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TFL Fare Finder - Earls Court

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davews

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I looked up the fare for Richmond to Wimbledon, district line via Earls Court. I expected as I had done this route before that it would be the £1.70 two zone rate, but the fare finder shows £2.70 (contactless, off peak). Earls Cout is a zone 1/2 station but I understood that it gives you the lower of the two possible fares - in this case though it seems to assume you have entered zone 1.

Is this a bug in the fare finder or have they changed the rules?
 
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Snow1964

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I looked it up on TfL fares finder and get

£3.30 peak (Mon-Fri 06:30-09:30 & 16:00-19:00)
£2.70 off peak

Which seems wrong at Richmond (zone 4) - Earls Court (zone 1 or 2) is £2.50 peak and £1.70 off peak and uses same zones

So fare should be 3 zones not 2


I wonder if the existence of direct trains confuses it (via Kingston loop), so routing with a train change isn’t found
 
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Dstock7080

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I looked up the fare for Richmond to Wimbledon, district line via Earls Court. I expected as I had done this route before that it would be the £1.70 two zone rate, but the fare finder shows £2.70 (contactless, off peak).
Wimbledon-Richmond via Earl’s Court is three zones 3, 2, 3, 4.
 

davews

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Yes, I think you are right. Last time I did it they did of course have their 'anywhere outside zone 1 off peak for £1.50' offer going.

Anyway, somewhat academic as a day return Martins Heron to Wimbledon is £12.10 as against £10.45 to Richmond (railcard). Even with a £1.70 fare that is cheaper. Walking Wimbledon to Richmond so can join the return journey there. As for the Kingston loop, even SWR suggest via Clapham Junction is the quickest way.
 

MikeWh

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Richmond to Wimbledon is an example of a journey which tests the rules of the PAYG system to the limit. There are numerous routes involving different modes with different frequencies and numbers of changes. I think it's possible that via Earls Court might have been originally shown as the default route because if there is a way of making a journey using only TfL services then TfL tends to favour it. However, that route falls down badly on journey time and the frequencies on the two legs aren't that spectacular either. The vast majority of people will travel via Clapham Junction using SWR and I'm sure that they (or SWT before them) would object to losing out on revenue with the erroneous assumption that the District line is used.

If you use my fare finder, which uses exactly the same fare data as the TfL finder, you'll find I add information on what zones are covered by each route. This can help to identify what the routes are.

The default route covers zones 2-4 and the fares are consistent with the National Rail scale for 3 zones outside zone 1. Thus it's assuming Richmond to Clapham Junction then Wimbledon. As it's the default route it is also used for any journey not described as an alternative route, even if that route should have different fares. Via Earls Court is an example where the fare should be lower while via Kingston on the direct train should be more expensive (4 zones 3-6). However, there's no way to tell that either of those routes have been used so the default fare is charged.

The alternative routes which are defined are: via Putney/East Putney which is a National Rail through fare using only zones 3-4 and thus slightly cheaper than the default; and a couple of options utilising Underground in zone 1 which both incur the surcharge for mixing National Rail and Underground on a journey including zone 1.
 

hkstudent

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Richmond to Wimbledon is an example of a journey which tests the rules of the PAYG system to the limit. There are numerous routes involving different modes with different frequencies and numbers of changes. I think it's possible that via Earls Court might have been originally shown as the default route because if there is a way of making a journey using only TfL services then TfL tends to favour it. However, that route falls down badly on journey time and the frequencies on the two legs aren't that spectacular either. The vast majority of people will travel via Clapham Junction using SWR and I'm sure that they (or SWT before them) would object to losing out on revenue with the erroneous assumption that the District line is used.

If you use my fare finder, which uses exactly the same fare data as the TfL finder, you'll find I add information on what zones are covered by each route. This can help to identify what the routes are.

The default route covers zones 2-4 and the fares are consistent with the National Rail scale for 3 zones outside zone 1. Thus it's assuming Richmond to Clapham Junction then Wimbledon. As it's the default route it is also used for any journey not described as an alternative route, even if that route should have different fares. Via Earls Court is an example where the fare should be lower while via Kingston on the direct train should be more expensive (4 zones 3-6). However, there's no way to tell that either of those routes have been used so the default fare is charged.

The alternative routes which are defined are: via Putney/East Putney which is a National Rail through fare using only zones 3-4 and thus slightly cheaper than the default; and a couple of options utilising Underground in zone 1 which both incur the surcharge for mixing National Rail and Underground on a journey including zone 1.
With this, I am thinking whether the overwhelming advertisement of £1.65 off-peak travel on TfL services would be an over-shot as there are bugs that a minority of TfL non-zone 1 journey are charged more than that.
Which this may risk the organisation into the accusation of false advertisement?
 

MikeWh

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Can you link to the advert you refer? The previous flat fare of £1.50 has been replaced by £1.50/£1.60/£1.70 depending on whether 1/2/3+ zones are needed.
 

londonboi

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I looked it up on TfL fares finder and get

£3.30 peak (Mon-Fri 06:30-09:30 & 16:00-19:00)
£2.70 off peak

Which seems wrong at Richmond (zone 4) - Earls Court (zone 1 or 2) is £2.50 peak and £1.70 off peak and uses same zones

So fare should be 3 zones not 2


I wonder if the existence of direct trains confuses it (via Kingston loop), so routing with a train change isn’t found
Which would mean you pay for zone 2,3,4 if Richmond is zone 4. Not just zones 2,3 so
 

hkstudent

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Can you link to the advert you refer? The previous flat fare of £1.50 has been replaced by £1.50/£1.60/£1.70 depending on whether 1/2/3+ zones are needed.
My bad.
The figure I refer to should be £1.70.
The adverts were made in a lot on LU platforms before September, mentioning you will not pay more than £1.70 for travelling off peak in zones 2-6.
 

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MikeWh

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Thanks for that, I've given TfL a heads up.
 
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