No advance 1st fares on WCML this summer?

[itfcfan]

I'd like to travel from London to a point near Chester (but also not too far from Runcorn / Warrington) in early September. I haven't travelled by train much since the start of the pandemic so I'm adapting to the Avanti rules that state seat reservations are mandatory. I'd like to travel in 1st class, but for every date I'm checking over the next 4 weeks the "cheapest" fares I'm seeing across WCML destinations are the non-advance "off-peak return" for ~£295. Are there any advance quotas available at the moment or are they all absent?

I appreciate there are alternatives such as the slower West Midlands / LNR stoppers to Crewe, etc. I'll look at that as a back-up but I'm specifically interested in the WCML fast / Avanti services for now.

Thanks in advance for any help.

 

[ValleyLines142]

Noticed this myself. Few years back I got an Advance from Crewe to Edinburgh for £9 with a railcard.

Going to Edinburgh on the weekend and it's cheaper to fly! Flying from Birmingham.

 

[alistairlees]

I'd like to travel from London to a point near Chester (but also not too far from Runcorn / Warrington) in early September. I haven't travelled by train much since the start of the pandemic so I'm adapting to the Avanti rules that state seat reservations are mandatory. I'd like to travel in 1st class, but for every date I'm checking over the next 4 weeks the "cheapest" fares I'm seeing across WCML destinations are the non-advance "off-peak return" for ~£295. Are there any advance quotas available at the moment or are they all absent?

I appreciate there are alternatives such as the slower West Midlands / LNR stoppers to Crewe, etc. I'll look at that as a back-up but I'm specifically interested in the WCML fast / Avanti services for now.

Thanks in advance for any help.

Well, I can see (for example) a £96.40 1st Class Advance fare to Runcorn (from Euston) on the 11.07 on 8th September. There's a £102.60 fare on the 08.07 and 09.07 on the same day. I haven't looked at coming back, and it's not especially cheap, but they are there.

 

[Starmill]

I can certainly see available First Class Advance tickets, but they're in general rather expensive, and two of them doesn't save very much over the First Class Off Peak Return. London to Liverpool First Off Peak Return is £265.80 and can be used to travel to and from Chester. There aren't very many seats in First Class any more on any of Avanti West Coast's trains, so £265 round trip, or £100 - 130 each way, is a realistic price if you want to travel in First.

 

[Deafdoggie]

It's because Avanti have "Standard Premium" now. Basically a first class seat but no food or drink, they're aiming this at people who used to buy advance first class. First Class, as a result, now doesn't have the cheap advance fares it once had.

 

[itfcfan]

It's because Avanti have "Standard Premium" now. Basically a first class seat but no food or drink, they're aiming this at people who used to buy advance first class. First Class, as a result, now doesn't have the cheap advance fares it once had.

Very interesting! I see that for now it isn't possible to book these in advance (should be available "from September") so you need to upgrade at the time of travel by moving to the standard premium coach(es). I'm struggling to understand how that works with the current mandatory reservations. Does it mean that even the busiest trains will always have the equivalent of a coach or two of seats empty (anyone moving to standard premium will be leaving their booked seat empty)?

 

[Starmill]

The "mandatory reservations" are in practice no such thing. I haven't reserved a seat on their services when I've used them this year, you don't actually have to despite the timetable stating so.

Although they'd rather you didn't, you can just turn up at a station, buy a ticket from a ticket machine (that won't be able to reserve you a seat), get on the train and sit down.

 

[Hadders]

I'm adapting to the Avanti rules that state seat reservations are mandatory.

Just to clarify, seat reservations are not mandatory when travelling with Avanti.

 

[itfcfan]

Just to clarify, seat reservations are not mandatory when travelling with Avanti.

Thanks for the clarifications. I was just going off what I see when trying to book on avantiwestcoast.co.uk as I've not travelled much recently. I haven't tried all possible journey combinations, but I'm seeing a the message "Seat reservations are mandatory for this journey. Please reserve a seat" when trying to book.

 

[Starmill]

Thanks for the clarifications. I was just going off what I see when trying to book on avantiwestcoast.co.uk as I've not travelled much recently. I haven't tried all possible journey combinations, but I'm seeing a the message "Seat reservations are mandatory for this journey. Please reserve a seat" when trying to book.
View attachment 101282

It's now endemic in the railway industry for the timetable to say that, and in practice it not be true. For example even on stopping trains between Guildford and Redhill you're usually told that.

 

[Watershed]

Thanks for the clarifications. I was just going off what I see when trying to book on avantiwestcoast.co.uk as I've not travelled much recently. I haven't tried all possible journey combinations, but I'm seeing a the message "Seat reservations are mandatory for this journey. Please reserve a seat" when trying to book.
View attachment 101282

That message is being shown because the timetable data forces booking engines to issue reservations. Reservations are not actually compulsory.