Caledonian Sleeper

[Tormod]

As the weekend service move from Euston, over to the ECML, why does it take so long? It does not look a great distance.

 

[221129]

As the weekend service move from Euston, over to the ECML, why does it take so long? It does not look a great distance.

The reversal and associated shunting shenanigans I would think...

 

[popeter45]

As the weekend service move from Euston, over to the ECML, why does it take so long? It does not look a great distance.

they first drive up to the nearest yard they can use and thats wemberly, then it can take up to 30 minutes to switch the loco's end and finally the lines that connect the WCML via the NLL to the ECML have some slow speed limits (e.g. 25mph on the NLL-ECML junction)

also thinking about it is the ECML-GOBLIN connection electrified?, could that potentally work as a faster connection instead of the NLL-ECML connection?

 

[Mike99]

As the weekend service move from Euston, over to the ECML, why does it take so long? It does not look a great distance.

The Inverness/Fort William on Friday night took 80mins from Euston to fully join the ECML at Finsbury Park for reasons quoted up post, Its just a very slow start. I notice Fridays service also lost 60mins or so around Berwick upon Tweed. Passengers arrived in Inverness at 09:50, 13hrs 12mins from Euston, and Fort William at 10:35, 3 minutes short of 14 hours after departure at 20:38 form Euston

 

[92002]

The Inverness/Fort William on Friday night took 80mins from Euston to fully join the ECML at Finsbury Park for reasons quoted up post, Its just a very slow start. I notice Fridays service also lost 60mins or so around Berwick upon Tweed. Passengers arrived in Inverness at 09:50, 13hrs 12mins from Euston, and Fort William at 10:35, 3 minutes short of 14 hours after departure at 20:38 form Euston

The 60 minutes list around Berwick was a signal failure. Which lasted most of the Day. So not really part of the plan. No goubt delay repay will apply.

 

[Tormod]

Thanks, what I assumed, but it still seems a long time for not a lot, to the uninitiated

 

[TimboM]

Thanks, what I assumed, but it still seems a long time for not a lot, to the uninitiated

Good job it's a sleeper service then...! And on a Bank Holiday weekend when folk are most likely travelling for leisure not work or to get from A to B as fast as possible (if so, they're on the wrong mode of transport).

they first drive up to the nearest yard they can use and thats wemberly, then it can take up to 30 minutes to switch the loco's end and finally the lines that connect the WCML via the NLL to the ECML have some slow speed limits (e.g. 25mph on the NLL-ECML junction)

also thinking about it is the ECML-GOBLIN connection electrified?, could that potentally work as a faster connection instead of the NLL-ECML connection?

Loco's don't switch ends - the trains work into Euston double-headed as normal and the one on the south end stays attached on what is the rear from Euston to Wembley. The north-end "draw-back" loco then drops off at Wembley Yard and the one on the South end takes the train forward out of Wembley Yard and round to the ECML.

It still takes a fair amount of time to run into the yard at slow speed, detach the north-end loco, hook up the ETS from the south-end, brake test, configure the train (stock) so it knows it's going the other way etc etc.

1S25 managed it in 21 mins tonight (vs the scheduled 29 mins).

Tonight 1S25 has gone via Primrose Hill as usual (it's the quickest way round to the ECML) however due to possessions 1S26 is pathed to go via Gospel Oak / NLL (so yes, it is electrified that way).

 

[JonathanH]

Tonight 1S25 has gone via Primrose Hill as usual (it's the quickest way round to the ECML) however due to possessions 1S26 is pathed to go via Gospel Oak / NLL (so yes, it is electrified that way).

The question was about the curve at Harringay (eg Harringay Park Junction - Harringay Junction) which I don't think is electrified and isn't used by the sleeper (not least because there isn't a convenient junction in the other direction). If the sleeper goes via the City Lines at Willesden Junction and then Gospel Oak it still uses the Copenhagen Junction connection at Camden Road.

 

[Parallel]

I used the sleeper service this week, the train had 2 portions, one for Aberdeen and one for Inverness. Passengers for Fort William had to change at Edinburgh.

 

[alistairlees]

I used the sleeper service this week, the train had 2 portions, one for Aberdeen and one for Inverness. Passengers for Fort William had to change at Edinburgh.

I assume you were in the seats and it was Thursday 29th April or later? The highlander started running again as three portions - Inverness, Aberdeen and Fort William - from that date. Guests who are going in the seats from London to Fort William travel in the Aberdeen seats to Edinburgh, where they transfer to a new seated coach for the last leg from Edinburgh to Fort William.

 

[Parallel]

I assume you were in the seats and it was Thursday 29th April or later? The highlander started running again as three portions - Inverness, Aberdeen and Fort William - from that date. Guests who are going in the seats from London to Fort William travel in the Aberdeen seats to Edinburgh, where they transfer to a new seated coach for the last leg from Edinburgh to Fort William.

Ah yes, of course! You are correct - It was my first time in quite a while on the Caledonian Sleeper. The train was very rough riding, can’t say I’m in a hurry to do it again! Will have to try a berth next time.

 

[zero]

Will the lounge car be open from 17 May?

How big are the windows in the Mk5 berths? As I recall the Mk3 windows were quite small and there wasn't any comfortable place to position yourself to look outside.

For me the main reason to take the sleeper on an upcoming trip to Scotland would be to watch the route during the reversal via Wembley and onto the ECML, during the few months/weeks when it's still possible to see outside at 2130.

But if the lounge car is not open then I don't think I will get a good view, might as well just take a day train and try again next summer (this August may be too late, need to check diversion dates and sunset times).

 

[paul1609]

Ive been on the ECML diversions a few times. Tbh its pretty un remarkable in the context of a journey to the highlands. The ride seems worse on the ECML.

 

[alistairlees]

Will the lounge car be open from 17 May?

How big are the windows in the Mk5 berths? As I recall the Mk3 windows were quite small and there wasn't any comfortable place to position yourself to look outside.

For me the main reason to take the sleeper on an upcoming trip to Scotland would be to watch the route during the reversal via Wembley and onto the ECML, during the few months/weeks when it's still possible to see outside at 2130.

But if the lounge car is not open then I don't think I will get a good view, might as well just take a day train and try again next summer (this August may be too late, need to check diversion dates and sunset times).

The lounge car is not expected to be open from 17 May

 

[221129]

Will have to try a berth next time.

I doubt it will be much better unfortunately.

 

[Mike99]

Thanks, what I assumed, but it still seems a long time for not a lot, to the uninitiated

Your absolutely right, I had to delve around RTT to have a look for all the details, it was a mighty long trip

 

[Bald Rick]

The question was about the curve at Harringay (eg Harringay Park Junction - Harringay Junction) which I don't think is electrified

I don’t know whether the sleeper ever goes that way, but the Harringay curve certainly is electrified.

 

[CW2]

I've been on the sleeper diverted via Harringay curve only once, and that was diesel hauled. It is a lot simpler via Camden. The other difficulty is making the various crossing moves in between frequent all-stations EMU services. (Not so much of an issue right now).

 

[Jamesrob637]

folk are most likely travelling for leisure not work or to get from A to B as fast as possible (if so, they're on the wrong mode of transport).

You only have to read the "How busy have your trains been?" thread to know that business rail travel is still virtually non-existent at the moment let alone on bank holiday weekend sleeper services!

 

[MrEd]

Will the lounge car be open from 17 May?

How big are the windows in the Mk5 berths? As I recall the Mk3 windows were quite small and there wasn't any comfortable place to position yourself to look outside.

For me the main reason to take the sleeper on an upcoming trip to Scotland would be to watch the route during the reversal via Wembley and onto the ECML, during the few months/weeks when it's still possible to see outside at 2130.

But if the lounge car is not open then I don't think I will get a good view, might as well just take a day train and try again next summer (this August may be too late, need to check diversion dates and sunset times).

Are there any ECML diversions this August? Perhaps there are around the bank holidays, although I seem to think the sleeper goes back to WCML on Sunday nights after the end of June. Regular ECML diversions only seem to be a fixture for about three months each spring. If you want to watch any part of the route from the lounge car (and that’s the sole purpose of your trip) you’ll probably need to wait until next spring, as I can’t see it opening any time soon unfortunately. It would be almost completely dark by the time the sleeper reached Wembley Yard in August (if diverted via the ECML its departure time is about 20.15, which will be after sunset at the late August bank holiday). In south-east England, August sunset times vary from around 21.00 at the start of the month to about 19.55 at the end of it.

I don’t think it’s that much easier to look out of a Mk5 berth than the Mk3 equivalent, nor can you get a very good view out if you sit on the lower bed. The cabin windows may be a fraction bigger but not so much that it makes a significant difference.

 

[BRX]

For anyone interested this is what the ECML diversions/reversals look like from the train, a couple of videos here and here


obviously this was on the old stock! Each time I've done it I've quite enjoyed the trip into Wembley yard and watching 'regular' passengers look a bit surprised as the sleeper rolls through their local overground station.

 

[williamn]

Just been texted today there will be no hot water in my en suite cabin tomorrow night. First trip on the new stock off to a good start then!

 

[CW2]

Just been texted today there will be no hot water in my en suite cabin tomorrow night. First trip on the new stock off to a good start then!

Same here - but the good news is an automatic 30% refund. I can live with that.

 

[williamn]

Yes kudos to them for the refund and text, tho still not great given that this is very new stock most of which hasn’t been in service much over the last few months!

 

[CW2]

I'm currently experiencing at first hand why people recommend avoiding to room 1 right above the bogies. They definitely feel and sound like they're working quite hard.

 

[Red Onion]

I got a text advising of the same tomorrow night with the 30% refund (which is being put towards a new model railway loco!). I must admit it isn’t phasing me in anyway.

 

[CW2]

Is it just one defective vehicle in the Inverness circuit, or is there a fleet wide problem, I wonder?

 

[williamn]

I’m on the Glasgow train tomorrow.

It’s not the end of the world but I did buy the room thinking that I could shower and go straight to work.

 

[alistairlees]

I’m on the Glasgow train tomorrow.

It’s not the end of the world but I did buy the room thinking that I could shower and go straight to work.

If you are going to Glasgow, use the showers on the station. They are still reasonably good, having been completely refurbished about 5 years ago.

 

[williamn]

If you are going to Glasgow, use the showers on the station. They are still reasonably good, having been completely refurbished about 5 years ago.

I believe they’re closed at the moment unfortunately.