• Our new ticketing site is now live! Using either this or the original site (both powered by TrainSplit) helps support the running of the forum with every ticket purchase! Find out more and ask any questions/give us feedback in this thread!

GA temporary diversions to fenchurch street

Status
Not open for further replies.

GEC465

Member
Joined
10 Mar 2016
Messages
415
With the current works going on at LST and future according to insiders some services will be diverted to fenchurch Street.

Is there any more info to this that others may know?
 
Sponsor Post - registered members do not see these adverts; click here to register, or click here to log in
R

RailUK Forums

JonathanH

Veteran Member
Joined
29 May 2011
Messages
23,382
With the current works going on at LST and future according to insiders some services will be diverted to fenchurch Street.

Is there any more info to this that others may know?
The capacity to transfer GA services over a single line into a four platform station seems somewhat limited when compared to the ability to run them into the lower numbered side of Liverpool Street. It seems a bit unlikely.

What are the proposed works at Liverpool Street? I note they didn't use Fenchurch Street when platforms 16-18 were rebuilt.
 

86246

Member
Joined
18 Sep 2013
Messages
340
In the past they have terminated at Stratford where there are a number of TfL connections. I’m not sure what benefits using Fenchurch Street for a limited number of services will bring.
 

TheEdge

Established Member
Joined
29 Nov 2012
Messages
4,498
Location
Norwich
This sounds very very unlikely. Quite who would drive it is a good question to start with.
 

357

Established Member
Joined
12 Nov 2018
Messages
2,284
Fenchurch Street simply doesn't have the capacity to cope with extra services, nor the onward connections that are provided by Stratford or Liverpool Street.

The flat junction at Gas Factory would also be a pinch point with conflicting moves.
 

dk1

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Oct 2009
Messages
19,876
Location
East Anglia
This is something that doesn’t happen. It would just be terminating everything at Stratford for onward connections. So many possibilities. Fenchurch Street is pretty useless really as is the NR infrastructure between Stratford & it.
 

BJames

Established Member
Joined
27 Jan 2018
Messages
1,464
The capacity to transfer GA services over a single line into a four platform station seems somewhat limited when compared to the ability to run them into the lower numbered side of Liverpool Street. It seems a bit unlikely.

What are the proposed works at Liverpool Street? I note they didn't use Fenchurch Street when platforms 16-18 were rebuilt.
I've just done a quick Google search and the only thing I could find is this https://www.constructionnews.co.uk/...bn-liverpool-street-redevelopment-13-12-2021/

Network Rail Infrastructure is in talks to overhaul and expand part of Liverpool Street station in London.

Plans are at an early stage, but the scheme to redevelop the south-eastern part of the station is estimated to cost around £1.55bn. Network Rail has opened discussions with Mersey Rail, a joint venture between Sellar Property Group, which developed the Shard, and MTR Corporation, a rail operator.

The JV owns the Andaz hotel, which sits at the south-eastern corner of the station. The station’s entrance cannot be expanded without affecting the hotel.

Network Rail said Liverpool Street is the UK’s third-busiest station and has “significant overcrowding problems, [which] are predicted to get worse as a result of forecast growth in passenger arrivals and interchanges”.

It said the Andaz was “uniquely located to deliver the significant degree of improvement in permeability and accessibility that is required at the station, by enabling the south entrance to be substantially widened”.


The proposed redevelopment would see construction of a new two-level station concourse, a new hotel and construction of a new office building. Network Rail owns the 50 Liverpool Street building, which would also be demolished as part of the project.

The northern entrance of the station has undergone significant change due to British Land’s redevelopment of adjoining office and retail buildings. Sir Robert McAlpine delivered the project.
Is this the proposed works the OP was referring to and does anyone have any more information?
 

306024

Established Member
Joined
23 Jan 2013
Messages
3,974
Location
East Anglia
https://www.ianvisits.co.uk/blog/20...tation-plans-for-a-1-5-billion-redevelopment/

Initial plans have been revealed for a £1.55 billion redevelopment of Liverpool Street station that would see it become a two-level station with a much larger entrance built next to the tube station.

The station is the third busiest in the UK and has significant overcrowding problems which are expected to worsen over future years. To deal with this, Network Rail is looking at fixing by adding a lot more floor space for people to wait in, while also improving access into the station.

In a normal year, around 70 million people use Liverpool Street Station, not far off what Heathrow Airport handles in a much larger space, and even after the pandemic induced changes to commuting, numbers are still expected to rise due to increasing amounts of housing developments along the Greater Anglia eastern route.



The plans being tentatively outlined involve a deal with The Shard and Paddington Square developer, Sellar Property Group, and will see the building next to the southern entrance to the mainline station, which is currently occupied by McDonald’s on the ground floor demolished to create the new double-width entrance to the railway station.

Inside the station, the proposals would see the construction of a new two-level station concourse with greatly increased circulation space, and while details are currently at a very early stage, it’s likely that such redevelopment would involve changing the entrance to the tube station as well.

Costs to complete the overall project are currently estimated on a very preliminary basis to be in the order of £1.55 billion. To help fund all this, the existing Andaz hotel on the corner of Liverpool Street station, which is currently owned by Network Rail would be sold to and redeveloped by a joint venture lead by the Sellar Property Group, along with a new office building and “associated ancillary facilities”.

The proposed redevelopment will also improve the presence and efficient permeability and accessibility of the main southern entrances by removing 50 Liverpool Street — the “McDonalds building” — and remodelling the South Eastern Entrance. Although 50 Liverpool Street looks like a good Victorian building, it’s actually a 1990s redevelopment to replace a similar-looking Victorian building that used to be on the site. Other than the reuse of the bricks and its appearance, the bulk of the building is barely 30 years old.
The current indicative date for an award of construction contracts is January 2023, so it’s possible that a planning application with the final details will be issued late next year.
Although not directly related to this project, Liverpool Street station also has another project to improve access, and that’s on the other side of the station where there’s a protected corridor under the offices to allow for an additional two tracks to be added to the railway in the future to reduce delays getting trains in and out of the station.

Says pretty much the same thing, probably from the same press release. £1.5bn is a lot of money for no obvious operational benefit, unless some of the detail is not announced yet. Stratford has more pressing issues than Liverpool St.

There was supposed to be money allocated for a clean of the station roof, which is possibly the only thing that could restrict platform usage on the West side. Any suggestion of diversions to Fenchurch St was possibly a throwaway comment from someone with little operational knowledge.

There is quite a bit of fresh air above the concourse which presumably someone thinks can earn them money in the long run, but turn the concourse into a dungeon in the process if not done sensitively.
 
Last edited:

dk1

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Oct 2009
Messages
19,876
Location
East Anglia
Sorting the main train shed glass out at Liverpool has been something desperately needed for decades. It leaves such a dingy feel & can even seem like nightfall on a stormy day at lunchtime. Wasn’t there also an issue with glass being substituted for the current Perspex stuff due to the constant IRA bomb threats at the time?
 

306024

Established Member
Joined
23 Jan 2013
Messages
3,974
Location
East Anglia
The Bishopsgate bomb was back in 1993, and doubtless a consideration for the materials used but I have no knowledge of what was decided when repairs commenced. We had been moved into Broadgate by then.
 

357

Established Member
Joined
12 Nov 2018
Messages
2,284
Even if it was possible no one signs it. That I know of anyway.
Should we tell the lads at the end of the platform that c2c drivers sign the route from Stratford to Fenchurch Street, and both companies will operate 720s soon, before watching how they make 2+2=5?
 

dk1

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Oct 2009
Messages
19,876
Location
East Anglia
Should we tell the lads at the end of the platform that c2c drivers sign the route from Stratford to Fenchurch Street, and both companies will operate 720s soon, before watching how they make 2+2=5?
Can you just imagine the chaos that would cause & that’s before we mention the lack of paths & what a waste of time it would be. Fenchurch St isn’t that well blessed with onward transport options either.
 

D6975

Established Member
Joined
26 Nov 2009
Messages
3,053
Location
Bristol
Can you just imagine the chaos that would cause & that’s before we mention the lack of paths & what a waste of time it would be. Fenchurch St isn’t that well blessed with onward transport options either.
Indeed. Whenever I'm in London, an arrival at Fenchurch St is usually followed by Shank's Pony to Cannon St or London Bridge.
 

swt_passenger

Veteran Member
Joined
7 Apr 2010
Messages
34,307
I get the impression the proposed property development may have little or no effect on platform availability?
 

357

Established Member
Joined
12 Nov 2018
Messages
2,284
Can you just imagine the chaos that would cause & that’s before we mention the lack of paths & what a waste of time it would be. Fenchurch St isn’t that well blessed with onward transport options either.
Indeed, everywhere you can get to from Fenchurch Street on LU can be achieved from Stratford with a cross platform change to the Central and then cross platform to Sub-Surface at Mile End. Much better than the interchange at Fenchurch Street to Tower Hill, especially if unfamiliar with what exit to use.
 

dk1

Veteran Member
Joined
2 Oct 2009
Messages
19,876
Location
East Anglia
Indeed. Whenever I'm in London, an arrival at Fenchurch St is usually followed by Shank's Pony to Cannon St or London Bridge.
If I’ve never thought of that option in 37 employable years it has to be no more than a wind up.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Indeed, everywhere you can get to from Fenchurch Street on LU can be achieved from Stratford with a cross platform change to the Central and then cross platform to Sub-Surface at Mile End. Much better than the interchange at Fenchurch Street to Tower Hill, especially if unfamiliar with what exit to use.
Thanks & far far easier haha.
 

D6975

Established Member
Joined
26 Nov 2009
Messages
3,053
Location
Bristol
If I’ve never thought of that option in 37 employable years it has to be no more than a wind up.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Au contraire - it's just one of many short walks in the London area I do that are much simpler than trying to use just rail/underground. Liverpool St - Cannon St is another.
 

NSE

Established Member
Joined
3 Mar 2010
Messages
1,919
Off topic, I find it easy to walk between any of Fenchurch St, Liverpool St, Cannon St and London Bridge. And Moorgate, but that’s one I rarely need.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Top