Odd Pathing - Avanti 1P07 Saturday 28/5/22

[Bibendum]

We travelled on the 20:31 1P07 from Euston to Preston on Sunday evening which took an absolute age to get to Preston. Apart from the delay caused by some muppets needing to be removed by Police at Rugby these factors seemed odd.

• Pathed as slow lines from Euston to Rugby. We ran at about 85mph and were overtaken by local services using the fast lines so not maintenance related.
• Slow running North of Rugby all the way to Preston for no apparent reason. Open Train Times did not show any traffic in front of us.
• Held outside Wigan as a Barrow train was in Plat 5 - but Plat 6 was available
• Once Barrow train was clear of Plat 5 we were signalled into Plat 6 causing a further delay.

Finally arrived at Preston 41 late

https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/service/gb-nr:P07525/2022-05-28/detailed#allox_id=0

Anyone got any clues as to what this was all about?

 

[pdeaves]

Consistently losing time from the word 'go' suggests that a traction issue might be part of the problem.

 

[JonathanH]

Lack of tilt can be one reason for running slow and using the slow lines everywhere.

 

[Bald Rick]

Booked slow line south of Hanslope, behind a late running service

then sent slow line from Rugby due to the disorder on the train

extra call at Stafford

trespass at Warrington.

 

[Hadders]

This train would’ve been completely wedged with Port Vale and Wigan rugby fans. I saw the 20:34 LNR Crewe train at Euston on Saturday and it was crush loaded 15 minutes before departure.

I’m not surprised there was disorder given the numbers of people onboard. I think all trains are routinely timed slow line on Saturdays after 20:00 to allow for maintenance but I do know that the 20:34 crossed to the fasts south of Milton Keynes as it used platform 6.

 

[Some guy]

It’s very odd that it’s that slow especially when it can be done in 2h 8 minutes. It must be due to network rail doing engineering works that late on a Saturday night as the last Avanti service from London is 21:03

 

[Bald Rick]

It’s very odd that it’s that slow especially when it can be done in 2h 8 minutes. It must be due to network rail doing engineering works that late on a Saturday night as the last Avanti service from London is 21:03

Booked time for this service is 2h 45 mins

The 2h 8 minutes timing for the ‘standard’ service is with two stops.

This service normally has 7 Stops. That’s an extra 25 minutes or so before anything else.

 

[Bibendum]

Booked slow line south of Hanslope, behind a late running service

then sent slow line from Rugby due to the disorder on the train

extra call at Stafford

trespass at Warrington.

Thanks Bald Rick. Didn't know about the trespass part, I'm sure that definitely had an impact.

Any idea why it was booked slow line to Hanslope? Seemed odd as we had the locals whizzing past us.

Booked time for this service is 2h 45 mins

The 2h 8 minutes timing for the ‘standard’ service is with two stops.

This service normally has 7 Stops. That’s an extra 25 minutes or so before anything else.

The extra stops certainly add to the booked time but despite that it all seemed slower than it needed to be when there was nothing else on the rails at the time.

This train would’ve been completely wedged with Port Vale and Wigan rugby fans. I saw the 20:34 LNR Crewe train at Euston on Saturday and it was crush loaded 15 minutes before departure.

I’m not surprised there was disorder given the numbers of people onboard. I think all trains are routinely timed slow line on Saturdays after 20:00 to allow for maintenance but I do know that the 20:34 crossed to the fasts south of Milton Keynes as it used platform 6.

Haha, I was one of the Wigan Rugby fans. Dozing peacefully and happily in Standard Premier Don't forget the Leigh fans too and the fact that the 2020 ish to Liverpool was cancelled and pax directed to the Preston service.

It might have been the 2034 that overtook us, it was certainly ahead by Hanslope.

 

[Bald Rick]

Any idea why it was booked slow line to Hanslope? Seemed odd as we had the locals whizzing past us.

you were booked on the slow line because of engineering work, as it is most weeks. They are standard paths, and the engineering work can be anywhere - this particular weekend it seems there was none between Leighton Buzzard and MK.

you only had one ‘local’ overtake you - 1U51 - which is a London - Crewe service (not really a local), between Bletchley and MK. It was switched from the slow line to the fasts at Ledburn Jn, just south of Leighton Buzzard.

I imagine this was done because otherwise it would have been late arriving at MK, as it was behind your train, which was in turn delayed in reaction to a train that left Euston nearly an hour before you (2Y75). There was a procession of trains on the Down slow to Ledburn Junction. Arguably your service, and the Wolverhampton in front, should have switched to the fast line there too, but it wasn’t. Even if you had been, you would have waited at Hanslope Junction for the Wolverhampton in front of you to switch ahead, or the Manchester in front of that. there were plenty of trains around and definitely lots in front South of Rugby.

as it happens you re-overtook 1U51 between Milton Keynes and Hanslope Jn, where you were switched to the fast line as booked, and everything proceeded in the correct order. Of course 1U51 was delayed behind you at Rugby whilst the people fighting were sorted out.

The root cause to delays south of Hanslope Jn was the delay to 2Y75 (probably a crewing problem at a guess), and the delays north of there were the fight on your train and then the trespass (actually a vulnerable individual at the station) at Warrington.

 

[Bibendum]

you were booked on the slow line because of engineering work, as it is most weeks. They are standard paths, and the engineering work can be anywhere - this particular weekend it seems there was none between Leighton Buzzard and MK.

you only had one ‘local’ overtake you - 1U51 - which is a London - Crewe service (not really a local), between Bletchley and MK. It was switched from the slow line to the fasts at Ledburn Jn, just south of Leighton Buzzard.

I imagine this was done because otherwise it would have been late arriving at MK, as it was behind your train, which was in turn delayed in reaction to a train that left Euston nearly an hour before you (2Y75). There was a procession of trains on the Down slow to Ledburn Junction. Arguably your service, and the Wolverhampton in front, should have switched to the fast line there too, but it wasn’t. Even if you had been, you would have waited at Hanslope Junction for the Wolverhampton in front of you to switch ahead, or the Manchester in front of that. there were plenty of trains around and definitely lots in front South of Rugby.

as it happens you re-overtook 1U51 between Milton Keynes and Hanslope Jn, where you were switched to the fast line as booked, and everything proceeded in the correct order. Of course 1U51 was delayed behind you at Rugby whilst the people fighting were sorted out.

The root cause to delays south of Hanslope Jn was the delay to 2Y75 (probably a crewing problem at a guess), and the delays north of there were the fight on your train and then the trespass (actually a vulnerable individual at the station) at Warrington.

Thanks for that.

At the time there didn't seem to be much traffic on OpenTrainTimes but as you said there were actually a few services at 4ish minutes headway on that section.

Warrington BQ was rammed with people after a music festival in the town so that took a while too.

Lesson learned, don't take the 1P07 on a busy Saturday... find a nice hotel, have a lazy breakfast and come back home on Sunday morning!