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Omicron variant and the measures implemented in response to it

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yorkie

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Sorry, but you said that infections have levelled off, that shows a recent sharp rise in both 'Daily New Cases' and 'Active Cases'.
Has the data for today been added since the post was made?

As for vaccines, it is sad to see people be turned against them by Government messaging.

In other news, the BBC have actually produced a good article; this is still a relatively rare event, so savour it while you can:

James Greenhalgh says he felt sick to his stomach when he heard the reports about a likely work-from-home order.
"We've had such a hard time in the pandemic and things were just starting to pick up again. The rules change every week, it seems. It's just so hard. I've genuinely thought about whether to throw in the towel."
The Labour party who called for this, and the Tories who caved in, do not care about people like James Greenhalgh.

I hope we see mass non-compliance with all measures introduced.
 
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DustyBin

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Again, we've been through is:

In England:

Age 40-49: 2000 Covid deaths
Age 30-39: 700 Covid deaths
Age 20-29: 230 Covid deaths

By contrast total deaths due to AZ side effects (in all age groups) may be just about in double figures.

Nevertheless, due to the high relative risk of side effects in younger ages, under 40s have been offered alternative to the AZ vaccine since May: Under 40s to be offered alternative to AZ vaccine - BBC News

The bar for a covid death and a vaccine death is set rather differently though. That’s not to say the vaccines are killing people left right and centre, I don’t believe they are, but to be classed as a vaccine death there must be no doubt whatsoever that vaccination was THE cause. Covid deaths meanwhile……
 

quantinghome

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The bar for a covid death and a vaccine death is set rather differently though. That’s not to say the vaccines are killing people left right and centre, I don’t believe they are, but to be classed as a vaccine death there must be no doubt whatsoever that vaccination was THE cause. Covid deaths meanwhile……
Covid deaths are recorded by multiple methods which largely agree with each other. The dashboard numbers may conceivably be out by 10-20% but not an order of magnitude.

Particularly in younger age groups it's highly unlikely that deaths attributed to covid are actually due to another cause.
 

21C101

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Again, we've been through is:

In England:

Age 40-49: 2000 Covid deaths
Age 30-39: 700 Covid deaths
Age 20-29: 230 Covid deaths

By contrast total deaths due to AZ side effects (in all age groups) may be just about in double figures.

Nevertheless, due to the high relative risk of side effects in younger ages, under 40s have been offered alternative to the AZ vaccine since May: Under 40s to be offered alternative to AZ vaccine - BBC News
I think you need to rethink that. From the Torygraph article:

"Up to November 17, the MHRA had received Yellow Card reports of 426 cases of major thromboembolic events. The overall case fatality rate was 17 per cent with 73 deaths."

The report states that other adverse reactions have caused at least nine additional fatalities and 86 further injuries many of which involve life changing disablement.

Those are just the deaths that were not put down to something else. Given that the covid deaths include anyone dying within 28 days of a positive test of whatever cause and that people with the vaccine have still died of Covid anyway, it dosen't look a good bet to me for anyone under 40 in good health and dubious for anyone under 50 in good health.
 

nw1

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Johnson needs to resign immediately. The man is an utter hypocrite. Him, and the government in general, have no credibility whatsoever, and just lie, lie and lie again. Javid is no better.

But the real question is, we are going to get one of these mutations every few months. Can we afford to react like this every single time? People need to be putting these questions to politicians. I don't understand why they aren't being challenged. If we carry on reacting like this every time there's a new mutation, there is going to be a confidence crisis in large sections of the economy. OK it's not full lockdown yet, but knowing people like Johnson and Javid and their constant U-turns, it wouldn't surprise me if they try to bring that in by January.

I know that this is a somewhat controversial opinion, but we need to grasp the nettle and live with Covid. We should protect the vulnerable, not try to lock everyone down. Do the politicians not realise that this might, perhaps, cause less total suffering than living under the constant fear of lockdowns? An environment where pubs and restaurants perhaps only open 8 months of the year, and overseas travel is only allowed 6 months of the year? An environment where even meeting your friends is criminalised for 3 months of the year? Do they not realise the effect on the economy (and therefore jobs and livelihoods) and people's mental health that this may have?

These questions need to be urgently asked of politicians, otherwise this may happen every year. We've had two years. Like most, I guess, I was prepared to put up with the first lockdown for a few months, but two years on, the approach has to change otherwise we're going to be stuck with this for many years and for many people, winter is going to become a living hell.
 

Ediswan

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You need to look at the daily updates, not the graph. The graph is too small a scale. Additionally I said leveling off, not decreasing. There is certainly not the level of increase there was last week.
Found those now. Only six days showing, so tricky to draw any reliable conclusions, 'last week' is gone. In Over the last three two days there has been a threefold increase in new cases (6th: 6,381, 8th: 19,842).
 
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dave87016

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Boris said there are exceptions where it’s not practical to wear a mask such as eating , drinking , singing . Does this mean you don’t have to wear a mask in a pub or restaurant or does it mean you have to except when your sat down ?
 

Peterthegreat

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Found those now. Only six days showing, so tricky to draw any reliable conclusions, 'last week' is gone. In the last three days there has been threefold increase in new cases (6th: 6,381, 8th: 19,842).
But the 6th is actually Sunday's figures. Figures are always lower for Sundays,
 

Bikeman78

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Boris said there are exceptions where it’s not practical to wear a mask such as eating , drinking , singing . Does this mean you don’t have to wear a mask in a pub or restaurant or does it mean you have to except when your sat down ?
Not a problem. Make sure you sing when you arrive and when you go to the bar or the toilet. :)
 

nw1

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Not only that, but this has to be the first time where the primary purpose of measures being put in place is to save Johnson's own political skin, not for supposed public good.

Except I suspect it will have the opposite effect. If this is indeed the reason, it makes Johnson truly the lowest of the low.

People are going to be very, very angry at the constant 'do as I say, don't do as I do' attitude of the Government. I suspect there will be many calls for Johnson's resignation.
 

43066

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Good point. Restrictions, even minor ones, are an acknowledgement that the spread needs to be controlled. Therefore, if they fail (which they will), it guarantees further restrictions; they can’t just say “oh well, we’ll leave it there” because it would be to acknowledge that the preceding restrictions were pointless.

I hate to sound pessimistic (really I do!) but I fear where this is heading. A week ago lockdown was out of the question; seemingly that is no longer the case. Once "Plan B" has proven to be a waste of time (which it will) then what?

This is the worry.

I suppose the hope is that we won’t see a corresponding uptick in hospitalisations following the growth in cases of omicron due to the high levels of vaccine coverage/existing immunity (which as always is being ignored by the predictions of exponential growth).

We are at least coming to restrictions at a later point than last year, with correspondingly less time to move through ever stricter stages until the spring, so theoretically shouldn’t reach such a low base point as last year.

But it would be astonishing if these restrictions aren’t the new base line until Feb/March.
 

duncanp

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depends if there is anymore 10 Downing Street Xmas party skeletons left in the cupboard that will need neutralising.

I really don't think he would dare.

Does he really think the public are going to stand for him announcing on something like 22nd or 23rd December that, for example, mixing between households is banned, or that vaccine passports will be extended to pubs, or even churches.

He has said that the rules will be reviewed three weeks after implementation, which takes us to 7th January, and if he imposes any more restrictions before then he will have lost what little credibility he still has left.

If there are any more skeletons in the cupboard, it won't be Christmas that will be cancelled, it will be Boris himself.
 

nw1

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Has the data for today been added since the post was made?

As for vaccines, it is sad to see people be turned against them by Government messaging.

In other news, the BBC have actually produced a good article; this is still a relatively rare event, so savour it while you can:


The Labour party who called for this, and the Tories who caved in, do not care about people like James Greenhalgh.
Exactly. The politicians just don't give a damn on the effect these constant harsh measures and the effect it's having on people's livelihoods. I've said this already, but they need to consider sum total of suffering. It's not just the people with serious Covid that are suffering. Others are suffering in other ways.

Time they understood that.
 
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DustyBin

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Covid deaths are recorded by multiple methods which largely agree with each other. The dashboard numbers may conceivably be out by 10-20% but not an order of magnitude.

Particularly in younger age groups it's highly unlikely that deaths attributed to covid are actually due to another cause.

So why the “within 28 days of a positive test” metric? It appears to me that if a death can be attributed to covid in any possible way, no matter how small a part it played, it’s classed as a covid death. I suspect this is why the terms “of”, “from” and “with” are used interchangeably despite the latter carrying a very different meaning.
 

yorksrob

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Boris said there are exceptions where it’s not practical to wear a mask such as eating , drinking , singing . Does this mean you don’t have to wear a mask in a pub or restaurant or does it mean you have to except when your sat down ?

That's what I was wondering, but the BBC only seemed interested in reporting on theatres and cinemas !
 

43066

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That's what I was wondering, but the BBC only seemed interested in reporting on theatres and cinemas !
Boris said there are exceptions where it’s not practical to wear a mask such as eating , drinking , singing . Does this mean you don’t have to wear a mask in a pub or restaurant or does it mean you have to except when your sat down ?

From the Graun summary I gather hospitality will be excluded from masking, so at least that’s something (at least for those who still bother to wear them!).
 

yorksrob

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From the Graun summary I gather hospitality will be excluded from masking, so at least that’s something (at least for those who still bother to wear them!).

That's something to be hopeful for.
 

initiation

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Boris said there are exceptions where it’s not practical to wear a mask such as eating , drinking , singing . Does this mean you don’t have to wear a mask in a pub or restaurant or does it mean you have to except when your sat down ?
I've seen quite a few reports that hospitality is not included in the requirement. Of course we will have to see what the actual ministerial decree says.
 

ABB125

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I've seen quite a few reports that hospitality is not included in the requirement. Of course we will have to see what the actual ministerial decree says.
So once again the virus is intelligent enough to know that it's not allowed to spread in nightclubs/pubs/restaurants... :D

(For the avoidance of doubt, it would be fair to say that I'm not best pleased by the new restrictions, and my compliance with them shall be somewhat variable depending on how much of an inconvenience it would be were I to be kicked out of a venue/business due to said non-compliance.)
 

Yew

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Has anyone else noticed that the infections in South Africa have levelled off?
Indeed, I'm interested to see what happens in the data now. Though it seems that our glorious leader has decided to buy himself another few weeks; at our expense.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

Covid deaths are recorded by multiple methods which largely agree with each other. The dashboard numbers may conceivably be out by 10-20% but not an order of magnitude.

Particularly in younger age groups it's highly unlikely that deaths attributed to covid are actually due to another cause.
The "within 28 days" metric has not been updated post vaccination though.
 

NorthKent1989

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I’m sure the pro restrictions crowd and bedwetters are now positively gleeful at passports!

I have zero patience for such fools and have no sympathy for them.
 

philosopher

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Exactly. The politicians just don't give a damn on the effect these constant harsh measures and the effect it's having on people's livelihoods. I've said this already, but they need to consider sum total of suffering. It's not just the people with serious Covid that are suffering. Others are suffering in other ways.

Time they understood that.
There is no furlough this time, so if the WFH edict goes on for more than a few weeks, I imagine those business that rely on office workers will start making redundancies.
 

Busaholic

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Metaphorically, and unfortunately, it seems so. (A literal hill may be hard, I live in Cambridgeshire).

And more masks, just for a change.

And he's now trying to blame the unvaccinated and hinting at mandatory vaccinations.

So, the phony war is over, and now the real unpleasantness begins.
TBH, I was surprised how little has changed on the mask front for most people e.g in restaurants and pubs, which I'm glad about. Fed up with seeing people with masks round their chins etc etc. For God's sake, if you're going to wear one, at least wear it properly. Speaking as a non mask warrior on either side, thoroughly bored with the subject.
 

duncanp

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I've seen quite a few reports that hospitality is not included in the requirement. Of course we will have to see what the actual ministerial decree says.

The Daily Mail is also reporting that masks will not be required in pubs, restaurants and gyms.(which presumably includes swimming pools).

So that is one small thing to be thankful for. (not much, I know)
 
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