Oxford -Birmingham Post Covid Plans?

[Kingham West]

I understand Cross Country are to keep this service hourly from December 1ph to Newcastle 1ph to Man Pic.
Am I right in thinking Chiltern will operate Oxford -Birmingham , in the spare path calling at various stops north of Leamington Spa, or did I dream it , I have not seen any public material for consultation .

 

[221129]

I understand Cross Country are to keep this service hourly from December 1ph to Newcastle 1ph to Man Pic.

So is it hourly or 2 trains per hour?

 

[Jurg]

I understand Cross Country are to keep this service hourly from December 1ph to Newcastle 1ph to Man Pic.
Am I right in thinking Chiltern will operate Oxford -Birmingham , in the spare path calling at various stops north of Leamington Spa, or did I dream it , I have not seen any public material for consultation .

It has long been 1 Newcastle per hour and 1 Manchester per hour, pre-covid. It's not clear whether you're suggesting this will change or not.

 

[Kingham West]

Sorry , it does not read well, I applolgise.
1 train every 2 hours Bournmouth/Manchester
1 train every 2 hours
Reading /Newcastle
50% cut on pre covid
Oxf / Birmingham goes hourly ( as now in emergency timetable ) for x country .

 

[dk1]

But isn’t the service hourly to Manchester now? How does the Newcastle on alternate hours fit in with the clock face timetable North of New St? I don’t understand why XC would want to cut the service back where other operators are going back to normal. This is a very well used route.

 

[30907]

Sorry , it does not read well, I applolgise.
1 train every 2 hours Bournmouth/Manchester
1 train every 2 hours
Reading /Newcastle
50% cut on pre covid
Oxf / Birmingham goes hourly ( as now in emergency timetable ) for x country .

I think this is highly unlikely, as the paths at New St don't match up (particularly southbound), and rewriting the timetable isn't a realistic proposition. It will remain much as now AFAIK.

However, there is a small number of Newcastle via Doncaster services at present, one of which runs through from/to Banbury; I wonder if XC are planning some alterations to these?

 

[dk1]

Why doesn’t XC just revert to a normal pre-Covid timetable? Surely their staffing/training can’t be set back that far after all this time.

 

[221129]

Why doesn’t XC just revert to a normal pre-Covid timetable? Surely their staffing/training can’t be set back that far after all this time.

Because they need the sets to double them up...

 

[dk1]

Because they need the sets to double them up...

But why? I don’t understand the doubling up thing?

 

[Watershed]

Why doesn’t XC just revert to a normal pre-Covid timetable? Surely their staffing/training can’t be set back that far after all this time.

They have on the former CT side and it's only because of the 'slack' on the former IC side that they could get away with it. But Birmingham aside yes, they must have a lot of spare traincrew at some of the depots. I'm thinking in particular of Reading, Bomo, Bristol and Leeds depots.

They've certainly been able to operate a more reliable service than most other TOCs and haven't had to keep on switching timetables. However the hourly frequency on each of the Birmingham axes, as well as the lost connectivity (SW-NW and S-NE) is not really going to attract passengers back.

Sadly I fear it it's going to remain this way until they have the Avanti Super Voyagers. The doubling in capacity per service is seen as 'too good' of a thing to undo now.

 

[The Planner]

Stays as it is now with the hourly Manchester, might be some extra SW NE services but not many from what Ive heard. Doubt you will see the Reading Newcastle back until May 22.

 

[221129]

But why? I don’t understand the doubling up thing?

Train loadings. It works at the moment due to next to no commuter traffic, so why change it for the time being.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 25 Aug 2021 ==

ot really going to attract passengers back.

Given the constant reports of full and standing trains (even as doubles) I don't think that is too much of an issue at the moment.

 

[Watershed]

Given the constant reports of full and standing trains (even as doubles) I don't think that is too much of an issue at the moment.

Operation Princess was done for a reason...

 

[221129]

Operation Princess was done for a reason...

And times have changed. Operation Princess, that famous railway success story...

 

[dk1]

Train loadings. It works at the moment due to next to no commuter traffic, so why change it for the time being.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 25 Aug 2021 ==


Given the constant reports of full and standing trains (even as doubles) I don't think that is too much of an issue at the moment.

Because this is from December & much is already over now or will be next month regrading the pandemic at many TOCs let alone then. Much of XCs isn’t commuting it’s leisure. I just don’t get their stance on things. Even at the height of it all this franchise appeared totally anti-passenger with compulsory reservations. The Birmingham-Cambridge route which is basically inter-urban with much local traffic insisted upon this farce & then provided double units with ridiculously low loadings.

 

[Kingham West]

And times have changed. Operation Princess, that famous railway success story...

It proved regular services every 30 mins , drive traffic upwards

 

[Bletchleyite]

And times have changed. Operation Princess, that famous railway success story...

It was too successful for its own good. It'd have been fine if the Voyagers had all been 7 or 8-car. Improving a service while reducing the capacity it provided (1 x HST > 2 x 4-car 220) was never going to work.

 

[221129]

It was too successful for its own good. It'd have been fine if the Voyagers had all been 7 or 8-car. Improving a service while reducing the capacity it provided (1 x HST > 2 x 4-car 220) was never going to work.

So why are people on here in such a rush to do it again? The current situation is working well, and is temporary while things recover and by the time the uplift in capacity is needed, by then there should be additional stock in place. I'll trust the ones with the data on this one.

 

[dk1]

So why are people on here in such a rush to do it again? The current situation is working well, and is temporary while things recover and by the time the uplift in capacity is needed, by then there should be additional stock in place. I'll trust the ones with the data on this one.

But it’s not a rush to do it again. Operation Princess was dead & buried years ago. This is just getting back to normal something XC seem very averse to do.

 

[quantinghome]

So why are people on here in such a rush to do it again? The current situation is working well, and is temporary while things recover and by the time the uplift in capacity is needed, by then there should be additional stock in place. I'll trust the ones with the data on this one.

Operation Princess stopped in 2003, the network was trimmed back and XC has been operating basically the same timetable since 2007. Why wouldn't XC simply revert back to what it was doing two years ago?

 

[221129]

This is just getting back to normal something XC seem very averse to do.

Why do back to something that wasn't working from something that largely is?

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 25 Aug 2021 ==

Why wouldn't XC simply revert back to what it was doing two years ago?

Because things aren't the same as 2 years ago.

 

[dk1]

Why do back to something that wasn't working from something that largely is?

Because it was working well & offering through journey opportunities & frequency on its core routes. It’s failing that at the moment & don’t get me started on omitting calls at the likes of Winchester, Audley End & Chesterfield. What on earth is that all about apart from alienating your customers?

 

[221129]

It’s failing that at the moment

The numbers and the data says differently.

 

[dk1]

The numbers and the data says differently.

Growth is returning on all fronts.

 

[quantinghome]

Because things aren't the same as 2 years ago.

For how long? All the signs are that passengers are returning to the railway. I suspect we'll be back to pre-covid levels within a year.

Anyway it's not like we should have to choose between train length and frequency. We need half hourly XC on all arms of the core and 8-car trains. This is possible once the 22Xs get released from other franchises.

 

[221129]

We need half hourly XC on all arms of the core and 8-car trains. This is possible once the 22Xs get released from other franchises.

At the moment, the decision is to stick with longer trains and less frequent, as additional sets become available frequency will be increased again.

 

[ashkeba]

Because it was working well & offering through journey opportunities & frequency on its core routes. It’s failing that at the moment & don’t get me started on omitting calls at the likes of Winchester, Audley End & Chesterfield. What on earth is that all about apart from alienating your customers?

I think XC alienated far more customers running 2 car turbostars full and standing to stansted Airport.

 

[quantinghome]

At the moment, the decision is to stick with longer trains and less frequent, as additional sets become available frequency will be increased again.

We've yet to see a source for this claim by the OP.

 

[NSEFAN]

At the moment, the decision is to stick with longer trains and less frequent, as additional sets become available frequency will be increased again.

I'm currently on a pair of XC voyagers. I must say that doubled up sets is very welcome. It hasn't been this pleasant using XC for a long time! If what you say is true then I look forward to a future of frequent services with the actual capacity to carry the number of passengers wanting to use it.

 

[221129]

We've yet to see a source for this claim by the OP.

I'm obviously not going to risk my job and publish internal documents.