SBB Cargo(not international) orders Vectron AC

[Stephen Lee]

Reichmuth orders 35 Vectron locomotives for SBB Cargo | Press | Company | Siemens

Reichmuth & Co Investment Management AG has ordered 35 Vectron AC locomotives from Siemens Mobility through its investment vehicle LokRoll 3 AG. LokRol ...

press.siemens.com

Seems like Re10/10s are getting older and are ready to be retired. But I wondered if the bombardier locos from SBB Cargo International will be sent to SBB Cargo as well.......

 

[43096]

Reichmuth orders 35 Vectron locomotives for SBB Cargo | Press | Company | Siemens

Reichmuth & Co Investment Management AG has ordered 35 Vectron AC locomotives from Siemens Mobility through its investment vehicle LokRoll 3 AG. LokRol ...

press.siemens.com

Seems like Re10/10s are getting older and are ready to be retired. But I wondered if the bombardier locos from SBB Cargo International will be sent to SBB Cargo as well.......

The Re484s have already been taken off SBB Cargo International workings into Italy (replaced by Vectrons and ES64F4s) and are now used by SBB Cargo on internal Swiss workings. Logic would suggest the same might happen with the Re482s: SBB Cargo International definitely has a traction strategy that prefers Siemens locos and they have also recently ordered another 20 Vectron MS locos.

 

[MacCookie]

The Re484s have already been taken off SBB Cargo International workings into Italy (replaced by Vectrons and ES64F4s) and are now used by SBB Cargo on internal Swiss workings. Logic would suggest the same might happen with the Re482s: SBB Cargo International definitely has a traction strategy that prefers Siemens locos and they have also recently ordered another 20 Vectron MS locos.

The problem with the Re 484s (and the Re 474s) is that they are CH/I, whilst the Re 482s are either CH/D or CH/D/A, so in both cases SBB Cargo Intl need to do a loco change at one or other border. I can see all three fleets being handed back to SBB Cargo as SBB Cargo Intl goes for more MS locos that can do end to end journeys across the Alps. There may also be multi-working issues, as it will be easier to plan their fleet allocations for the services that need to be double-headed through Switzerland if they all work together (although BLS Cargo have got their TRAXX, Vectrons, and Re 465s, working in multi now).

SBB Cargo have also started to sell off some the Re 482s as there's a reasonably healthy market in Germany for second hand elocs.

 

[Stephen Lee]

The problem with the Re 484s (and the Re 474s) is that they are CH/I, whilst the Re 482s are either CH/D or CH/D/A, so in both cases SBB Cargo Intl need to do a loco change at one or other border. I can see all three fleets being handed back to SBB Cargo as SBB Cargo Intl goes for more MS locos that can do end to end journeys across the Alps. There may also be multi-working issues, as it will be easier to plan their fleet allocations for the services that need to be double-headed through Switzerland if they all work together (although BLS Cargo have got their TRAXX, Vectrons, and Re 465s, working in multi now).

SBB Cargo have also started to sell off some the Re 482s as there's a reasonably healthy market in Germany for second hand elocs.

SBB Cargo already sold the newer Re482s off

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Jul 2022 ==

The problem with the Re 484s (and the Re 474s) is that they are CH/I, whilst the Re 482s are either CH/D or CH/D/A, so in both cases SBB Cargo Intl need to do a loco change at one or other border. I can see all three fleets being handed back to SBB Cargo as SBB Cargo Intl goes for more MS locos that can do end to end journeys across the Alps. There may also be multi-working issues, as it will be easier to plan their fleet allocations for the services that need to be double-headed through Switzerland if they all work together (although BLS Cargo have got their TRAXX, Vectrons, and Re 465s, working in multi now).

SBB Cargo have also started to sell off some the Re 482s as there's a reasonably healthy market in Germany for second hand elocs.

So you think Re474s will move to SBB Cargo too?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 Jul 2022 ==

The problem with the Re 484s (and the Re 474s) is that they are CH/I, whilst the Re 482s are either CH/D or CH/D/A, so in both cases SBB Cargo Intl need to do a loco change at one or other border. I can see all three fleets being handed back to SBB Cargo as SBB Cargo Intl goes for more MS locos that can do end to end journeys across the Alps. There may also be multi-working issues, as it will be easier to plan their fleet allocations for the services that need to be double-headed through Switzerland if they all work together (although BLS Cargo have got their TRAXX, Vectrons, and Re 465s, working in multi now).

SBB Cargo have also started to sell off some the Re 482s as there's a reasonably healthy market in Germany for second hand elocs.

So you think Re474s will move to SBB Cargo too?

 

[MacCookie]

Currently SBB Cargo have Re 482s leased to SBB Cargo International and other German operators, plus some sold, the Re 484s that they are using themselves now, and the Re 474s that are leased to SBB Cargo International.

SBB Cargo International have recently swapped out the Vectron AC locos that they were leasing from ELL for Vectron MS locos.

SBB Cargo International will be the launch customer for the Vectron MS XLoad, which has been designed to haul freight through the Alps without the need to double-head. Twenty locos will be leased from SüdLeasing. https://press.siemens.com/global/en...omotives-xload-behalf-sbb-cargo-international

So the question is whether the twenty new locos are for new traffic, or if there are leases with ELL, MRCE, or SBB Cargo that will end around 2024 that will allow older locos to be off-leased. Having a uniform fleet of Siemens locos or locos that can do B/NL-D-CH-I end to end trips makes a lot of sense, so I would bet on the Re 482s being handed back in the first instance. But I wouldn't be surprised if SBB Cargo International try to replace the Re 474s over the next few years.

Cheers,
Ewan

 

[43096]

Currently SBB Cargo have Re 482s leased to SBB Cargo International and other German operators, plus some sold, the Re 484s that they are using themselves now, and the Re 474s that are leased to SBB Cargo International.

SBB Cargo International have recently swapped out the Vectron AC locos that they were leasing from ELL for Vectron MS locos.

SBB Cargo International will be the launch customer for the Vectron MS XLoad, which has been designed to haul freight through the Alps without the need to double-head. Twenty locos will be leased from SüdLeasing. https://press.siemens.com/global/en...omotives-xload-behalf-sbb-cargo-international

So the question is whether the twenty new locos are for new traffic, or if there are leases with ELL, MRCE, or SBB Cargo that will end around 2024 that will allow older locos to be off-leased. Having a uniform fleet of Siemens locos or locos that can do B/NL-D-CH-I end to end trips makes a lot of sense, so I would bet on the Re 482s being handed back in the first instance. But I wouldn't be surprised if SBB Cargo International try to replace the Re 474s over the next few years.

Cheers,
Ewan

SBB Cargo International have taken on lease around 10 Vectron MS from MRCE in recent months, which MRCE have had upgraded from D-A-I configuration to D-A-CH-I-NL. However these seem to be a straight swap for a similar number of ES64F4s (189s) that have been handed back to MRCE, because MRCE have sold them to Akiem.

 

[MacCookie]

SBB Cargo International have taken on lease around 10 Vectron MS from MRCE in recent months, which MRCE have had upgraded from D-A-I configuration to D-A-CH-I-NL. However these seem to be a straight swap for a similar number of ES64F4s (189s) that have been handed back to MRCE, because MRCE have sold them to Akiem.

At least two ELL Vectron MSs were moved from SBB Cargo Intl to TXL (193 256, 257), and some of the MRCE Vectron MSs were previously leased to TXL (193 657, 660, and a couple more).

In 2020 SBB Cargo Intl returned at least three Vectron ACs (193 201, 209, 210) back to ELL. The timing coincides with the Südleasing 193s arriving.

 

[Stephen Lee]

SBB Cargo International have taken on lease around 10 Vectron MS from MRCE in recent months, which MRCE have had upgraded from D-A-I configuration to D-A-CH-I-NL. However these seem to be a straight swap for a similar number of ES64F4s (189s) that have been handed back to MRCE, because MRCE have sold them to Akiem.

Should SBB cargo international also lease vectron from Akiem???

 

[43096]

Should SBB cargo international also lease vectron from Akiem???

Why Akiem in particular? Akiem only have two Vectrons currently (from the mgw service acquisition) but have 20 on order, but not of the specification that SBB Cargo International would want. The 20 that SBB CI have ordered are to be financed by Südleasing, so evidently they don’t want Akiem locos!

 

[Stephen Lee]

Why Akiem in particular? Akiem only have two Vectrons currently (from the mgw service acquisition) but have 20 on order, but not of the specification that SBB Cargo International would want. The 20 that SBB CI have ordered are to be financed by Südleasing, so evidently they don’t want Akiem locos!

well…..I hope Railpool had this specification too….

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 20 Jul 2022 ==

Why Akiem in particular? Akiem only have two Vectrons currently (from the mgw service acquisition) but have 20 on order, but not of the specification that SBB Cargo International would want. The 20 that SBB CI have ordered are to be financed by Südleasing, so evidently they don’t want Akiem locos!

Btw those leased from Lokroll are only D-CH-I specification

 

[duesselmartin]

The Re484s have already been taken off SBB Cargo International workings into Italy (replaced by Vectrons and ES64F4s) and are now used by SBB Cargo on internal Swiss workings. Logic would suggest the same might happen with the Re482s: SBB Cargo International definitely has a traction strategy that prefers Siemens locos and they have also recently ordered another 20 Vectron MS locos.

so there is hope that the Re4/4 amd Re6/6 will survive for longer?

 

[43096]

so there is hope that the Re4/4 amd Re6/6 will survive for longer?

I suspect the 20 loco order for SBB Cargo International may well displace Re474s and/or Re482s back to SBB Cargo, which will have an impact on Re4/4 and Re6/6. Likewise, it's hard to see the SBB Cargo Vectron AC order being for anything other than Re4/4 and Re6/6 replacement.

 

[MacCookie]

Btw those leased from Lokroll are only D-CH-I specification

D-A-CH-I