Disabled Persons Railcard for non-UK citizens

[londiscape]

I'd like to ask a question on behalf of my friend's family if I may - apologies for vagueness but I wish to protect their privacy on a public forum.

Points are as follows:

- Person A is neither a UK nor EU citizen, but now resides in the UK legally with mother and stepfather
- Person A's mother is also not a UK or E U citizen, but is married to someone who is a UK citizen, hence Person A's stepfather is British.
- Person A has a disability and is 21 years old
- Person A has (apparently) no entitlement to disability benefits either in person or for family - and has been told this
- Because of the lack of benefits, Person A has been told that they have no entitlement to a Disabled Persons Railcard, and that entitlement depends on disability benefits

At first sight I've advised my friend that Person A can have a Young persons railcard instead, on the principle that proof of age is enough to satisfy requirements for this, and it offers the same discount.

However on reflection I'm unsure - should I have advised this? And why is the Disabled person's railcard supposedly based on benefits when it should be on having a disability?

Any advice welcome, many thanks in advance.

 

[skyhigh]

And why is the Disabled person's railcard supposedly based on benefits when it should be on having a disability?

The eligibility criteria is:

You are eligible for the Disabled Persons Railcard if you:

receive Personal Independence Payments (PIP)
receive Disability Living Allowance (DLA) at either:
the higher or lower rate for the mobility component, or
the higher or middle rate for the care component
have a visual impairment
have a hearing impairment
have epilepsy
receive Attendance Allowance or Severe Disablement Allowance
receive War Pensioner's Mobility Supplement
receive War or Service Disablement Pension for 80% or more disability
buy or lease a vehicle through the Motability scheme

Are You Eligible - Disabled Persons Railcard

www.disabledpersons-railcard.co.uk

So it depends on the nature of the disability - they may or may not be eligible.

 

[plugwash]

Unfortunately it does appear to be the case that for most disabilities if you don't get benefits (or get DLA at the lower rate for care only ) then you aren't eligable for a disable railcard. I presume the reason is that the railway don't want to be in the business of assessing people's disability. So they base their critera off things for which someone can show official paperwork.

The 16-25 railcard gets you the same percentage discount, but it has more restrictions on when it can be used.

 

[Watershed]

Unfortunately it does appear to be the case that for most disabilities if you don't get benefits (or get DLA at the lower rate for care only ) then you aren't eligable for a disable railcard. I presume the reason is that the railway don't want to be in the business of assessing people's disability. So they base their critera off things for which someone can show official paperwork.

The 16-25 railcard gets you the same percentage discount, but it has more restrictions on when it can be used.

It also can't be used to discount walk-up First Class fares and doesn't give any discount for an accompanying passenger.

 

[AlterEgo]

It would be helpful to know the nature of the disability; some of the qualifying criteria do not require proof of benefits and can be awarded simply on some other proof.

Unfortunately, if their status is "without recourse to public funds", they won't qualify for benefits regardless of the nature of their disability. They will however qualify for an age-related railcard regardless of immigration status.

 

[londiscape]

Thank you all for your replies.

@AlterEgo - person A has Down's syndrome.

Person A is also able to travel independently without accompaniment by a carer.

However at first sight it would appear that this doesn't change anything very much according to criteria very helpfully posted by @skyhigh (thank you for this) - I'm leaning back towards my original advice to use a Young persons railcard instead - I don't believe Person A has much interest in First class discounts etc so additional Disabled persons railcard benefits may not be of much use.

Would this be sensible?

Thanks again

D

 

[AlterEgo]

Thank you all for your replies.

@AlterEgo - person A has Down's syndrome.

Person A is also able to travel independently without accompaniment by a carer.

However at first sight it would appear that this doesn't change anything very much according to criteria very helpfully posted by @skyhigh (thank you for this) - I'm leaning back towards my original advice to use a Young persons railcard instead - I don't believe Person A has much interest in First class discounts etc so additional Disabled persons railcard benefits may not be of much use.

Would this be sensible?

Thanks again

D

I think the 16-25 would be a good backstop, but if the disabled person has to travel with a carer then a Disabled Adult railcard allows a carer to travel on the discount (if they ever need it in the future that is), and also comes with no time restrictions.

I think you’ve fallen into some sort of unintended lacuna with the rules. I would encourage you to contact the Disabled Person’s Railcard office to see if an exception could be made. Certainly, for someone of limited independence with Down’s Syndrome, it seems unfair and unintended that the railcard is denied in this case. I do not believe getting the Disabled Person’s Railcard is “having recourse to public funds” so I think it is worth at least asking, and pushing it to your MP if you don’t succeed.

 

[londiscape]

I think the 16-25 would be a good backstop, but if the disabled person has to travel with a carer then a Disabled Adult railcard allows a carer to travel on the discount (if they ever need it in the future that is), and also comes with no time restrictions.

I think you’ve fallen into some sort of unintended lacuna with the rules. I would encourage you to contact the Disabled Person’s Railcard office to see if an exception could be made. Certainly, for someone of limited independence with Down’s Syndrome, it seems unfair and unintended that the railcard is denied in this case. I do not believe getting the Disabled Person’s Railcard is “having recourse to public funds” so I think it is worth at least asking, and pushing it to your MP if you don’t succeed.

Apologies @AlterEgo - I think this may have been misread. Person A *is* able to travel independently, and *does not* have to travel with a carer.

Does this change anything? Thanks again for your advice.

D

 

[AlterEgo]

Apologies @AlterEgo - I think this may have been misread. Person A *is* able to travel independently, and *does not* have to travel with a carer.

Does this change anything? Thanks again for your advice.

D

No it doesn’t, but I meant in the event that the person ever does need a carer in the future, or on any occasion, then the Disabled railcard comes in helpful for getting a second person a discount. It doesn’t even need to be a “carer”; I am completely independent but have a Disabled Railcard owing to a hidden disability, and anyone coming with me on a trip gets the discount too. I don’t have or need a “carer”.

The most valuable thing though is the lack of time restrictions, which is extremely helpful.

 

[londiscape]

No it doesn’t, but I meant in the event that the person ever does need a carer in the future, or on any occasion, then the Disabled railcard comes in helpful for getting a second person a discount. It doesn’t even need to be a “carer”; I am completely independent but have a Disabled Railcard owing to a hidden disability, and anyone coming with me on a trip gets the discount too. I don’t have or need a “carer”.

The most valuable thing though is the lack of time restrictions, which is extremely helpful.

Thanks @AlterEgo that's much appreciated. I'll relay that to my friend and see what they want to do.

Thanks again

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 6 Jul 2022 ==

One more question for the forum aside from the disability matter - am I right in saying that Person A being 21 years old has an automatic entitlement to a young persons railcard purely on the basis of age, regardless of lack of UK or EU citizenship?

Thanks

D

 

[Vespa]

If person A has access to a social worker or health professional, they could write a notarised statement on officially headed letter stating the disability and the reason for needing it especially a carer, that could swing it.

 

[Haywain]

If person A has access to a social worker or health professional, they could write a notarised statement on officially headed letter stating the disability and the reason for needing it especially a carer, that could swing it.

As person A is resident in the UK, one might reasonably expect that they have a GP, either through the NHS or privately, who can complete the railcard application form.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

If person A has access to a social worker or health professional, they could write a notarised statement on officially headed letter stating the disability and the reason for needing it especially a carer, that could swing it.

As person A is resident in the UK, one might reasonably expect that they have a GP, either through the NHS or privately, who can complete the railcard application form.

As far as I can make out, neither of these would meet the criteria quoted in post #2 above sourced from Are You Eligible - Disabled Persons Railcard. So before trying to get someone in authority to confirm person A's position, it's probably better to get the Railcard people to agree in principle that a card could be issued as (to my mind at least) person A meets the idea of who a Disabled Persons Railcard is for, even if they don't meet the letter of the rules.

One more question for the forum aside from the disability matter - am I right in saying that Person A being 21 years old has an automatic entitlement to a young persons railcard purely on the basis of age, regardless of lack of UK or EU citizenship?

Per https://www.16-25railcard.co.uk/using-your-railcard/are-you-eligible/:

A quick check to make sure you're eligible...​

16-25?​

If you’re between 16 and 25 years old, you’re eligible. In this case, you can buy your Railcard online using a valid debit or credit card, a valid UK driving licence or international passport, and a digital passport-style photo for uploading. It will then be delivered for free within 5-7 working days.

(My emphasis)

Assuming that person A holds a passport (which seems likely as they're in the UK but not a UK or EU citizen) then there shouldn't be a problem.

 

[londiscape]

Thank you all for your help. Situation is much clearer now.

Much appreciated