Letter requiring mitigating circumstances.

[Unistudent101]

Hi all,
I would like to thank you in advance as I know how helpful everyone’s advice can be on here for people in difficult situations like myself.

On 3/12/2021 I was reported by a revenue officer boarding on chiltern railways from Birmingham moor street to leamington spa for work. The officer didn’t give me a chance to explain myself but what had happen was because I am in university I pay for my little brother who was 15 at the time to occasionally come and visit me by himself or along with my mother. And earlier that day we were looking at price for him to come along again. Now If you have an iPhone you would know that when you close an app then re open it on low power mode the page will not refresh. So clumsily in a rush I booked the next train that was soon to arrive at the station whilst on the station and did not realise until I was initially stopped at the barriers and employee of chiltern informed me that it was a child ticket. However he still let me pass as I explained what had just happened and informed me that I should explain this if a revenue officer is aboard and I’ll be able to pay the correct fare.

Furthermore, the letter says it has not been my first occasion, but the only times before hand have been either when me, my mother and little brother have travelled, or when he has travelled and we have used my account to pay. Therefore, I’m my draft I have admitted that on this one occasion my negligence is actually to blame, however have given reason as to why the other circumstances will have a child on the ticket.

Thanks again for your time.

This is my draft ( I already think it’s too long but I don’t know how to incorporate why reasons for previous child tickets in any other way):

To whom this may concern,

I am writing to you regarding the report that was filed on 03/12/2021 in where I was reported to have a invalid ticket for my travel. I would like to start by offering my apologies as I booked a child ticket for the for 3/12/2021 as a one time act of negligence, as my family and I were looking for prices for my little brother who was 15 at the time to come and see me, because it is normally easier for my family to use my account when my little brother is travelling being as he does not have a train line account, therefore running late to work I booked the next available train, whilst in the station not aware that it was set for child, until the employee at the barrier checked my ticket and said it was a child’s. Furthermore on the date 3/12/2021 approximately around 21:10pm when the ticket was purchased if you check the cctv footage monitoring the barriers to platform 1&2 ( I was wearing a black jacket with my hood on, black cargo trousers, black shoes and a leather black holdall bag) you see me briefly explain this to the chiltern employee who was working at the barriers in which he said it was a ‘one time thing’ and I should ‘explain this to an officer’ if they happen to be on the train. So as I boarded I was under the impression that because the chiltern employee had already told me that it was only okay for today, I could explain my case to the officer and pay the correct fare, however wasn’t given the chance to.

Leading on, regarding the time period between Sep 2020 to Dec 2021, these have been dates where either I have traveled with my little brother, without or when I have had to cancel my trip due to the train being missed.
Firstly, on 12/09/2020 I booked a journey for 2 adults and 1 child being me, my mother and little brother going to Birmingham new street for 7:03am and because this was me moving into university on the journey coming back to London also on 12/09/2020 it was only 1 adult (my mother) and 1 child (my little brother).
Next, on Wednesday 14/10/2020, this occasion I payed for the journey of my little brother and 3 of his friends from a sleepover to Birmingham where my mum was waiting to escort them back to London.
Leading on, Friday 22/10/2021 the journey was refunded due to me missing the train so I stayed in Macclesfield until 24/10/2021 and booked a ticket back to Birmingham.
Moving on, for 7/11/2021 this was around the time my little brother was regularly visiting me through different means of transport and I payed for him to attend a game in Coventry after staying with me.
Furthermore, on 30/11/2021 I payed for the journey for my little brother to visit family friends Nuneaton & had arranged them to drop him halfway at Coleshill so he could take a train back, however because of how late it was I cancelled the trip and got a lift to pick him up instead.

In conclusion I understand that on this one occasion on 3/12/2021 in ordering my ticket in a rush without thoroughly checking my ticket I had committed an act of negligence regardless of whether an employee had acknowledged this and said it was was a one off. I accept full responsibility of this and moving on I will be more diligent in ordering my tickets. I kindly request if this can be settled by me either paying the outstanding fee + administration fees or paying any additional charges/fines without this being escalated any further, as this has been looming over my head for some time and is affecting my mental health.

Thank you for your time.

Yours Faithfully,

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi all,
I would like to thank you in advance as I know how helpful everyone’s advice can be on here for people in difficult situations like myself.

On 3/12/2021 I was reported by a revenue officer boarding on chiltern railways from Birmingham moor street to leamington spa for work. The officer didn’t give me a chance to explain myself but what had happen was because I am in university I pay for my little brother who was 15 at the time to occasionally come and visit me by himself or along with my mother. And earlier that day we were looking at price for him to come along again. Now If you have an iPhone you would know that when you close an app then re open it on low power mode the page will not refresh. So clumsily in a rush I booked the next train that was soon to arrive at the station whilst on the station and did not realise until I was initially stopped at the barriers and employee of chiltern informed me that it was a child ticket. However he still let me pass as I explained what had just happened and informed me that I should explain this if a revenue officer is aboard and I’ll be able to pay the correct fare.

Furthermore, the letter says it has not been my first occasion, but the only times before hand have been either when me, my mother and little brother have travelled, or when he has travelled and we have used my account to pay. Therefore, I’m my draft I have admitted that on this one occasion my negligence is actually to blame, however have given reason as to why the other circumstances will have a child on the ticket.

Thanks again for your time.

This is my draft ( I already think it’s too long but I don’t know how to incorporate why reasons for previous child tickets in any other way):

To whom this may concern,

I am writing to you regarding the report that was filed on 03/12/2021 in where I was reported to have a invalid ticket for my travel. I would like to start by offering my apologies as I booked a child ticket for the for 3/12/2021 as a one time act of negligence, as my family and I were looking for prices for my little brother who was 15 at the time to come and see me, because it is normally easier for my family to use my account when my little brother is travelling being as he does not have a train line account, therefore running late to work I booked the next available train, whilst in the station not aware that it was set for child, until the employee at the barrier checked my ticket and said it was a child’s. Furthermore on the date 3/12/2021 approximately around 21:10pm when the ticket was purchased if you check the cctv footage monitoring the barriers to platform 1&2 ( I was wearing a black jacket with my hood on, black cargo trousers, black shoes and a leather black holdall bag) you see me briefly explain this to the chiltern employee who was working at the barriers in which he said it was a ‘one time thing’ and I should ‘explain this to an officer’ if they happen to be on the train. So as I boarded I was under the impression that because the chiltern employee had already told me that it was only okay for today, I could explain my case to the officer and pay the correct fare, however wasn’t given the chance to.

Leading on, regarding the time period between Sep 2020 to Dec 2021, these have been dates where either I have traveled with my little brother, without or when I have had to cancel my trip due to the train being missed.
Firstly, on 12/09/2020 I booked a journey for 2 adults and 1 child being me, my mother and little brother going to Birmingham new street for 7:03am and because this was me moving into university on the journey coming back to London also on 12/09/2020 it was only 1 adult (my mother) and 1 child (my little brother).
Next, on Wednesday 14/10/2020, this occasion I payed for the journey of my little brother and 3 of his friends from a sleepover to Birmingham where my mum was waiting to escort them back to London.
Leading on, Friday 22/10/2021 the journey was refunded due to me missing the train so I stayed in Macclesfield until 24/10/2021 and booked a ticket back to Birmingham.
Moving on, for 7/11/2021 this was around the time my little brother was regularly visiting me through different means of transport and I payed for him to attend a game in Coventry after staying with me.
Furthermore, on 30/11/2021 I payed for the journey for my little brother to visit family friends Nuneaton & had arranged them to drop him halfway at Coleshill so he could take a train back, however because of how late it was I cancelled the trip and got a lift to pick him up instead.

In conclusion I understand that on this one occasion on 3/12/2021 in ordering my ticket in a rush without thoroughly checking my ticket I had committed an act of negligence regardless of whether an employee had acknowledged this and said it was was a one off. I accept full responsibility of this and moving on I will be more diligent in ordering my tickets. I kindly request if this can be settled by me either paying the outstanding fee + administration fees or paying any additional charges/fines without this being escalated any further, as this has been looming over my head for some time and is affecting my mental health.

Thank you for your time.

Yours Faithfully,

If you can do anything to edit this down it would probably help -
eg they will not be interested you were running late for work
They are probably not going to spend time checking CCTV so all those details are probably superfluous (could be summarised as 'following the discussion I had with barrier line staff about my ticket before boarding I understood I was given permission to board the train and resolve the ticket matter with staff on board' or some such

Incidentally this seems rather unlikely to me but I'm not denying your conversation - just sounds like a case of a complete misunderstanding of what the staff might have said to you - there is never going to be an occasion, in my view, where they say it is OK to travel on a child ticket surely? But unless you have a recording of what they said I doubt it is going anywhere...)

other bits ref child ticket purchases you could simply say 'these were occasions where I bought tickets for my younger brother, aged under 15 at the time, to travel' - after all if it got to court I suspect they would have to proove it was you - but I would advise you not to lie if there is any chance these were tickets used by you.

At the end of the day the whole thing could be boiled down to little more than:

"I regularly buy train tickets using my phone for my younger brother, and on the occasion concerned the settings on my phone which I used to buy my ticket defaulted to a child rate fare. I was in a hurry and failed to notice this, and was given permission at the barrier line to join the train.

"I am extremely sorry etc / request settlement etc

"The other occasions you detail were in fact occasions when I bought tickets for my brother who was aged XX at the time. I did not use those tickets for travel"

or a balance between your longer original message and this sort of v short approach.

I think the weak link will probably be the likelihood of TIL / Chiltern believing that you were given permission to go through the barrier with a child's ticket - tho if true then maybe you should say it - (I doubt the CCTV even still exists, were they to have the time or inclination to bother to check it anyway).

 

[30907]

About the incident:
1. Could you post a redacted copy of the letter from TIL please? This mjght help us help you with your reply.

2. How does your younger brother get access to the tickets you buy when you are not travelling yourself?

About the letter:
to add to Western Lancer's comments, when you refer to your history of child ticket purchases, you could say something like: "On a number of occasions I have bought tickets for my younger brother aged 15, travelling alone or with friends. I confirm that I did not use any of those tickets for my own travel. I can give full details if requested."

 

[Unistudent101]

If you can do anything to edit this down it would probably help -
eg they will not be interested you were running late for work
They are probably not going to spend time checking CCTV so all those details are probably superfluous (could be summarised as 'following the discussion I had with barrier line staff about my ticket before boarding I understood I was given permission to board the train and resolve the ticket matter with staff on board' or some such

Incidentally this seems rather unlikely to me but I'm not denying your conversation - just sounds like a case of a complete misunderstanding of what the staff might have said to you - there is never going to be an occasion, in my view, where they say it is OK to travel on a child ticket surely? But unless you have a recording of what they said I doubt it is going anywhere...)

other bits ref child ticket purchases you could simply say 'these were occasions where I bought tickets for my younger brother, aged under 15 at the time, to travel' - after all if it got to court I suspect they would have to proove it was you - but I would advise you not to lie if there is any chance these were tickets used by you.

At the end of the day the whole thing could be boiled down to little more than:

"I regularly buy train tickets using my phone for my younger brother, and on the occasion concerned the settings on my phone which I used to buy my ticket defaulted to a child rate fare. I was in a hurry and failed to notice this, and was given permission at the barrier line to join the train.

"I am extremely sorry etc / request settlement etc

"The other occasions you detail were in fact occasions when I bought tickets for my brother who was aged XX at the time. I did not use those tickets for travel"

or a balance between your longer original message and this sort of v short approach.

I think the weak link will probably be the likelihood of TIL / Chiltern believing that you were given permission to go through the barrier with a child's ticket - tho if true then maybe you should say it - (I doubt the CCTV even still exists, were they to have the time or inclination to bother to check it anyway).

Hi thanks for taking the time to go over my draft, this is my new edited draft (is it okay to send off?):


To whom this may concern,



I am writing to you regarding the report that was filed on 03/12/2021 in where I was reported to have a invalid ticket for my travel. I would like to start by offering my apologies as I booked a child ticket for the for 3/12/2021 as a one time act of negligence, as my family and I were looking for prices for my little brother who was 15 at the time to come and see me, because I regularly buy train tickets using my phone for my younger brother, and on the occasion concerned, the settings on my phone which I used to buy my ticket defaulted to a child rate fare. I was in a hurry and failed to notice this, and was given permission at the barrier line to board by an employee of chiltern which the cctv footage on this date 3/12/2021 at approximately 21:15 I was seen at the barriers wearing a black hooded jacket, black trousers and a black leather holdall bag further supports this, where, following the discussion I had with barrier line staff about my ticket before boarding I understood I was given permission to board the train and resolve the ticket matter with staff on board by paying the correct fare.





Leading on, the other occasions you detail were in fact occasions when I bought tickets for my brother who was aged 15 at the time. I did not personally use these tickets for travel





In conclusion I understand that on this one occasion on 3/12/2021 in ordering my ticket in a rush without thoroughly checking my ticket I had committed an act of negligence regardless of whether an employee had acknowledged this and I accept full responsibility of this and again sincerely apologise for a grave mistake I have made and moving on I will be more diligent in ordering my tickets. I kindly request if this can be settled by me paying the outstanding fee + any further administration fees at your discretion of course without this being escalated any further, as this has been looming over my head for some time and is affecting my mental health.



Thank you for your time.



Yours Faithfully,

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Apr 2022 ==

About the incident:
1. Could you post a redacted copy of the letter from TIL please? This mjght help us help you with your reply.

2. How does your younger brother get access to the tickets you buy when you are not travelling yourself?

About the letter:
to add to Western Lancer's comments, when you refer to your history of child ticket purchases, you could say something like: "On a number of occasions I have bought tickets for my younger brother aged 15, travelling alone or with friends. I confirm that I did not use any of those tickets for my own travel. I can give full details if requested."

Hey @30907,
I’ve attached below a copy what was sent in the post by TIL.
And as for the second point my brother knows my password for my gmail so whenever he is boarding all he has to do is login to access the QR code for the ticket.

Kind regards

 

[WesternLancer]

Hi thanks for taking the time to go over my draft, this is my new edited draft (is it okay to send off?):


To whom this may concern,



I am writing to you regarding the report that was filed on 03/12/2021 in where I was reported to have a invalid ticket for my travel. I would like to start by offering my apologies as I booked a child ticket for the for 3/12/2021 as a one time act of negligence, as my family and I were looking for prices for my little brother who was 15 at the time to come and see me, because I regularly buy train tickets using my phone for my younger brother, and on the occasion concerned, the settings on my phone which I used to buy my ticket defaulted to a child rate fare. I was in a hurry and failed to notice this, and was given permission at the barrier line to board by an employee of chiltern which the cctv footage on this date 3/12/2021 at approximately 21:15 I was seen at the barriers wearing a black hooded jacket, black trousers and a black leather holdall bag further supports this, where, following the discussion I had with barrier line staff about my ticket before boarding I understood I was given permission to board the train and resolve the ticket matter with staff on board by paying the correct fare.





Leading on, the other occasions you detail were in fact occasions when I bought tickets for my brother who was aged 15 at the time. I did not personally use these tickets for travel





In conclusion I understand that on this one occasion on 3/12/2021 in ordering my ticket in a rush without thoroughly checking my ticket I had committed an act of negligence regardless of whether an employee had acknowledged this and I accept full responsibility of this and again sincerely apologise for a grave mistake I have made and moving on I will be more diligent in ordering my tickets. I kindly request if this can be settled by me paying the outstanding fee + any further administration fees at your discretion of course without this being escalated any further, as this has been looming over my head for some time and is affecting my mental health.



Thank you for your time.



Yours Faithfully,

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Apr 2022 ==


Hey @30907,
I’ve attached below a copy what was sent in the post by TIL.
And as for the second point my brother knows my password for my gmail so whenever he is boarding all he has to do is login to access the QR code for the ticket.

Kind regards

Maybe try to break the 1st para into 2 shorter paragraphs. It's a bit indigestible to read as it stands (eg split it after 'negligence' perhaps).

 

[AlterEgo]

I wouldn’t want to try the “little brother” thing in court. That’s where this may end up, and frequently does, with Chiltern.

 

[Haywain]

And as for the second point my brother knows my password for my gmail so whenever he is boarding all he has to do is login to access the QR code for the ticket.

You know what they say about sharing passwords, don't you? And an eTicket can be shared by sending it to the person using it - this can be by email, WhatsApp, bluetooth or whatever. I'm afraid the idea of letting someone else log in to your email account to use such a ticket is pushing plausibility a bit.

 

[Unistudent101]

I wouldn’t want to try the “little brother” thing in court. That’s where this may end up, and frequently does, with Chiltern.

Hopefully it doesn’t come to that, but I believe I should give my account of the situation as detailed as possible, as leaving this major part out still leaves question as to why it was set as a child in the first place.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Apr 2022 ==

You know what they say about sharing passwords, don't you? And an eTicket can be shared by sending it to the person using it - this can be by email, WhatsApp, bluetooth or whatever. I'm afraid the idea of letting someone else log in to your email account to use such a ticket is pushing plausibility a bit.

Majority of my immediate family know each others email password for example sometimes my mother is sent emails regarding me and as she is not extremely proficient in technology I will normally login & see what the email is about. In this case my brother normally can just login on his mobile phone to access the specific ticket.

 

[30907]

I am writing to you regarding the report that was filed on 03/12/2021 in where I was reported to have a invalid ticket for my travel. I would like to start by offering my apologies as I booked a child ticket for the for 3/12/2021 as a one time act of negligence, as my family and I were looking for prices for my little brother who was 15 at the time to come and see me, because I regularly buy train tickets using my phone for my younger brother, and on the occasion concerned, the settings on my phone which I used to buy my ticket defaulted to a child rate fare. I was in a hurry and failed to notice this, and was given permission at the barrier line to board by an employee of chiltern which the cctv footage on this date 3/12/2021 at approximately 21:15 I was seen at the barriers wearing a black hooded jacket, black trousers and a black leather holdall bag further supports this, where, following the discussion I had with barrier line staff about my ticket before boarding I understood I was given permission to board the train and resolve the ticket matter with staff on board by paying the correct fare.

Leading on, the other occasions you detail were in fact occasions when I bought tickets for my brother who was aged 15 at the time. I did not personally use these tickets for travel

In conclusion I understand that on this one occasion on 3/12/2021 in ordering my ticket in a rush without thoroughly checking my ticket I had committed an act of negligence ... and I accept full responsibility of this and again sincerely apologise for a grave mistake I have made and moving on I will be more diligent in ordering my tickets. I kindly request if this can be settled by me paying the outstanding fee + any further administration fees at your discretion of course without this being escalated any further, as this has been looming over my head for some time and is affecting my mental health.

First, I suggest some possible cuts to your text - sections that I don't think TIL will be interested in.

Second, thank you for the explanation of the unusual arrangements you have for buying tickets for family members. You can presumably see why your pattern of buying aroused suspicion (did you buy any other tickets during that period?). Hold on to your fully detailed explanation for the next round!

Meanwhile, it might be a wise precaution to read the Ts and Cs of the website you buy from to check that you are not falling foul of them.

 

[WesternLancer]

First, I suggest some possible cuts to your text - sections that I don't think TIL will be interested in.

Second, thank you for the explanation of the unusual arrangements you have for buying tickets for family members. You can presumably see why your pattern of buying aroused suspicion (did you buy any other tickets during that period?). Hold on to your fully detailed explanation for the next round!

Meanwhile, it might be a wise precaution to read the Ts and Cs of the website you buy from to check that you are not falling foul of them.

V good advice.

If they can see that the OP has bought other tickets for travel at adult rate then they might accept that it is plausible that occasional purchases are for a child relative (after all, it must be common that people buy tickets for relatives who are children). But I would stress the importance of this being actually true.

 

[Unistudent101]

First, I suggest some possible cuts to your text - sections that I don't think TIL will be interested in.

Second, thank you for the explanation of the unusual arrangements you have for buying tickets for family members. You can presumably see why your pattern of buying aroused suspicion (did you buy any other tickets during that period?). Hold on to your fully detailed explanation for the next round!

Meanwhile, it might be a wise precaution to read the Ts and Cs of the website you buy from to check that you are not falling foul of them.

Thank you for your feedback
I have now updated my draft and I thinks it’s fairly ready to be sent off now. And yes I averagely buy six tickets each month to and from london or within Birmingham & are normally on adult, only the 4 said tickets have been a child’s prior to this incident.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 26 Apr 2022 ==

V good advice.

If they can see that the OP has bought other tickets for travel at adult rate then they might accept that it is plausible that occasional purchases are for a child relative (after all, it must be common that people buy tickets for relatives who are children). But I would stress the importance of this being actually true.

Yes, I’m hoping they would be able to check cctv, I read somewhere that cctv if not used in stores is destroyed after 30 days so hopefully this isn’t the case for stations, and they would further be able to see my conversation with the barrier line staff on 3/12/2021.

 

[Haywain]

I read somewhere that cctv if not used in stores is destroyed after 30 days so hopefully this isn’t the case for stations, and they would further be able to see my conversation with the barrier line staff on 3/12/2021.

There is not the remotest chance of this CCTV footage being available now.

 

[AlterEgo]

There is not the remotest chance of this CCTV footage being available now.

Nor would it contain any audio or the content of any conversation anyway.

 

[Unistudent101]

Nor would it contain any audio or the content of any conversation anyway.

I didn’t even think of that to be fair. Well I’ve sent off my edited draft along with the very helpful advice from here & all I can do now is cross my fingers and wait.

 

[WesternLancer]

I didn’t even think of that to be fair. Well I’ve sent off my edited draft along with the very helpful advice from here & all I can do now is cross my fingers and wait.

Good luck with the next steps. Given it is Chiltern/TIL I would be prepared for them to write back and not accept this and continue to threaten prosecution so you will need to be ready to write again, further pressing your request to settle, apology etc.

 

[Unistudent101]

Good luck with the next steps. Given it is Chiltern/TIL I would be prepared for them to write back and not accept this and continue to threaten prosecution so you will need to be ready to write again, further pressing your request to settle, apology etc.

Okay will do, many thanks again.

 

[Snow1964]

I suggest you wait, but it may also be useful to keep in reserve the occasional buying tickets for a child in the family. It is not that common for children to have debit cards at 15 (and illegal to have credit cards under 18) and to best of my knowledge the online ticket sales don’t allow you to pay without a card.

I am not sure about payment cards on phones (I refuse to use it, as dead or lost phone could cause chaos), but I vaguely remember someone saying that legally a person under 18 can’t have a contract phone, which brings us back to question of why you would have bought tickets at intervals for child in family. So the buying history probably won’t stand up to cross examination in Court to show you have done it multiple times (it is circumstantial in legal jargon, not proof). There is only a strict liability on the journey you were caught.

Others will advise better, but if they don’t want to settle, but want to prosecute then getting any previous purchases of a child ticket included as evidence of repeated offence needs to be opposed.

 

[cornishjohn]

It is not that common for children to have debit cards at 15 (and illegal to have credit cards under 18) and to best of my knowledge the online ticket sales don’t allow you to pay without a card.

May not be "common" but Natwest at least have a card account available for those 11+. Claims to work with ApplePay and GooglePay. And cannot online ticket sales be made with gift-voucher codes? ( Although I quite agree about the dead phone issue..)

... but I vaguely remember someone saying that legally a person under 18 can’t have a contract phone, which brings us back to question of why you would have bought tickets at intervals for child in family.

This sounds more like a contractual issue for the phone company than the TOC, but I don't see why I cannot maintain a phone contract for my daughter say.

Still, OP should only make specific claims that are actually true rather than might be true.

 

[danm14]

It is not that common for children to have debit cards at 15

I don't think this is accurate these days, especially given the prevalence of businesses that refuse to accept cash.

The majority of banks offer debit cards to teenagers, and there are even prepaid cards controlled by parents available to primary school children.

Personally, I got my first debit card at the age of 12, and that was over a decade ago. Didn't use it more than once or twice until I was 15 or 16, mind you, but I had one.

 

[Unistudent101]

I suggest you wait, but it may also be useful to keep in reserve the occasional buying tickets for a child in the family. It is not that common for children to have debit cards at 15 (and illegal to have credit cards under 18) and to best of my knowledge the online ticket sales don’t allow you to pay without a card.

I am not sure about payment cards on phones (I refuse to use it, as dead or lost phone could cause chaos), but I vaguely remember someone saying that legally a person under 18 can’t have a contract phone, which brings us back to question of why you would have bought tickets at intervals for child in family. So the buying history probably won’t stand up to cross examination in Court to show you have done it multiple times (it is circumstantial in legal jargon, not proof). There is only a strict liability on the journey you were caught.

Others will advise better, but if they don’t want to settle, but want to prosecute then getting any previous purchases of a child ticket included as evidence of repeated offence needs to be

The majority of banks offer debit cards to teenagers, and there are even prepaid cards controlled by parents available to primary school children.

Personally, I got my first debit card at the age of 12, and that was over a decade ago. Didn't use it more than once or twice until I was 15 or 16, mind you, but I had one.

My little brother had a debit card at the time but had literally never used it before, therefore because I already had a train line account, and like I said before my mother isn’t proficient when it comes to paying for things online, I would normally just pay for it and receive the money for it in cash. My mistake was not teaching my brother how to correctly pay for things online and this experience has been an evident lesson to this.

 

[AlterEgo]

I suggest you wait, but it may also be useful to keep in reserve the occasional buying tickets for a child in the family. It is not that common for children to have debit cards at 15 (and illegal to have credit cards under 18) and to best of my knowledge the online ticket sales don’t allow you to pay without a card.

The OP should also bear in mind the (small, but not zero) chance that this goes to court and he faces the prospect of calling his little brother to testify, under oath, in his defence. I urge the OP to consider carefully whether they want to use this defence at all.

 

[Unistudent101]

Hi all,
I finally received a response from TiL saying a summons may be made and when asked to pay the appropriate fare I was unable to do which I don’t understand because when I asked to pay the outstanding fee to the revenue officer, he refused to authorise this. I don’t know what more to say, I would appreciate anyone’s advice as I’m starting to panic now.

 

[AlterEgo]

What’s the date on their letter? They’re coming very close to the six month statute of limitations for summary-only offences.

 

[Unistudent101]

What’s the date on their letter? They’re coming very close to the six month statute of limitations for summary-only offences.

The letter says it was sent on 16/05/2022

 

[WesternLancer]

The letter says it was sent on 16/05/2022

Isn't this the fairly common case of TIL rejecting requests for leniency at first response? That we often see. See my post #15 above.

I think you have got to write again pleading to be allowed to settle and being more profuse in your apology and regret.

The para about failing to pay the appropriate fare does not mean that when you were caught with a non valid ticket it is OK to offer to pay up the correct fare then and all is OK - it means that you failed to pay the appropriate fare before you got on the train and thus the staff had no alternative but to refer you for enforcement / potential prosecution. And I suspect they are not interested / do not believe that this was a ticket bought for your younger brother that you used in error (IIRC)

You need to write to them again saying how serious you now understand this to be and how apologetic you are, that you will be sure it never happens again and ask if they will kindly consider not to take you to court but let you settle the matter with them without court action.

I would not get into the business about it being for your bro now (if mentioned before in prev letter then not much more to say on that explanation in any case).

 

[Jason12]

I finally received a response from TiL saying a summons may be made and when asked to pay the appropriate fare I was unable to do which I don’t understand because when I asked to pay the outstanding fee to the revenue officer, he refused to authorise this.

You need to understand that because you boarded the train at a station where you had the opportunity to purchase the correct ticket, you "failed to pay the appropriate fare due in accordance with the rules in force". Having done that, offering to pay when apprehended by a revenue inspector is not an option the train company is bound to accede to. Paying at the earliest opportunity, once you have boarded the train is only an option if there is no opportunity to purchase the correct ticket at the station where you board.

If you want to make further comment, mentioning that you really do understand these simple rules may yet convince the train company not to prosecute as they are minded to.

 

[AlterEgo]

The letter says it was sent on 16/05/2022

Ok. And what did you send them before? Do you have the final letter to hand that you can post for us to see? (I know you posted a first draft)

 

[Unistudent101]

You need to understand that because you boarded the train at a station where you had the opportunity to purchase the correct ticket, you "failed to pay the appropriate fare due in accordance with the rules in force". Having done that, offering to pay when apprehended by a revenue inspector is not an option the train company is bound to accede to. Paying at the earliest opportunity, once you have boarded the train is only an option if there is no opportunity to purchase the correct ticket at the station where you board.

If you want to make further comment, mentioning that you really do understand these simple rules may yet convince the train company not to prosecute as they are minded to.

Thank you for your advice, I will attempt a second letter reiterating how much I understand the severity of the rules put into place to prevent ticket fare evasion, but because I went into a lot of detail on this I'm my first draft I’m quite stuck on what more to add.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 May 2022 ==

Ok. And what did you send them before? Do you have the final letter to hand that you can post for us to see? (I know you posted a first draft)

I emphasised on how much I understood that I had no one to blame but myself for not ensuring it was the valid ticket, and pleaded for an out of court settlement.

Apologies if my writing is difficult to read.

 

[WesternLancer]

Thank you for your advice, I will attempt a second letter reiterating how much I understand the severity of the rules put into place to prevent ticket fare evasion, but because I went into a lot of detail on this I'm my first draft I’m quite stuck on what more to add.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 May 2022 ==


I emphasised on how much I understood that I had no one to blame but myself for not ensuring it was the valid ticket, and pleaded for an out of court settlement.

Apologies if my writing is difficult to read.

If you feel you have covered it before then write pretty much the same again, but more succinctly and more apologetically.

 

[AlterEgo]

Thank you for your advice, I will attempt a second letter reiterating how much I understand the severity of the rules put into place to prevent ticket fare evasion, but because I went into a lot of detail on this I'm my first draft I’m quite stuck on what more to add.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 18 May 2022 ==


I emphasised on how much I understood that I had no one to blame but myself for not ensuring it was the valid ticket, and pleaded for an out of court settlement.

Apologies if my writing is difficult to read.

Afraid I am on mobile - is there a file attached to that post that I am supposed to be able to see?