Arriva Midlands North 544/546	Shrewsbury to Little Lythe / Pulverbatch, combined hourly	Temporary reprieve, unchanged	Shropshire
Arriva Midlands N 738/740	Knighton to Ludlow, 4 times a day	Reprieved temporarily	Shropshire
Arriva North East 86	Bishop Auckland to Toft Hill, hourly	Replaced by Rural Link 87	Durham
Stagecoach Worcester 144	Bromsgrove to Longbridge (& Birmingham), hourly	Temporary NXWM service 144a every 70 minutes	Worcestershire
East Yorkshire 45	Market Weighton to Driffield, two hourly	Token service, mostly withdrawn, through links to day trip in Bridlington lost.	E Yorkshire
East Yorkshire 55	Elloughton to Gilberdyke, hourly	Retained off peak, all peak service to Hull withdrawn	E Yorkshire
Stagecoach N Lancs 80,81	Lancaster to Kirkby Lonsdale and Ingleton, hourly combined	Reprieved within Lancashire by K Lonsdale Coach Hire in different format, token replacement in Yorkshire	Lancashire
Stagecoach East Kent 7	Canterbury to Herne Bay via Hoath, hourly	Withdrawn between Canterbury and Hillborough (Herne Bay)
High Peak Transpeak	Derby to Matlock, hourly	Reprieved, continues unchanged	Derbyshire
Diamond 15	Tamworth to Hurley, hourly	Reprieved, renumbered 76B	Partnership with Warwickshire
Diamond X20	Solihull to Stratford, hourly	Replaced by Stagecoach X20, hourly	Warwickshire
Diamond 35	Walsall to Lichfield, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
Diamond 52	Redditch to Kidderminster, hourly	Reprieved	Partnership with Worcestershire
Diamond 247	Redditch to Evesham via Alcester, hourly	Reprieved, reduced frequency and different route Reddith-Studley	Partnership with Worcestershire
Stagecoach Devon 1	Tiverton to Cullompton via Uffculme, hourly	Replaced by Stagecoach & Dartline funded service 373	Devon
Stagecoach Devon 4	Cranbrook to Honiton half hourly, Axminster hourly	Replaced by Stagecoach funded services 44/44A, reduced frequency	Devon
Stagecoach Devon 9A	Seaton to Lyme Regis, hourly	Partly replaced by Axe Valley Mini Travel service 378, 2-5 journeys per day	Devon
Stagecoach Cumbria 93/A	Carlisle to Bowness on Solway, 5 journeys	Reprieved	Carlisle and Allerdale councils
Stagecoach West Scotland X34/36	Glasgow to Ardrossan, hourly	X36 temporary reprieve, hourly Glasgow to Dalry, 2 peak journeys Ardrossan	SPT / Scottish government?
Trent Barton 141	Nottingham to Hucknall, Mansfield, Sutton via villages, hourly	Reprieved by Nottinghamshire for a year, Stagecoach running	Nottinghamshire
Go North East 25	Chester-le-Street to Langley Park, 30 mins	Replaced by Weardale 725, hourly	Durham
Go North East 30 & 31	Stanley to Quaking Houses 2bph, East Stanley 1bph	Replaced by J H Travel, same times	Durham
Carousel 103	Amersham to Rickmansworth, hourly	Partly replaced by Arriva 335/336, four journeys to Amersham	Bucks, Herts?
Carousel 40	High Wycombe to Thame, hourly	Being continued by Red Rose, mainly commercial
Stagecoach West Scotland 101/101A/102	Edinburgh to Biggar, hourly, 4 journeys to Moffat and Dumfries, tendered	Reprieved until March 2023	Scottish Borders?
Centrebus RF1	Melton Mowbray to Corby, hourly	Replacement from Blands R1, reduced to 7/8 journeys	Rutland
Centrebus 9	Stamford to Oakham	Replacement Rutland minibus R9, reduced	Rutland
Stagecoach South East 11	Canterbury to Westwood, 5 journeys	School and one off-peak journey reprieved, to be confirmed	Kent?
Stagecoach Manchester 237	Ashton under Lyne to Glossop, every 20 mins	Only just announced – from October, may not be the full picture
Stagecoach Manchester 358	Stockport to Marple, New Mills, Hayfield, hourly	Only just announced – from October, may not be the full picture
Stagecoach Manchester	Many other routes	More info to follow, but high likelihood of replacement by TfGM
Carousel 103 (again)	Beaconsfield to Amersham, hourly	Withdrawn, diverted instead from Beaconsfield to Slough
First West of England 173	Bath to Wells, hourly	Proposal reversed by First
First West of England 126	Wells to Weston Super Mare, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
First West of England X2	Bristol to Yatton, hourly	Proposed to withdraw
First West of England X5	Bristol to Weston via Portishead & Clevedon, hourly	Temporary reprieve announced between Portishead and Worle
First Potteries Kingfisher (32)	Hanley to Uttoxeter, hourly	Looks like it may be replaced by D & G Buses
Kinch 2	Loughborough to Leicester via Sileby, hourly	Reduced to Loughborough to Sileby only, approx every 80 minutes
Stagecoach Yorkshire 53	Mansfield to Sheffield via Clowne, 6 journeys	Reprieved
Go Cornwall 46,47	Village routes between Redruth & Truro, hourly	Withdrawn, some local replacements
Go Cornwall 74	Liskeard to Callington	Very substantially reduced between Liskeard and Pensilva except school times
Go Cornwall 76	Launceston to Bodmin	Withdrawn, was experimental, probably never a good idea.
Go Cornwall	Some other more obscure services introduced in 2020 have been withdrawn	Most were probably never going to be sustainable.

 

[TheGrandWazoo]

Go Cornwall 76

Launceston to Bodmin

Withdrawn, was experimental, probably never a good idea.

You're telling me.

Could never see the logic behind it!

 

[anthony263]

Ridgeway port talbot been sold to DJ Thomas coaches in Baglan so far they keeping Ridgeway two services around Port talbot.

Jervis coaches who are out regularly on rail replacement and school services also announced tonight the owner is retiring and closing the business down

 

[markymark2000]

Ridgeway port talbot been sold to DJ Thomas coaches in Baglan so far they keeping Ridgeway two services around Port talbot.

Jervis coaches who are out regularly on rail replacement and school services also announced tonight the owner is retiring and closing the business down

Do we have any sources for these?

 

[anthony263]

Do we have any sources for these?

Ridgeway told to me by their drivers themselves plus the jervis announcement was off their Facebook account. I've added the screenshots

Facebook

www.facebook.com

Well that's it.
And now, the end is near
And so I face the final curtain
My friend, I'll make it clear
I'll state my case, of which I am certain
I've lived a life that's full
I've traveled each and every highway
And more, much more
I did it, I did it my way
Jervis coaches is no more, We would like to thank all all and new Customers, many of who begged for us to carry on but boss man is Retiring.
You be happy to know most staff have found alternative employment or Retiring and are really going to miss working together.
Here we see most of the staff on our last staff meal

 

[duncombec]

The new timetable for Stagecoach East Kent service 11 has now been published, to update the table above.

https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/South%20East/Kent/11%20as%20at%2030%20Aug%202022.pdf

It sees one return journey into Canterbury, primarily aimed at school children but running each Monday to Friday, and a shoppers journey (ex Canterbury 09:30, ex Westwood 14:28) focussed on Thanet. There does appear to be an error on the outbound shoppers journey, though, as it loses an hour somewhere! Of note, funding has come from Kent County Council.

Less substantial in nature, but nevertheless worthy of mention, two return journeys on Whitstable - Faversham service 638 are back-extended to Kiln Court on Mondays to Fridays, re-instating a service over that local Faversham section.

 

[Eyersey468]

East Yorkshire are making changes to more services next month including the withdrawal of the 151, reduction in frequency of the 24 and 25 and withdrawal of the late night 121s beyond Leconfield apart from Friday and Saturday nights

Service Changes from 4 September

Find out if you'll be affected by our upcoming service changes.

www.eastyorkshirebuses.co.uk

 

[Typhoon]

The new timetable for Stagecoach East Kent service 11 has now been published, to update the table above.

https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/South%20East/Kent/11%20as%20at%2030%20Aug%202022.pdf

It sees one return journey into Canterbury, primarily aimed at school children but running each Monday to Friday, and a shoppers journey (ex Canterbury 09:30, ex Westwood 14:28) focussed on Thanet. There does appear to be an error on the outbound shoppers journey, though, as it loses an hour somewhere! Of note, funding has come from Kent County Council.

Less substantial in nature, but nevertheless worthy of mention, two return journeys on Whitstable - Faversham service 638 are back-extended to Kiln Court on Mondays to Fridays, re-instating a service over that local Faversham section.

Thanks for that. I reckon I can walk from Plucks Gutter to Monkton in 67 minutes (not along the road though).

I had heard that money to keep some of the school runs was coming from the education budget,presumably because getting those eligible for free school meals to school by taxi would cost more than keeping a couple of bus journeys. Whether that is correct ...

It would interesting to know the take up of the shopper's services. Assuming the departure time from Canterbury is correct, 3 hours 43 minutes is rather a long time to be shopping!

On a related matter, Roger French considers the cuts to shoppers services in Kent in https://busandtrainuser.com/2022/08/23/end-of-the-road-for-kents-shopper-buses/ where he considers services 123 (Stagecoach), 293, 299 (both Autocar) and 542 (Regent).

 

[M803UYA]

I had heard that money to keep some of the school runs was coming from the education budget,presumably because getting those eligible for free school meals to school by taxi would cost more than keeping a couple of bus journeys. Whether that is correct ...

It might be indirectly. As Kent operates a selective school system it effectively purchases seats on commercially operated services. When the Freedom pass came in, operators were reimbursed the full single fare for journeys taken by passholders. Passes are bought by parents for their children to use on bus services.
Stagecoach didn't issue child fares prior to 0930, so they would have been getting 100% of the adult single fare for the distance. Arriva does issue child fares prior to 0930, so has the opposite issue of full buses not covering costs.
Looking at the timetable for the 11 it's two round trips and basically the return trip to depot of the school working. So that might be a de-minimis contract not needing to be tendered.

 

[Man of Kent]

Stagecoach didn't issue child fares prior to 0930, so they would have been getting 100% of the adult single fare for the distance. Arriva does issue child fares prior to 0930, so has the opposite issue of full buses not covering costs.

This has changed at some point - I think in 2019 - and child fares are now available on Stagecoach in Kent all day, bringing it into line with the East Sussex operations. In any event, the larger operators tended to be on fixed rate reimbursements anyway, for both what is now called Kent Travel Saver and ENCTS.

I had heard that money to keep some of the school runs was coming from the education budget

This was one of the criticisms at the Select Committee, that no figures were made available for the alternative cost of free school transport for those so entitled if bus services were withdrawn. However, Kent has screwed down eligibility for free travel so tightly that most pupils attending a selective school will not be entitled if there is a nearer non-selective school. This indeed would fall directly on the education budget, although there were always internal transfers to Highways, to account for entitled pupils on subsidised routes.

 

[Typhoon]

This has changed at some point - I think in 2019 - and child fares are now available on Stagecoach in Kent all day, bringing it into line with the East Sussex operations. In any event, the larger operators tended to be on fixed rate reimbursements anyway, for both what is now called Kent Travel Saver and ENCTS.

This was one of the criticisms at the Select Committee, that no figures were made available for the alternative cost of free school transport for those so entitled if bus services were withdrawn. However, Kent has screwed down eligibility for free travel so tightly that most pupils attending a selective school will not be entitled if there is a nearer non-selective school. This indeed would fall directly on the education budget, although there were always internal transfers to Highways, to account for entitled pupils on subsidised routes.

Thank you for that. I was aware that those from poorer backgrounds were being discouraged from aiming too high. I know the feeling, not much has changed in 60 years. I guess by 'nearer non-selective school' it means one with places available? Assuming this to be true, the council is not helped by the imbalance of secondary schools - Canterbury has 7 (3 grammar, 4 non selective - including one faith school), plus the one at Sturry while the coastal fringe has 2 (and any attempts to expand meet resistance from city schools, keen to keep their numbers up) meaning that there is a daily migration of pupils towards the City.

Bus routes like the 11 serve areas which are some distance from any secondary school so I guess some pupils there might qualify (although having mooched around there in the last few weeks while I still can, probably not too many).

 

[RELL6L]

East Yorkshire are making changes to more services next month including the withdrawal of the 151, reduction in frequency of the 24 and 25 and withdrawal of the late night 121s beyond Leconfield apart from Friday and Saturday nights

Service Changes from 4 September

Find out if you'll be affected by our upcoming service changes.

www.eastyorkshirebuses.co.uk

These are poor.
The 128 to go to a straight two-hourly through to Helmsley - first departure from Helmsley 10.25, only 5 journeys instead of 7 - this used to be an hourly service, the compromise X28 and 128 two hourly seemed good, providing a faster service for the main destinations, I travelled on this in April and it seemed quite well-patronised.
The 24 reduced to every 90 minutes Hull-Leven-Hornsea. So instead of working nicely with the 25 to provide a bus every 30 minutes between Leven and Hornsea that's gone entirely.
Not good!

 

[Delenn]

These are poor.
The 128 to go to a straight two-hourly through to Helmsley - first departure from Helmsley 10.25, only 5 journeys instead of 7 - this used to be an hourly service, the compromise X28 and 128 two hourly seemed good, providing a faster service for the main destinations, I travelled on this in April and it seemed quite well-patronised.

Indeed. I find the "Because of low levels of usage" line to be somewhat strange. Some sections of the route maybe, but Pickering to Scarborough seems well used whenever we go near it. A real shame to be chipping away at the attractiveness of the route again. Will be interesting to see if they increase the frequency over the summer next year.

 

[Eyersey468]

Indeed. I find the "Because of low levels of usage" line to be somewhat strange. Some sections of the route maybe, but Pickering to Scarborough seems well used whenever we go near it. A real shame to be chipping away at the attractiveness of the route again. Will be interesting to see if they increase the frequency over the summer next year.

A lot depends also on whether the passengers using it are passholders or farepayers.

 

[HullRailMan]

East Yorkshire are making changes to more services next month including the withdrawal of the 151, reduction in frequency of the 24 and 25 and withdrawal of the late night 121s beyond Leconfield apart from Friday and Saturday nights

Service Changes from 4 September

Find out if you'll be affected by our upcoming service changes.

www.eastyorkshirebuses.co.uk

Parts of Willerby and Hessle Won’t have a bus service for the first time in years. Plenty of negative press too, especially about the 152 being truncated at Anlaby and no longer serving the Bridgehead Business Park. Not a great look for EY that these cuts were being discussed widely, including in the local rag, well before the announcement was put out.

Also interesting to note there is no sign of the 103 and 122 that were ‘temporarily’ suspended coming back. Hull’s bus lanes, which are now in operation all day, will be seeing fewer buses than ever before!

 

[SouthEastBuses]

Omg (oh my god). So many bus routes in the UK are being withdrawn or severely reduced, to a scale that I could have never imagined. And it only seems to be getting worse. What next, will UK end up being like Italy in that even more bus services will be severely cut to the point that you'll have no choice but to drive, and the few buses that do actually turn up and work end up being crush loaded beyond capacity.

And I thought the UK was good with public transport...

 

[Cesarcollie]

Omg (oh my god). So many bus routes in the UK are being withdrawn or severely reduced, to a scale that I could have never imagined. And it only seems to be getting worse. What next, will UK end up being like Italy in that even more bus services will be severely cut to the point that you'll have no choice but to drive, and the few buses that do actually turn up and work end up being crush loaded beyond capacity.

And I thought the UK was good with public transport...

I don’t think too many buses will be crush loaded, or we wouldn’t be facing this mess……

 

[Baxenden Bank]

What I would regard as substantive cuts to First Potteries services from the end of September.

Already meagre evening services trimmed further. Very rapidly becoming a 'buses stop when the shops stop' kind of operation.
Sunday services trimmed in times of operation, length of route covered or cut entirely. Just don't bother leaving the house.
Saturday services a similar but less drastic pattern. But you can see where they are heading, just following the pattern of Sunday cuts with a time delay.

Some improvements in frequency though: on the 3, 11 and 25 (Hanley to Butt Lane, Newcastle very indirectly and Keele University respectively).

Details available from Traveline South West.

 

[DunsBus]

What I would regard as substantive cuts to First Potteries services from the end of September.

Already meagre evening services trimmed further. Very rapidly becoming a 'buses stop when the shops stop' kind of operation.
Sunday services trimmed in times of operation, length of route covered or cut entirely. Just don't bother leaving the house.
Saturday services a similar but less drastic pattern. But you can see where they are heading, just following the pattern of Sunday cuts with a time delay.

Some improvements in frequency though: on the 3, 11 and 25 (Hanley to Butt Lane, Newcastle very indirectly and Keele University respectively).

Details available from Traveline South West.

Where I am, the last bus from Berwick leaves before the shops shut, at 4.45pm. Pre Covid it was much later, at 8.15pm.
If you miss the 4.45pm bus then you're sunk, as the recently-introduced Pingo DRT service only goes as far as the Morrisons supermarket on Berwick's northern outskirts and doesn't serve the town centre. Repeated requests from passengers for a later bus from Berwick have fallen on deaf ears and, given that the last bus from Berwick has been at 4.45pm for well over two years now, this now seems to be permanent; any surveys undertaken by Borders Buses in the last couple of years have resulted in mere timetable tweaks and little in the way of service enhancements.

 

[Baxenden Bank]

Where I am, the last bus from Berwick leaves before the shops shut, at 4.45pm. Pre Covid it was much later, at 8.15pm.
If you miss the 4.45pm bus then you're sunk, as the recently-introduced Pingo DRT service only goes as far as the Morrisons supermarket on Berwick's northern outskirts and doesn't serve the town centre. Repeated requests from passengers for a later bus from Berwick have fallen on deaf ears and, given that the last bus from Berwick has been at 4.45pm for well over two years now, this now seems to be permanent; any surveys undertaken by Borders Buses in the last couple of years have resulted in mere timetable tweaks and little in the way of service enhancements.

You have my sympathy, your next stop will be to reduce to the 'last bus is before it goes off to do a school run' timetable, say at 1445! The difference is that Stoke-on-Trent has a population of 250,000 and The Potteries conurbation around 350,000 (depends where you draw the lines - urban area only or satellite suburbs / towns). To be in a situation where the last bus on many routes is around 1830 puts us into the 'small market town serving smaller surrounding towns / villages' type of service.

 

[WM Bus]

An update to my schedule of cuts, some added including a few I have found reference to elsewhere but not on this forum at all.

First Worcester not Stagecoach.
Stagecoach don't have any services in Birmingham and haven't for many years and of course neither do First anymore.
NXWM 144A runs Longbridge - Bromsgrove only.
Diamond Walsall - Lichfield 35's last day is today I think, X16 Birmingham - Tamworth estates was yesterday.

On the other hand NX enhance the 28 from every 15 mins back to every 12 from early October.

 

[johncrossley]

And I thought the UK was good with public transport...

Where you did you get that idea? It has long had one of the worst reputations in Europe. Nowhere else in western Europe and probably most of the rest of Europe funds buses less.

 

[SouthEastBuses]

Where you did you get that idea? It has long had one of the worst reputations in Europe. Nowhere else in western Europe and probably most of the rest of Europe funds buses less.

Nah, trust me, Italy is even worse. And Greece...