Bus Manufacturer News & Discussion

[scosutsut]

EU–UK Trade and Cooperation Agreement - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Just the VAT payable, so that would apply on a Berlin ADL but not a Cologne Wrightbus?

 

[MotCO]

Just the VAT payable, so that would apply on a Berlin ADL but not a Cologne Wrightbus?

But would that VAT not be offsettable against their outputs? The complication may be if bus fares are not subject to VAT in Germany.

 

[scosutsut]

But would that VAT not be offsettable against their outputs? The complication may be if bus fares are not subject to VAT in Germany.

I'm not going to pretend to know or fully understand the situation, I just wondered if Wrightbus found themselves in a more favourable situation, albeit one subject to much more political wrangling and potential change?

 

[Mikey C]

Yes these days ADL are principally a bus body builder and assembler. The large chassis factory at Guildford closed down a few months back. I think they now have a license to build BYD chassis but many of the ones ADL use come from BYD factory in Hungary. BYD did build a bus factory in Beauvais, France, but it didn’t have many orders and was closed down last year.

ADL moved chassis production up to Falkirk when manufacturing stopped at Guildford, as they still needed their own chassis for diesel and hybrid buses. And in future ADL will be designing and building the chassis for their BYD based buses.

BYD ADL electric chassis set for UK assembly and design - routeone

BYD battery-electric bus chassis used in the manufacturer's partnership with ADL are to be designed and assembled in the UK.

www.route-one.net

 

[Goldfish62]

ADL moved chassis production up to Falkirk when manufacturing stopped at Guildford, as they still needed their own chassis for diesel and hybrid buses. And in future ADL will be designing and building the chassis for their BYD based buses.

BYD ADL electric chassis set for UK assembly and design - routeone

BYD battery-electric bus chassis used in the manufacturer's partnership with ADL are to be designed and assembled in the UK.

www.route-one.net

I believe ADL have already started building the BYD chassis.

 

[Snow1964]

Switch Mobility has launched a new electric bus, called E1
Aimed at European market

12m long, with capacity for upto 93 passengers (incl 30 seated)
389 kw/h battery, ZF hub motors, range 390Km

Will be built at new Valladolid, Spain factory

• At 12m long, the SWITCH e1 is the company’s first fully electric bus designed specifically for the European market
• Developed based on 10 years of EV bus experience in U.K. and India and over 30 million driven miles, SWITCH e1 raises the standards of quality and performance in the segment ;
• Boasting a monocoque design, the SWITCH e1 is one of the lightest 12m buses in Europe at less than 10,800kg, coupled with a range of around 390km from a 389KWh battery
• Advanced NMC battery technology provides a lighter weight and higher density solution than conventional LFP batteries, delivering a lower total cost of ownership
• The SWITCH e1 will be manufactured at the company’s new manufacturing and technical centre in Valladolid, Spain

Leeds, UK - Chennai, India - Valladolid, Spain – 7 June 2022:Switch Mobility Ltd (‘Switch’), the next-generation carbon neutral electric bus and light commercial vehicle company, today unveiled the new, 4th generation SWITCH e1 bus. The SWITCH e1, a fully electric bus tailored to the European market, is a significant step forward in Switch‘s mission: to enrich lives through green mobility.
Launched at the European Mobility Expo, the SWITCH e1 combines a lightweight monocoque construction with advanced NMC battery technology to create a truly market-leading product. With a 389kWh battery capacity and ZF hub motors, the SWITCH e1 delivers exceptional performance and class leading efficiency. Fast charging is achieved in under 3 hours and A/C charging in 7 hours. The SWITCH e1 also benefits from Switch’s market-leading technology including iAlert, enabling remote, real-time diagnostics and monitoring services, as well as world-class digital battery management tools.
Designed with a focus on passenger comfort, the vehicle is adaptable and boasts a flexible seating layout which has been engineered to enable easy ingress and egress. With capacity for up to 93 passengers – including up to 30 seated, passengers will ride in comfort with a contemporary and open interior design, reading lights, under seat lights, USB ports and a wide-screen monitor including a “next five stops” feature and information on nearby local public transport. The interior layout and ultra-low floor throughout improve wheelchair access which is available through both the front and middle doors, a unique feature within this segment. Passengers and drivers can also enjoy the double skin heating, ventilation, and air conditioning (HVAC) ducts, directing airflow towards the occupants, reducing wastage, and increasing efficiency.
Developing the SWITCH e1 as a completely new product has also enabled the latest driver aids and safety features to be integrated. Electronic Stability Control and the Electronic Braking System provide a confident driving experience whilst blind spot monitoring, collision detection and lane departure warning will maximise safety for drivers and passengers alike.

Switch Mobility Ltd. launches all new, ‘SWITCH e1’ 12m bus. | switchmobility

At 12m long, the SWITCH e1 is the company’s first fully electric bus designed specifically for the European market

www.switchmobility.tech

SWITCH e1 | First Full Electric Zero Emission Bus

SWITCH e1 is the next generation bus built for a sustainable future. Designed, engineered and built to achieve net-zero targets.

www.switchmobility.tech

A few days earlier Van Hool had launched its new electric bus range, called A range

A range | Van Hool

www.vanhool.com

 

[Mikey C]

Looks quite smart. Will European operators really want to buy from an unknown (to them) manufacturer though?

Switch Mobility launches e1 bus for mainland European markets - routeone

Switch Mobility has unveiled its e1 battery-electric single-decker. The 12m bus will offer a range of around 390km from 389kW/h of energy.

www.route-one.net

 

[Goldfish62]

Looks quite smart. Will European operators really want to buy from an unknown (to them) manufacturer though?

Switch Mobility launches e1 bus for mainland European markets - routeone

Switch Mobility has unveiled its e1 battery-electric single-decker. The 12m bus will offer a range of around 390km from 389kW/h of energy.

www.route-one.net

I'm sure many in the UK Bus industry can offer European operators their thoughts on Optare/Switch.

 

[TRAX]

They may have changed their name but damn the exterior design screams Optare traditional ugliness.

 

[MotCO]

They may have changed their name but damn the exterior design screams Optare traditional ugliness.

Optare did produce some good-looking buses - Spectra, Excel, Tempo etc, - but the E1 is more sober-looking. In an increasingly crowded market, will the E1 stand out? Maybe its unique selling point is its low weight, but Arrival may also be able to claim that, both being designed from fresh.

 

[fgwrich]

I'm sure many in the UK Bus industry can offer European operators their thoughts on Optare/Switch.

Yes... Shall we await a response from Reading?

They may have changed their name but damn the exterior design screams Optare traditional ugliness.

It's a very bloated bus. I don't know why, but it's like an Optare Tempo's had some kind of allergic reaction and swelled up. It's not the worst looking electric bus, but as usual from Optare / Switch, it isn't the prettiest either.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

Yes... Shall we await a response from Reading?



It's a very bloated bus. I don't know why, but it's like an Optare Tempo's had some kind of allergic reaction and swelled up. It's not the worst looking electric bus, but as usual from Optare / Switch, it isn't the prettiest either.

I might be in the minority but I think that it looks good and futuristic.

 

[TRAX]

I might be in the minority but I think that it looks good and futuristic.

Have you seen the back end of it (rear lights and all) ? It screams 2002…

 

[Tom Gallacher]

ADL moved chassis production up to Falkirk when manufacturing stopped at Guildford, as they still needed their own chassis for diesel and hybrid buses. And in future ADL will be designing and building the chassis for their BYD based buses.

BYD ADL electric chassis set for UK assembly and design - routeone

BYD battery-electric bus chassis used in the manufacturer's partnership with ADL are to be designed and assembled in the UK.

www.route-one.net

A lot of their chassis are built in Preston.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Jun 2022 ==

Have you seen the back end of it (rear lights and all) ? It screams 2002…

No, just saw what was in the pic posted above.

 

[py_megapixel]

I notice one of the first things brought up in this thread a few years ago was ADL building those absolutely enormous double-deckers for Berlin. Presumably these are in service now, at least to some extent. I'm interested to know how this went - how are they doing and did BVG take up the options for more?

 

[Tom Gallacher]

I notice one of the first things brought up in this thread a few years ago was ADL building those absolutely enormous double-deckers for Berlin. Presumably these are in service now, at least to some extent. I'm interested to know how this went - how are they doing and did BVG take up the options for more?

There is an order for 198 of them currently under build. I think that they are about half way through the order at this point, certainly in terms of the chassis build. Not sure about the body side of it though. They are getting built in Scarborough.

 

[GusB]

I notice one of the first things brought up in this thread a few years ago was ADL building those absolutely enormous double-deckers for Berlin. Presumably these are in service now, at least to some extent. I'm interested to know how this went - how are they doing and did BVG take up the options for more?

This was published in January:

Alexander Dennis begins volume Enviro500 deliveries to Berlin - routeone

Alexander Dennis has delivered the first of 198 series-production Enviro500 double-deckers to Berlin as part of a framework contract.

www.route-one.net

Alexander Dennis has delivered the first series production Enviro500 buses to Berliner Verkehrsbetriebe (BVG) in Berlin. When the batch is complete, 200 of the tri-axle double-deckers will be in service in the German capital.

Up to five buses per week will be shipped from ADL’s Scarborough plant for most of 2022, the manufacturer says. The order for 198 Enviro500s was placed in March 2021 after a successful testing programme of two pre-series examples that were delivered in 2020.

BVG has signed a multi-year framework contract with ADL, positioning the manufacturer as its supplier of next generation double-deck buses. The Berlin vehicles are powered by the Daimler OM 936 engine. They are 13.8m long and 4.06m high. Three doors and two staircases are fitted to suit high-turnover urban services and the buses can carry a maximum of 112 passengers.

Says ADL President and Managing Director Paul Davies: “Double-deckers have been a familiar sight on the streets of Berlin for generations, and we are humbled to be the first international supplier of these iconic buses.

“Our global experience as the world’s leading manufacturer of double-deck buses has allowed us to develop a vehicle that respects local traditions and requirements while reducing energy use through our durable yet lightweight construction. We look forward to seeing our fleet grow over the next year as all 200 new Enviro500 buses enter service in Berlin.”

 

[Snow1964]

I notice one of the first things brought up in this thread a few years ago was ADL building those absolutely enormous double-deckers for Berlin. Presumably these are in service now, at least to some extent. I'm interested to know how this went - how are they doing and did BVG take up the options for more?

There were 2 prototypes and a production batch of 198 is under construction

They are 13.8m long, but appear to be longer as they are built to a low height of only 4.06m (most UK double decks are 4.2 or 4.3m high)

Probably won’t be any more as the German Operator has recently indicated future orders will be electric buses

 

[TRAX]

There are currently 25 Enviro500s in service with BVG.

There were 2 prototypes and a production batch of 198 is under construction

Probably won’t be any more as the German Operator has recently indicated future orders will be electric buses

Future orders yes, but taking up options isn’t placing a new order.
Plus there’s no realistic option for a full-size electric double decker at the moment.

 

[MotCO]

Plus there’s no realistic option for a full-size electric double decker at the moment.

Do you mean electric 13.8m double deckers? There are plenty of shorter electric double deckers; not sure what the problem is with extending them to 13.8m. Would the extra batteries exceed weight limits, notwithstanding that the Berlin buses have an extra axle which would help.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Jun 2022 ==

A lot of their chassis are built in Preston.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Jun 2022 ==


No, just saw what was in the pic posted above.

Other pictures, including the rear view, are here. https://www.sustainable-bus.com/news/switch-mobility-e1-bus/

 

[TRAX]

Do you mean electric 13.8m double deckers? There are plenty of shorter electric double deckers; not sure what the problem is with extending them to 13.8m. Would the extra batteries exceed weight limits, notwithstanding that the Berlin buses have an extra axle which would help.

If it was this easy…

 

[Mikey C]

There were 2 prototypes and a production batch of 198 is under construction

They are 13.8m long, but appear to be longer as they are built to a low height of only 4.06m (most UK double decks are 4.2 or 4.3m high)

Probably won’t be any more as the German Operator has recently indicated future orders will be electric buses

Indeed this order does feel slightly out of date, a major European city taking diesel buses in 2022.

Interesting that they are Daimler powered rather than the usual Cummins too.

 

[TRAX]

Indeed this order does feel slightly out of date, a major European city taking diesel buses in 2022.

Interesting that they are Daimler powered rather than the usual Cummins too.

Yes this was a special request from BVG. Now it is not the only operator in the world to have Merc-powered E500s.

 

[37114]

There were 2 prototypes and a production batch of 198 is under construction

They are 13.8m long, but appear to be longer as they are built to a low height of only 4.06m (most UK double decks are 4.2 or 4.3m high)

Probably won’t be any more as the German Operator has recently indicated future orders will be electric buses

ADL have developed an Electric E500, a few have been sold to KMB so presumably they will be an option to BVG. While the chassis will be different at least they can retain some commonality with the body design/parts etc.

 

[Tom Gallacher]

Do you mean electric 13.8m double deckers? There are plenty of shorter electric double deckers; not sure what the problem is with extending them to 13.8m. Would the extra batteries exceed weight limits, notwithstanding that the Berlin buses have an extra axle which would help.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 9 Jun 2022 ==



Other pictures, including the rear view, are here. https://www.sustainable-bus.com/news/switch-mobility-e1-bus/

I take your point

 

[Trnsprt4Sctlnd]

Just casually browsing through what manufacturers are out there nowadays and what is offered.

Just me or does anybody else think it’s odd that both Mercedes & Volvo offer bus/chassis for 10.8m vehicles but build them with 6-cylinder engines instead of there respective 4-cylinders?

 

[37114]

Just casually browsing through what manufacturers are out there nowadays and what is offered.

Just me or does anybody else think it’s odd that both Mercedes & Volvo offer bus/chassis for 10.8m vehicles but build them with 6-cylinder engines instead of there respective 4-cylinders?

I presume it is because operators on the continent haven't embraced the approach the UK have which is to prioritise weight to allow better fuel economy at the expense of longevity. Volvo and Mercedes are a heavyweight chassis and thus 6 cylinder engine is more suited/less stressed than a 4 cylinder engine in an Enviro 200/Streetlite.

 

[Volvodart]

Wrightbus have won an order for 120 Electroliners.

https://www.rte.ie/news/business/20...rders-120-double-deck-battery-electric-buses/

NTA orders 120 double-deck battery-electric buses from Wrightbus
Updated / Monday, 13 Jun 2022 11:22

The National Transport Authority (NTA) has ordered 120 double-deck battery-electric buses from Bamford Bus Company, trading as Wrightbus.

The buses are part of an agreement which provides for the procurement of up to 800 zero-emission battery-electric buses over a period of five years.

The NTA said it invested over €80m in the initial order for the 120 buses.

It said the buses will be manufactured and assembled at the Wrightbus facility in Galgorm, on the outskirts of Ballymena in Northern Ireland.

These will be the first battery-electric double-deck buses to be added to the national bus fleet in Ireland and their addition will deliver a significant uplift in the proportion of low- or zero-emission buses within that fleet.

Of the 120 buses currently on order, 100 will be used by Dublin Bus on PSO bus services within the Dublin Metropolitan Area and 20 will be used by Bus Éireann for use in the Limerick Metropolitan Area.

The NTA said commissioning and training activities will get under way later this year, as will work on installing the necessary charging infrastructure.

The first buses are expected to enter passenger service in 2023.

"We know that decarbonising transport is imperative, as part of our effort to tackle climate change," said Minister for Transport, Eamon Ryan.

"Public transport because it is shared mobility is already a far more sustainable and economical way of getting around, particularly compared to a private car that runs on fossil fuel, and the battery-electric buses that we are now ordering, will accelerate the transition to a zero-emission fleet," he said.

"These new electric buses will also help reduce air pollution, improve public health and improve access to public transport for people of all abilities," he added.

Anne Graham, Chief Executive Officer of the NTA said the transition to a zero-emission bus fleet is a central component of their BusConnects project.

"There is no doubt that people are looking to us to provide better, more sustainable transport alternatives in all areas, and it is incumbent on us as an authority to respond to that demand in a positive way," she said.

"In so doing, we will reduce the need for personal vehicles, making the quality of the air we breathe healthier for everyone," she added.

Neil Collins, Managing Director of Wrightbus described the deal as "historic".

"This deal further cements the reputation we have built in the zero-emission sector, and follows hot on the heels of historic deals in Australia and Germany.

"This shows our ambition to be at the forefront of the zero emission drive in cities, towns and rural areas across the world," he added.

 

[GusB]

It's not exactly news, but Arrival have released a video about achieving certification.

 

[Snow1964]

I presume it is because operators on the continent haven't embraced the approach the UK have which is to prioritise weight to allow better fuel economy at the expense of longevity. Volvo and Mercedes are a heavyweight chassis and thus 6 cylinder engine is more suited/less stressed than a 4 cylinder engine in an Enviro 200/Streetlite.

The other thing is that in many European countries it is seen as bad form for the bus not to be able to climb hills at same speed as cars. If get a queue behind due to going slow effectively emphasising the bus is inferior.

It is all part of a different mentality of bus not being seen as transport of last resort, so quality (no rattles) is seen as more important than dirt cheap fares.