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Services between Manchester and Sheffield

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Western Sunset

Western Sunset

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A0wen said:
A nice headline but not one borne out by the facts.

The North East during the 80s and 90s got the Tyne and Wear metro for example.

The North West during the late 80s and 90s got the Manchester Metrolink and now suburban services towards Bolton, Preston and Liverpool are electric run. Liverpool is the only city where all the major cities have electric services to them.

Compare that with the West Midlands - Suburban services from Leamington and Stratford through Snow Hill and onto Kidderminster are still diesel run. The Chase Line has only been electrified in 2019. Midland Metro only opened in 1999 - and even now doesn't reach areas such as Birmingham Airport or Dudley.

So less of the 'woe is me' from the North - the West Mids probably has the best claim to being most neglected - it also has a higher population than most of the NW and definitely the NE and it is more economically productive than either.
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We don't get much in terms of public transport investment/improvement down here in Dorset either... Just sayin'.
 
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Starmill

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A0wen said:
A nice headline but not one borne out by the facts.

The North East during the 80s and 90s got the Tyne and Wear metro for example.

The North West during the late 80s and 90s got the Manchester Metrolink and now suburban services towards Bolton, Preston and Liverpool are electric run. Liverpool is the only city where all the major cities have electric services to them.

Compare that with the West Midlands - Suburban services from Leamington and Stratford through Snow Hill and onto Kidderminster are still diesel run. The Chase Line has only been electrified in 2019. Midland Metro only opened in 1999 - and even now doesn't reach areas such as Birmingham Airport or Dudley.

So less of the 'woe is me' from the North - the West Mids probably has the best claim to being most neglected - it also has a higher population than most of the NW and definitely the NE and it is more economically productive than either.
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Manchester, Birmingham and Liverpool's urban conglomerates all have very similar quality of transport provision both on roads and rail. All are a very long way behind where they need to be to compete with London and other European cities of their own size.

Newcastle has perhaps fallen slightly behind but is similar overall. Leeds has definitely fallen significantly behind all of the rest. But the differences between them are small compared to where they all need to be. These are really very confected arguments about Birmingham being worse off than Newcastle.
 
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Western Sunset said:
We don't get much in terms of public transport investment/improvement down here in Dorset either... Just sayin'.
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Dorset has a population of ~ 700k, the West Midlands conurbation has nearly 6 million.

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Starmill said:
Manchester, Birmingham and Liverpool's urban conglomerates all have very similar quality of transport provision both on roads and rail. All are a very long way behind where they need to be to compete with London and other European cities of their own size.

Newcastle has perhaps fallen slightly behind but is similar overall. Leeds has definitely fallen significantly behind all of the rest. But the differences between them are small compared to where they all need to be. These are really very confected arguments about Birmingham being worse off than Newcastle.
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The don't need to "compete" with London, because at best they are half the size of London.

This incessant 'x' doesn't have the same provision as London is frankly absurd. When London is 50% bigger there is a logical reason why it has the provision it does.
 
Starmill

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A0wen said:
The don't need to "compete" with London, because at best they are half the size of London.

This incessant 'x' doesn't have the same provision as London is frankly absurd. When London is 50% bigger there is a logical reason why it has the provision it does.
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The point is based on government policy for so-called levelling up, not my ideas! The stage has thus been set in this way. Also it's quite undeniable that the cities mentioned do compete with other similarly sized Continental cities and there are so many of those where transport infrastructure spending has been much higher.
 
Western Sunset

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Back to the topic at hand...

Sometimes we forget how dire services used to be. These were the through trains (M-F) from Manchester to Sheffield (all five of 'em) in 1962, between 1600 and 2100:
Woodhead = Man Pic d 1610 Sheff Vic a 1703
Man Pic d 1700 Sheff Vic a 1758
Man Cent d 1741 Sheff Vic a 1855
Man Pic d 1910 Sheff Vic a 2015

Hope Valley = Man Cent d 1610 Sheff Mid a 1806
 
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Feuillesmortes

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Killingworth said:
This coming weekend is another mystery to explain. No Northern stoppers east of Edale on Saturday or Sunday. Engineering work they say in answer to a tweet. TPE and EMR seem to be running the route as normal - as normally as anything ever gets on this route.
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Can anyone confirm that the Sunday 13th timetable is "confirmed" please? And what is most reliable source?
 
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