Best and Worst Park and Ride schemes

[TheGrandWazoo]

There was a bit of discussion on other threads about Park and Rides. It got me thinking...

What are the best and worst Park and Ride schemes? What makes them good or bad, and what lessons can be learned?

Also, aside from the wishlists in various Bus Service Improvement Plans, are there any towns and cities that are planning to introduce P&Rs? They were very much in fashion at one point, but with funding cuts to local authorities, it feels like they're not so "en vogue".

 

[py_megapixel]

Any P&R with buses that run on busy roads with no priority, and/or where the return bus/train fare doesn't work out the cheapest option, is near pointless, as you might as well drive.

 

[CBlue]

I found Norwich's scheme to be pretty good in the past with frequent double-deck operated services - the site I had used most (Thickthorn) was operated by Konectbus with some tidy Wright/VDL and E400 'deckers and provided good service along with a speedy trip into the city centre along the A11 dual carriageway. Group tickets were pretty good value too.

Ipswich was far less impressive. The council seemed to have lost interest in the sites, closing one of them but with no publicity of such as you approached on the A14, and accessing the next site along was rather difficult due to terrible traffic congestion. Fares seemed expensive and although the First Eastern Counties B7 / / Wright single decks were new, but hardly clean inside. Not sure if things have improved since - Ipswich Buses took the contract back only to lose it back to First upon the next round of tendering. I hear it's a shadow of its former self in terms of service provision.

Cambridge used to be a fairly decent operation, although priority was definitely lacking for most routes making timekeeping an issue. Stagecoach updated the fleet a few years ago with new and fairly plush E400s but they spend most of their time on other routes requiring 'decker capacity, with older vehicles taking their place. Services haven't been quite so popular since the council introduced a parking fee at the sites which caused ridership to drop to the extent they lost even more money. The parking charges were withdrawn but ridership never seemed to quite recover to its previous levels before COVID then hit.

 

[Spaceflower]

Bad examples;
Leeds north - not sure why now but I got told it was bad. maybe because you're faced with the same problem that prompted you to use it in the first place i.e. congestion.

My personal favourite bad example is Heworth were you're forced to part with your money twice in two minutes (parking and metro). I'm still scarred now from the experience. Plus the roundabout could get badly congested (or did).

Best examples;
Single transactional ones that are quick to get to AND quick to get you onto your final destination. Durhams is ok in this respect but I only used it when I was encouraged to at work (included a certain amount of staff privilege's).

 

[Megafuss]

I found Norwich's scheme to be pretty good in the past with frequent double-deck operated services - the site I had used most (Thickthorn) was operated by Konectbus with some tidy Wright/VDL and E400 'deckers and provided good service along with a speedy trip into the city centre along the A11 dual carriageway. Group tickets were pretty good value too.

Ipswich was far less impressive. The council seemed to have lost interest in the sites, closing one of them but with no publicity of such as you approached on the A14, and accessing the next site along was rather difficult due to terrible traffic congestion. Fares seemed expensive and although the First Eastern Counties B7 / / Wright single decks were new, but hardly clean inside. Not sure if things have improved since - Ipswich Buses took the contract back only to lose it back to First upon the next round of tendering. I hear it's a shadow of its former self in terms of service provision.

Cambridge used to be a fairly decent operation, although priority was definitely lacking for most routes making timekeeping an issue. Stagecoach updated the fleet a few years ago with new and fairly plush E400s but they spend most of their time on other routes requiring 'decker capacity, with older vehicles taking their place. Services haven't been quite so popular since the council introduced a parking fee at the sites which caused ridership to drop to the extent they lost even more money. The parking charges were withdrawn but ridership never seemed to quite recover to its previous levels before COVID then hit.

Some of the infrastructure projects CCC embarked on were absolutely barmy when it cimes to Park and Rides. Narrowing Hills Road to the point that there is no point using the Park and Ride unless you want to feel like you are "doing your bit" is a case in point

 

[Joe Paxton]

Oxford's is a good scheme.

One recurring issue with P&R schemes is that the bus services often end in the mid-evening, and are built around a daytime use case (shoppers, workers etc), meaning they're no good for an evening/night out.

The other issue I've come across is the lack of provision for multi-day stays (or at least the lack of any clear information in publicity as to whether this is permissible), which I've found really frustrating in the past.

That said, I've been similarly frustrated with a lack of information online about multi-day stays in non-P&R car parks, often council operated ones. (I've come across examples where the website hasn't mentioned anything, but signage on the ground at the car park states that it is permitted.)

A further issue I've found with online P&R scheme publicity is the lack of a clear map showing the route(s) served by the bus(es) - I want a clear diagrammatic map that shows the stops served by the bus, with if necessary an inset (or insets) showing stops in the centre of the city. A Google Map with coloured lines overlaid doesn't cut it.

 

[Spaceflower]

Oxford's is a good scheme.

One recurring issue with P&R schemes is that the bus services often end in the mid-evening, and are built around a daytime use case (shoppers, workers etc), meaning they're no good for an evening/night out.

The other issue I've come across is the lack of provision for multi-day stays (or at least the lack of any clear information in publicity as to whether this is permissible), which I've found really frustrating in the past. Though other car parks

This is my personal take on it.

First point - Daytime use is their raison d'etre - They'd be a financial basket case on an evening due to lack of use. In any case, their main purpose is to alleviate externalities/costs associated with city centre congestion/parking. They have no use on an evening except perhaps by increasing their attractiveness for those working late/going out after work. Probably a hard cost to justify.

Second point - the best way to undermine the effectiveness/attractiveness and increase the cost of operation is to allow people to dump their cars there all week. Yes, I'm sure many would love to as it would be far cheaper than the other secure long stay options.

 

[S&CLER]

Of the Southport schemes, the one that uses the Esplanade car park still seems to be fairly popular, but the park and ride site on the east edge of town failed; you can still see the abandoned interchange from the train approaching Meols Cop from the east.

 

[Spaceflower]

Of the Southport schemes, the one that uses the Esplanade car park still seems to be fairly popular, but the park and ride site on the east edge of town failed; you can still see the abandoned interchange from the train approaching Meols Cop from the east.

What flow does/did that serve?

 

[RuddA]

The Sprowston P&R in Norwich gets a lot of use by people walking to it from the nearby houses. A lot cheaper than using First which charges approx £3.50 for children and nearly £5 for adults. Also avoids going into Tesco and numerous stops on the way.

 

[didbygraham]

Plymouth is s good example of what was a very good scheme with very high quality Enviro double deckers which are probably among the most comfortable buses we have seen in Plymouth, which has been allowed to wither away to nothing more than a normal bus route which due to covid now isnt even that frequent. The buses now stop at all stops and now are just in plain beachball livery so cant really be distinguished from any other route. Shame really.

 

[61653 HTAFC]

When I lived in Taunton, the Silk Mills P&R opened and despite living out near the racecourse I drove across town to sample it, which rather defeated the object. The service was good value, quick and reliable despite no major priority measures... but Taunton Deane Council had such cheap parking prices that they rather undercut their own scheme.

 

[asb]

One that seemed to go wrong was Worcester, where the regular monumental traffic congestion presumably wasn't avoided enough to compensate for other weaknesses in the scheme

 

[43055]

There was a bit of discussion on other threads about Park and Rides. It got me thinking...

What are the best and worst Park and Ride schemes? What makes them good or bad, and what lessons can be learned?

Also, aside from the wishlists in various Bus Service Improvement Plans, are there any towns and cities that are planning to introduce P&Rs? They were very much in fashion at one point, but with funding cuts to local authorities, it feels like they're not so "en vogue".

Personally I have only used the Scarborough P&R a few years back. It was in a good location for were we were coming from, frequent and quick into the town.

Derby's P&R is terrible.
There are two sites: Meteor Centre and Pride Park. The Meteor Centre is a retail park so there is no dedicated car park and now there is no longer a P&R service to the site (though I don't think anyone used it). Instead trentbarton's H1 stops on the main road every 10 mins.

Pride Park is not much better. The car park is hidden round the back of the arena/Pride Park stadium (I think) and the bus stop is just a flag with a timetable case. What use to be a frequent dedicated service is now 2 separate routes which are semi coordinated and are not shown in the same timetable so some people could think it is a half hourly service when it is actually served every 15 mins off peak and every 20mins at peak times.

 

[fgwrich]

Of sorts and down here in Hampshire: Best - Winchester / Worst - Basingstoke.

In Winchester, the service is frequent, well used, well signposted and has a smart fleet of fairly new long length E200 MMCs in a (for now at least) special P&R Green version of the beachball livery. The cost of it is included in the Parking as well and it's rather well regarded.

Whereas in Basingstoke, thanks to recent council cutbacks, we have nothing. Admittedly it ran between the West Ham Leisure Park > Town Centre > Basing View business park, but it felt like it had been in decline for some time. After Stagecoach took on the contract from Courtney, they purchased 2 additional (and not the most reliable) E200s for it. However, it didn't seem to attract the investment and promotion that it deserved, and was finally killed off last year, resulting a rather infrequent service from the town's main leisure park.

 

[cnjb8]

Nottingham used to have a dedicated fleet of electric buses for two park and ride sites, one near Clifton and the other near Colwick. Now they are merely stops on the 49 and 50 services ran by NCT with biogas deckers.
I suppose passengers would rather use the tram park and ride as they are closer to the M1

 

[gka472l]

Of the Southport schemes, the one that uses the Esplanade car park still seems to be fairly popular, but the park and ride site on the east edge of town failed; you can still see the abandoned interchange from the train approaching Meols Cop from the east.

There was another site just north of the town centre by the coast road, at the Fairway, which seems to have been out of use for quite a few years.... here it is on Google maps https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.6611696,-2.9974867,331m/data=!3m1!1e3?hl=en-GB

 

[Red Onion]

Ellon in Aberdeenshire has quite a good park and ride, whilst it’s not quite turn up and go, there are express buses twice an hour in the direction of Aberdeen along with stopping services. There’s also good connections north to Peterhead and Fraserburgh in addition to the various local routes. It’s just had an extension finished and is as well patronised as it can be just now, I expect it to get busier when we return to normal. A good example of how to do a rural park and ride.

The city ones in Aberdeen have fared worse. A lack of services and slow services make them unattractive and indeed, one “closed” last year or the year before, in that the site is there and open but no services run (except for occasional event traffic).

 

[Spaceflower]

Ellon in Aberdeenshire has quite a good park and ride, whilst it’s not quite turn up and go, there are express buses twice an hour in the direction of Aberdeen along with stopping services. There’s also good connections north to Peterhead and Fraserburgh in addition to the various local routes. It’s just had an extension finished and is as well patronised as it can be just now, I expect it to get busier when we return to normal. A good example of how to do a rural park and ride.

The city ones in Aberdeen have fared worse. A lack of services and slow services make them unattractive and indeed, one “closed” last year or the year before, in that the site is there and open but no services run (except for occasional event traffic).

So this is, in effect, a 'railhead' for Aberdeen (ignore the 'rail' bit, I know there's no rail involved)?

 

[DDB]

Nottingham used to have a dedicated fleet of electric buses for two park and ride sites, one near Clifton and the other near Colwick. Now they are merely stops on the 49 and 50 services ran by NCT with biogas deckers.
I suppose passengers would rather use the tram park and ride as they are closer to the M1

There are about 5 tram sites some of which are so popular that (pre pandemic) the council won a grant to expand as part of public transport improvements. They also have ambitions to convert the racecourse park and ride to tram. I think this is a case study in car drivers being more likely to transfer to trams than buses which I suspect affects the success of park and rides.

 

[Roger1973]

The evening situation can work if there's a parallel local bus that goes close enough and has ticket acceptance.

The Winnersh Triangle Park and Ride (outside Reading) has the main road Reading - Bracknell service a few minutes' walk from the site, and return tickets are valid on that as well.

Think one or two in Oxford have a similar deal.

 

[Bayum]

Surprised no one has mentioned York yet. Always surprises me quite how well used the sites are.

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Bad examples;
Leeds north - not sure why now but I got told it was bad. maybe because you're faced with the same problem that prompted you to use it in the first place i.e. congestion.

Is that the ‘King Lane’ service from Alwoodley that utilises the 7? It’s not listed as a ‘P&R’ site according to WyMetro but I’d have the same concerns. Though it has guided wheels and guided track partway along the route I’m not sure you actually gain any benefit from this.

 

[gka472l]

Chester's park and ride seems quite good on the occasions I've used it, although I've only used the Upton Road site to the north of the city. The other two sites are Wrexham Road to the south and Boughton Heath to the east. Operated by Stagecoach with a fleet of 12 dedicated E200MMC's (26050-26061) in a special livery.

HTH

 

[Western Sunset]

Salisbury has a good P&R too.

 

[sk688]

Bath P&R always used to be quite well patronised whenever I saw the buses , the sites are located in decent locations as well

 

[richw]

Plymouth is s good example of what was a very good scheme with very high quality Enviro double deckers which are probably among the most comfortable buses we have seen in Plymouth, which has been allowed to wither away to nothing more than a normal bus route which due to covid now isnt even that frequent. The buses now stop at all stops and now are just in plain beachball livery so cant really be distinguished from any other route. Shame really.

I made the error of parking at Coypool. Not even a clock face service to allow a 1 vehicle PVR!

 

[Spaceflower]

Surprised no one has mentioned York yet. Always surprises me quite how well used the sites are.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Dec 2021 ==


Is that the ‘King Lane’ service from Alwoodley that utilises the 7? It’s not listed as a ‘P&R’ site according to WyMetro but I’d have the same concerns. Though it has guided wheels and guided track partway along the route I’m not sure you actually gain any benefit from this.

Yes, that was the one. I guess it was a failed one then.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 28 Dec 2021 ==


Here, listed as a P&R on OS maps.

Google Maps

Find local businesses, view maps and get driving directions in Google Maps.

www.google.co.uk

 

[Red Onion]

So this is, in effect, a 'railhead' for Aberdeen (ignore the 'rail' bit, I know there's no rail involved)?

Exactly that. It works really well, I use it a fair bit.

 

[Spaceflower]

That's a new one on me

 

[cnjb8]

There are about 5 tram sites some of which are so popular that (pre pandemic) the council won a grant to expand as part of public transport improvements. They also have ambitions to convert the racecourse park and ride to tram. I think this is a case study in car drivers being more likely to transfer to trams than buses which I suspect affects the success of park and rides.

Interesting. Phoenix Park pre pandemic was extremely busy and really needed the extra space, but this probably isn’t going to happen anymore