Bought wrong ticket and lied about age

[Linnen1060]

Early this year in January I was going on a trip to London for a school organised work experience event. I haven't used railways too often and unfortunately bought a ticket to London Marylebone, which was a child ticket and not an adult ticket as I was 18. Before this, the last time I had bought a ticket was when i was 16. When the railway staff came on board to check the tickets I looked at my ticket and realised I had bought the wrong ticket. Rather than telling my age the first time, i got flustered and foolishly gave the wrong date of birth. The staff member picked up on this, and then had to write out a form. I told him my correct details on every question and even said that i had accidentally bought the wrong ticket. I also asked to pay for the adult ticket when he was telling me what would happen. If i own up to my mistake in the response to the letter that i have received, stress that i was foolish and this will never occur again, as well as say that i offered to pay for the adult ticket, as well as graciously pay for the problems i have caused i.e. actual ticket fare and administrative costs, would i be able to avoid a court summons? Or is there intent to dodge the fare, even though i offered to repay, and stated that i accidentally bought the wrong ticket.

 

[Wethebest838]

You’re going to receive a letter from TIL (transport investigations limited). It will ask for your version of events. @Hadders gives amazing advice that personally helped me with a case my cousin had with TIL.

The letter will take up to 6 months. The letter my cousin got took 4 months? So don’t panic. Easier said than done but just relax, don’t let it stress you out. You ain’t going to prison, worst you get is a fine and a criminal record for a year which is not recognised after a year (rehabilitation act). You’ll just have to declare it to your job/future job. It’s such a minor thing that employers won’t care unless you’re El Chapo level of crime.

Post your letter here when you get it without personal details and members can assist. Can I ask what station this was coming from to Marylebone and honestly is this your first ever time? They will check with other rail ticketing companies to check if you’ve done this before.

Sadly, you won’t be able to say about it’s been ages since you travelled on a train and didn’t realise you got a child ticket as you’re 18 now. 18 is when you are an adult. I wouldn’t even bother mentioning it.

Need anything at all, shoot me a DM!

 

[Linnen1060]

You’re going to receive a letter from TIL (transport investigations limited). It will ask for your version of events. @Hadders gives amazing advice that personally helped me with a case my cousin had with TIL.

The letter will take up to 6 months. The letter my cousin got took 4 months? So don’t panic. Easier said than done but just relax, don’t let it stress you out. You ain’t going to prison, worst you get is a fine and a criminal record for a year which is not recognised after a year (rehabilitation act). You’ll just have to declare it to your job/future job. It’s such a minor thing that employers won’t care unless you’re El Chapo level of crime.

Post your letter here when you get it without personal details and members can assist. Can I ask what station this was coming from to Marylebone and honestly is this your first ever time? They will check with other rail ticketing companies to check if you’ve done this before.

Sadly, you won’t be able to say about it’s been ages since you travelled on a train and didn’t realise you got a child ticket as you’re 18 now. 18 is when you are an adult. I wouldn’t even bother mentioning it.

Need anything at all, shoot me a DM!

I have received the letter, and it states that i failed to produce a valid ticket for the journey, allows me to inform them of any mitigation that i wish to be considered, as well as evidence that warrants a prosecution in accordance with current legislation, which may include a charge that alleges an offence against Railway Byelaws or the Regulation of Railways Act 1889. It also states that i have up to 21 days to respond.

This was from High Wycombe station to London Marylebone, and is indeed my first time ever doing something this foolish, and the railways can check that i haven't gone on a railway since I was 16. I won't mention that, though, I'm thinking of just using Hadders' guidelines, and state that I accept what i did was wrong, what I have learnt, I will be willing to pay for all administrative costs relating to this, as well as me being keen to settle out of court. I will also say how this may impact my job opportunities. Though I am undecided of whether going to solicitors for this or just reply with a lengthy email using Hadders' guidelines. Do you think it is likely to show intent, given the fact that they'll see that I have rarely used the train service, offered to repay, and stated on the incident form that it was a genuine accident?

Thank you for replying so soon.

 

[L401CJF]

I wouldn't mention the last time you used the railway you were 16, it wouldnt help your defence as child tickets arn't valid for 16 year olds either in most areas

 

[Wethebest838]

Though I am undecided of whether going to solicitors for this or just reply with a lengthy email using Hadders' guidelines. Do you think it is likely to show intent, given the fact that they'll see that I have rarely used the train service, offered to repay, and stated on the incident form that it was a genuine accident?

Me personally, I don’t think a solicitor is needed at this moment. I’m no law expert at all and others may disagree.

You seem to know what to write. Post your draft and we can all read over and advise!

Thing is, the letter as Hadders says should be short not long. Don’t bore them as they’ve heard every excuse probably under the sun.

 

[Fawkes Cat]

Though I am undecided of whether going to solicitors for this or just reply with a lengthy email using Hadders' guidelines.

A couple of things from here:
- don’t make it a ‘lengthy’ email: say what you need to say, making each point once, and then stop. I say this because someone at the railway is going to have to read your email and decide what the railway will do next. If you just keep repeating yourself, you are going to take up a lot of their time - and if at the end of spending half an hour reading your email they realise you could have said everything in five minutes, they’re not going to be best pleased with you for wasting their time. This could make them less keen on going forward in the best way for you.
- if you involve a solicitor, this is inevitably going to cost a lot of money, because solicitors don’t come cheap. Against this, a solicitor might be able to stop the case going to court, which would save you the cost of any court fine on top. Or they might not stop it going to court leading to paying the fine as well as the solicitor’s fee. You need to decide if it’s worth certainly paying extra money to a solicitor to possibly avoid going to court.
- following on from that, you need to know that even if the worst happens and you do get convicted in court, this has limited on-going implications. Of course, you would have to pay a fine, plus court fees, plus prosecution fees, plus the train fare that you should have paid. But there are very few jobs that one conviction for not paying the right fare would block you from. If you plan to be maybe a doctor or teacher or nurse or lawyer, you will probably have to own up to the conviction - but as long as it has only happened once, and you can show that you have learnt not to do it again and why you shouldn’t do it again, then you are unlikely to be blocked even from those professions.

 

[Linnen1060]

To whom it may concern,

I am writing to you in response to the correspondence received relating to case REF:

On the 25th January, I was stopped at the end of a journey between High Wycombe and London Marylebone by a member of the Revenue Protection staff. At High Wycombe Railway Station, I bought a ticket for a train to London Marylebone, not noticing that it was a child ticket rather than an adult one.

During the ride, I saw a ticket inspector had boarded and scrambled for my ticket, at which point I noticed that I had boarded using a child ticket. Upon inspection, I was asked for my date of birth, and in my flustered state I gave the wrong date of birth. I was then asked to give ID to prove it and corrected myself that I was actually 18 and had accidentally bought the wrong ticket.

Through this event and the documentation supplied by TIL, I can see without question how I broke the rules. In boarding a train without a valid ticket, I violated my right of fair passage on the service – as well as the related byelaws. In this experience, I have learned the importance of the Revenue Protection staff in enforcing the rules of travel on all British Rail Services – including that of Chiltern Railways. I have also realised how foolish it was of me to not double check the ticket that I had bought, as well as the fact that giving the wrong date of birth would not serve me any purpose.

I have learned greatly from these mistakes and won’t make them in any way again. I would like to stress how I never had the intention of trying to not pay for a ticket. I believe I have shown this through my intention to purchase an adult ticket for the ride and by stating that it was a genuine accident.

This is my first offence and I have never been in trouble with the law before this incident. In the next few weeks, I will be taking my A levels and afterwards hopefully studying law at university. As an aspiring lawyer, I will be subject to regular DBS and enhanced DBS checks and likely impede my career.

I would like to ask for the possibility of reaching an out of court settlement and not to seek a prosecution for a first-time offence and incredibly stupid mistake. I would like to stress that I am willing to pay a fine and the administrative costs for Chiltern Railways, as a result of this mistake.

I would like to again apologise for the mistakes I have made and the amount of work this has created for the staff of Chiltern Railways and TIL, and assert that the lessons I have learned from this ensure I will never make such a foolish mistake again.

Kind regards,

Name and surname

This is what I am thinking of replying with, any suggestions, advice or recommendations would be amazing.

 

[WesternLancer]

cases on here with Chiltern and TIL have often involved the passenger needing to write 2 or 3 times to press their case to get out of court settlement. OP may wish to bear this in mind, and seek more advice from here as required.
Also - get a railcard ASAP for a young person - shows intent to do the right thing in future.

 

[Linnen1060]

cases on here with Chiltern and TIL have often involved the passenger needing to write 2 or 3 times to press their case to get out of court settlement. OP may wish to bear this in mind, and seek more advice from here as required.
Also - get a railcard ASAP for a young person - shows intent to do the right thing in future.

Sounds like a great idea, i will follow up with how i intend to buy a railcard for my future travels to university, as i will need one to travel to London. Also what do you mean by writing 2/3 times, if needs be i will send follow ups to Chiltern and TIL in order to stress my remorse and regret for my actions.

 

[WesternLancer]

Also what do you mean by writing 2/3 times, if needs be i will send follow ups to Chiltern and TIL in order to stress my remorse and regret for my actions.

Basically what you say - TIL seem to reply to 1st responses from evaders and say 'we are still minded to take you to court given the content of your reply to us' - meaning you have to write again to further try to persuade them to let you settle.

If that happens of course you can head back here for further advice if you think it will help.

 

[AlterEgo]

Sounds like a great idea, i will follow up with how i intend to buy a railcard for my future travels to university, as i will need one to travel to London. Also what do you mean by writing 2/3 times, if needs be i will send follow ups to Chiltern and TIL in order to stress my remorse and regret for my actions.

You should actually buy the railcard and send them a photocopy so they know that’s not another lie.

Be sure not to expend all your points in the first letter, because any second letter will need to be more punchy than “oh go on please” - do post a draft here once you’ve written it!

 

[Bertie the bus]

To whom it may concern,

I am writing to you in response to the correspondence received relating to case REF:

On the 25th January, I was stopped at the end of a journey between High Wycombe and London Marylebone by a member of the Revenue Protection staff. At High Wycombe Railway Station, I bought a ticket for a train to London Marylebone, not noticing that it was a child ticket rather than an adult one.

During the ride, I saw a ticket inspector had boarded and scrambled for my ticket, at which point I noticed that I had boarded using a child ticket. Upon inspection, I was asked for my date of birth, and in my flustered state I gave the wrong date of birth. I was then asked to give ID to prove it and corrected myself that I was actually 18 and had accidentally bought the wrong ticket.

Through this event and the documentation supplied by TIL, I can see without question how I broke the rules. In boarding a train without a valid ticket, I violated my right of fair passage on the service – as well as the related byelaws. In this experience, I have learned the importance of the Revenue Protection staff in enforcing the rules of travel on all British Rail Services – including that of Chiltern Railways. I have also realised how foolish it was of me to not double check the ticket that I had bought, as well as the fact that giving the wrong date of birth would not serve me any purpose.

I have learned greatly from these mistakes and won’t make them in any way again. I would like to stress how I never had the intention of trying to not pay for a ticket. I believe I have shown this through my intention to purchase an adult ticket for the ride and by stating that it was a genuine accident.

This is my first offence and I have never been in trouble with the law before this incident. In the next few weeks, I will be taking my A levels and afterwards hopefully studying law at university. As an aspiring lawyer, I will be subject to regular DBS and enhanced DBS checks and likely impede my career.

I would like to ask for the possibility of reaching an out of court settlement and not to seek a prosecution for a first-time offence and incredibly stupid mistake. I would like to stress that I am willing to pay a fine and the administrative costs for Chiltern Railways, as a result of this mistake.

I would like to again apologise for the mistakes I have made and the amount of work this has created for the staff of Chiltern Railways and TIL, and assert that the lessons I have learned from this ensure I will never make such a foolish mistake again.

Kind regards,

Name and surname

This is what I am thinking of replying with, any suggestions, advice or recommendations would be amazing.

You may be able to agree to an out of court settlement but I wouldn’t send that letter as most of your claims are simply not credible.

• It is very difficult to accidently purchase a child ticket
• It is even more difficult to forget your own date of birth and lying about it is pretty conclusive proof buying a child ticket wasn’t an accident.
• Offering to buy an adult ticket once your lie had been discovered does not prove you had no intention of avoiding the correct fare, in fact points 1 and 2 strongly point to the fact you did.

I think your chances of a positive outcome would be improved if you took some responsibility for your actions, rather than make excuses, and showed some contrition. Very few organisations want to criminalise somebody who is still at school but you need to give them a reason not to and trying to make out it was all an accident won't.

 

[30907]

You may be able to agree to an out of court settlement but I wouldn’t send that letter as most of your claims are simply not credible.

• It is very difficult to accidently purchase a child ticket
• It is even more difficult to forget your own date of birth and lying about it is pretty conclusive proof buying a child ticket wasn’t an accident.
• Offering to buy an adult ticket once your lie had been discovered does not prove you had no intention of avoiding the correct fare, in fact points 1 and 2 strongly point to the fact you did.

I would also leave out the reference to your future career because it is highly unlikely that your career will be hindered by a one off incident.
And in any case they have heard it all before

 

[6Gman]

To whom it may concern,

I am writing to you in response to the correspondence received relating to case REF:

On the 25th January, I was stopped at the end of a journey between High Wycombe and London Marylebone by a member of the Revenue Protection staff. At High Wycombe Railway Station, I bought a ticket for a train to London Marylebone, not noticing that it was a child ticket rather than an adult one.

During the ride, I saw a ticket inspector had boarded and scrambled for my ticket, at which point I noticed that I had boarded using a child ticket. Upon inspection, I was asked for my date of birth, and in my flustered state I gave the wrong date of birth. I was then asked to give ID to prove it and corrected myself that I was actually 18 and had accidentally bought the wrong ticket.

I would suggest you give serious thought to how you have expressed these claims.

I think the people reviewing your case will ask how you buy your ticket at High Wycombe? And whether it was at a booking office or a ticket machine how do you "accidentally" buy a child ticket?

 

[Wethebest838]

You may be able to agree to an out of court settlement but I wouldn’t send that letter as most of your claims are simply not credible.

• It is very difficult to accidently purchase a child ticket
• It is even more difficult to forget your own date of birth and lying about it is pretty conclusive proof buying a child ticket wasn’t an accident.
• Offering to buy an adult ticket once your lie had been discovered does not prove you had no intention of avoiding the correct fare, in fact points 1 and 2 strongly point to the fact you did.

I think your chances of a positive outcome would be improved if you took some responsibility for your actions, rather than make excuses, and showed some contrition. Very few organisations want to criminalise somebody who is still at school but you need to give them a reason not to and trying to make out it was all an accident won't.

Yeah I agree with this.

 

[jumble]

To whom it may concern,

I am writing to you in response to the correspondence received relating to case REF:

On the 25th January, I was stopped at the end of a journey between High Wycombe and London Marylebone by a member of the Revenue Protection staff. At High Wycombe Railway Station, I bought a ticket for a train to London Marylebone, not noticing that it was a child ticket rather than an adult one.

During the ride, I saw a ticket inspector had boarded and scrambled for my ticket, at which point I noticed that I had boarded using a child ticket. Upon inspection, I was asked for my date of birth, and in my flustered state I gave the wrong date of birth. I was then asked to give ID to prove it and corrected myself that I was actually 18 and had accidentally bought the wrong ticket.

Through this event and the documentation supplied by TIL, I can see without question how I broke the rules. In boarding a train without a valid ticket, I violated my right of fair passage on the service – as well as the related byelaws. In this experience, I have learned the importance of the Revenue Protection staff in enforcing the rules of travel on all British Rail Services – including that of Chiltern Railways. I have also realised how foolish it was of me to not double check the ticket that I had bought, as well as the fact that giving the wrong date of birth would not serve me any purpose.

I have learned greatly from these mistakes and won’t make them in any way again. I would like to stress how I never had the intention of trying to not pay for a ticket. I believe I have shown this through my intention to purchase an adult ticket for the ride and by stating that it was a genuine accident.

This is my first offence and I have never been in trouble with the law before this incident. In the next few weeks, I will be taking my A levels and afterwards hopefully studying law at university. As an aspiring lawyer, I will be subject to regular DBS and enhanced DBS checks and likely impede my career.

I would like to ask for the possibility of reaching an out of court settlement and not to seek a prosecution for a first-time offence and incredibly stupid mistake. I would like to stress that I am willing to pay a fine and the administrative costs for Chiltern Railways, as a result of this mistake.

I would like to again apologise for the mistakes I have made and the amount of work this has created for the staff of Chiltern Railways and TIL, and assert that the lessons I have learned from this ensure I will never make such a foolish mistake again.

Kind regards,

Name and surname

This is what I am thinking of replying with, any suggestions, advice or recommendations would be amazing.

Personally I would carefully consider leaving out the bit about giving the wrong date of birth
You have no idea if this was put into the report and you may well be confessing to things that TIL are unaware of
However I am not qualified so perhaps other opinions might help you to decide to do so or not
The best evidence TIL can have is what you tell them

 

[Wethebest838]

Personally I would carefully consider leaving out the bit about giving the wrong date of birth
You have no idea if this was put into the report and you may well be confessing to things that TIL are unaware of
However I am not qualified so perhaps other opinions might help you to decide to do so or not
The best evidence TIL can have is what you tell them

I heard TIL and TOC’s frequent the forum. If so, it might be best for the OP to remove it incase it’s used against them even if they don’t tell TIL?

 

[ashkeba]

I think the people reviewing your case will ask how you buy your ticket at High Wycombe? And whether it was at a booking office or a ticket machine how do you "accidentally" buy a child ticket?

I am nearly 60 and have accidentally bought a child ticket. Some TVM touchscreens are very inaccurate and select buttons besides the one you try to press, plus the interface layouts keep changing. I noticed and queued at the counter who changed it, missing one train. I do not know if a High Wycombe TVM has adukt and child buttons side by side but in general it has been possible sometimes.

 

[Haywain]

I am nearly 60 and have accidentally bought a child ticket. Some TVM touchscreens are very inaccurate and select buttons besides the one you try to press, plus the interface layouts keep changing. I noticed and queued at the counter who changed it, missing one train. I do not know if a High Wycombe TVM has adukt and child buttons side by side but in general it has been possible sometimes.

On most TVMs the default is for a ticket for one adult, and to only buy a child ticket it is necessary to deselect the adult and select a child - so it's very difficult to do by accident.

 

[ashkeba]

On most TVMs the default is for a ticket for one adult, and to only buy a child ticket it is necessary to deselect the adult and select a child - so it's very difficult to do by accident.

I am sure I managed it! I have also managed to press "+ child" instead of "+ adult" (which were next to each other) on several occasions when 2 of us travelled but I have noticed and corrected all of those before purchase so far.

 

[najaB]

I am sure I managed it! I have also managed to press "+ child" instead of "+ adult" (which were next to each other) on several occasions when 2 of us travelled but I have noticed and corrected all of those before purchase so far.

If you were only paying for one ticket (as the OP was) then there would have been zero reason to go anywhere near the Adult/Child option.

 

[ashkeba]

If you were only paying for one ticket (as the OP was) then there would have been zero reason to go anywhere near the Adult/Child option.

You must know the current High Wycombe TVM interface better than me.

 

[najaB]

You must know the current High Wycombe TVM interface better than me.

I'll admit that I have never used the TVMs at High Wycombe, but every TVM I've ever used defaults to one adult ticket.

 

[6Gman]

And unless the OP tells us we don't know whether he even used the TVMs.

 

[Linnen1060]

Hello, I thank you all for your responses I would like to follow up with a second draft of a response to TIL. Please feel free to give any advice, regarding the tone of the passage and possible errors within.
I would also like to know whether i need to post this letter to TIL or would it be possible to email this TIL, and send through further letters through emails and call them if it doesn't work.

Dear Sir/ Madam

I am writing to you in response to the correspondence received relating to case REF:XXXX

On the 25th January, I was stopped at the end of a journey between High Wycombe and London Marylebone by a member of the Revenue Protection staff. At High Wycombe Railway Station, I rather foolishly bought a child ticket rather than an adult ticket, as a result of the cheaper price. During the ride, I was approached by a ticket inspector, and was found to have a child ticket, rather than an adult one. I was then asked to give ID to prove it and I showed my provisional driving license that demonstrated that I was not fit for a child ticket.

Through this event and the documentation supplied by TIL, I can see without question how I broke the rules. In boarding a train without a valid ticket, I violated my right of fair passage on the service – as well as the related byelaws. In this experience, I have learned the importance of the Revenue Protection staff in enforcing the rules of travel on all British Rail Services – including that of Chiltern Railways.

I have learned greatly from these mistakes and won’t make them in any way again and have already bought a railcard for my future travels, as I hope to study in London for university, and so a railcard will prove most useful. In the next few weeks, I will be taking my A levels and afterwards hopefully studying law at university. As an aspiring lawyer, I will be subject to regular DBS and enhanced DBS checks and likely have an effect on my career.

I would like to ask for the possibility of reaching an out of court settlement and not to seek a prosecution for a first-time offence and incredibly stupid mistake. I would like to stress that I am willing to pay a fine and the administrative costs for Chiltern Railways, as a result of this mistake, as well as any other costs that may have resulted because of my actions.

I would like to again apologise for the mistakes I have made and the amount of work this has created for the staff of Chiltern Railways and TIL, and assert that the lessons I have learned from this experience will ensure that I will never make such a foolish mistake again.

Kind regards,

Name and surname

 

[WesternLancer]

Hello, I thank you all for your responses I would like to follow up with a second draft of a response to TIL. Please feel free to give any advice, regarding the tone of the passage and possible errors within.
I would also like to know whether i need to post this letter to TIL or would it be possible to email this TIL, and send through further letters through emails and call them if it doesn't work.

Dear Sir/ Madam

I am writing to you in response to the correspondence received relating to case REF:XXXX

On the 25th January, I was stopped at the end of a journey between High Wycombe and London Marylebone by a member of the Revenue Protection staff. At High Wycombe Railway Station, I rather foolishly bought a child ticket rather than an adult ticket, as a result of the cheaper price. During the ride, I was approached by a ticket inspector, and was found to have a child ticket, rather than an adult one. I was then asked to give ID to prove it and I showed my provisional driving license that demonstrated that I was not fit for a child ticket.

Through this event and the documentation supplied by TIL, I can see without question how I broke the rules. In boarding a train without a valid ticket, I violated my right of fair passage on the service – as well as the related byelaws. In this experience, I have learned the importance of the Revenue Protection staff in enforcing the rules of travel on all British Rail Services – including that of Chiltern Railways.

I have learned greatly from these mistakes and won’t make them in any way again and have already bought a railcard for my future travels, as I hope to study in London for university, and so a railcard will prove most useful. In the next few weeks, I will be taking my A levels and afterwards hopefully studying law at university. As an aspiring lawyer, I will be subject to regular DBS and enhanced DBS checks and likely have an effect on my career.

I would like to ask for the possibility of reaching an out of court settlement and not to seek a prosecution for a first-time offence and incredibly stupid mistake. I would like to stress that I am willing to pay a fine and the administrative costs for Chiltern Railways, as a result of this mistake, as well as any other costs that may have resulted because of my actions.

I would like to again apologise for the mistakes I have made and the amount of work this has created for the staff of Chiltern Railways and TIL, and assert that the lessons I have learned from this experience will ensure that I will never make such a foolish mistake again.

Kind regards,

Name and surname

my hunch would not be to actively mention your desire to pursue a career in law, whilst also admitting to having committed a criminal offence. Simply mention that you do not want to have court action on your record when you start out at university later this year.