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Hypothetical - what would you spend it on?

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Harpers Tate

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At one time recently, Jim Ratcliffe was the UKs richest person, with assets (mostly Ineos shares) worth in excess of £16 billion. I believe James Dyson is worth a similar amount.

Suppose £16bn was handed to you with the caveat that you may only spend it on building railway routes for passenger use (with freight also permitted). Upgrading (eg electrification, doubling) of existing passenger routes is not part of your scope; conversion of freight-only routes for passenger use (construction of stations, capacity improvements) may be considered. You do not have to consider the cost of rolling stock nor of operating any services. You are merely providing infrastructure.

You can either resurrect old/closed routes (whether dismantled or in situ) or build completely new alignments or a mixture (i.e. "old" routes with new modifications or additions);
It's your choice entirely where to spend the money, and you do not have to justify, unless you care to, your choice/s based on any business case calculations. You are not expected to make any return on your spending. Some/any/all of your "projects" can be for purely personal/nostalgic reasons; based on your perception of need (real or latent) or for any other reason.
You can have as many projects as your funding allows.

You can say whether you intend it will be single or double track (or more, even); you can say whether it will be electrified.

For the purposes of this pure speculation, you don't have to "cost" your project/s with any degree of precision (or at all). You may therefore choose several and prioritise them (like do 1, then in funds allow, do 2, then if funds allow, do 3, etc). However, a broad idea of cost will clearly be useful; you couldn't, for example, build HS2 with this sum. I don't want to influence opinion here so I'm not naming the actual speculative project, but one example is the complete relaying of a certain route totally dismantled, largely on an existing derelict formation but with some new alignment estimated at £10m /mile (double track) a couple of years ago. I can't comment on how realistic that figure is but it may help.

So - what will you do with £16bn?
 
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Purple Orange

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For £16bn, I would not want to invest it all in rail specifically but rather any schemes that reduce car usage.

One effect that appears to happen is if a light metro line is built in a city, it seems like there is a greater chance of an extension of that network than there is of a new line built in a city that has no light rail metro. Therefore I would fund an initial new metro line in different cities. I’d go with:
  • An underground metro light rail line in Manchester
  • A tram line in Leeds, Bristol, Brighton, Southampton, Liverpool & Newcastle
 

NorthOxonian

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£16bn is a lot of money if you're doing smaller scale lines and reopenings - I reckon you could do thirty or forty for that kind of money. The sort of thing I'd be looking at is reconnecting Witney, Portishead, Consett, and similar sized places which are near major employment centres.

I might set aside a billion or two (might be more, you'd probably need to add a zero to that £10m per mile) for something more fanciful - a new line across the Highlands to Ullapool as well as a short extension of the Thurso line to Scrabster, and a new station/branch at Cairnryan. The purpose of these will be to improve connections between rail and ferries - with the last one the highest priority given the current woeful state of SailRail to Northern Ireland.
 
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PR1Berske

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Yeah £16bn is such a vast amount of money you could do just about anything on the RailUK wishlist and have change to spare.
 

21C101

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Assuming I didn't have family needing it:

Extend RHDR to Sandling
Tun Wells Central Tun Wells West
Uckfield Lewes
Horsted Keynes-Haywards Heath (bluebell donation)
Christs Hospital to Shoreham
Havant to Hayling Island
Axminster - Lyme Regis (as a heritage Line)
Colyton- Seaton Junction (Tramway Extension)
Honiton -Feniton - Sidmouth, Budleigh Exmouth (Tram Train)
Okehampton-Bere Alston,
Barnstaple to Bideford & Torrington.
Boscarne Jct - Padstow (as a heritage line)
Lostwythiel Fowey
Portishead Branch
Cullompton, Wellibngton, Langport, Somerton, Devizes Parkway
Princes Ris,Thame,Cowley, Oxford, Witney, Carterton.
Bourne End High Wycombe
Braintree, Stanstead, Bishops Stortford.
Sudbury, Haverhill, Cambridge
Northampton, Wellingborough (and new cutoff iine north of Corby) for Northampton to Peterborough service.
Honeybourne Stratford
Honeybourne Broadway (as heritage)
Matlock - Chinley
Extend GC to tram interchange north of Ruddington and Abbey Area of Leicester
Extend NNR to Fakenham via Melton Constable.
Wymonham to Wells via Fakenham
Llangollen to Ruabon
Pickering to Malton.
Hunts Cross - Gateace
Atherton - Leigh
Wath Royston Cudworth Goose Hill Jct
Melton Mowbray to Nottingham
Leicester Burton Walsall Stourbridge
Skipton - Colne
Northallerton - Redmire - Garsdale.
Appleby, Penrith, Keswick Workington.
Bury - Bolton
Kings Lynn- Huntstanton.
Would say Blythe and Tyne but government is paying for that.
 

HSTEd

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Most of the schemes I like will cost an order of magnitude more (albeit delivery an order of magnitude more benefits).

Probably a couple of dozen tram systems, with tram train interfaces, so a large part of the UK rail system has local services using them.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

£16b? Dumfries to Edinburgh Maglev. The demand is there ;)
Actually pondered this in relation to my GB Metro thing.

I think Perth is actually the better Maglev target, but that's just me.
 

GRALISTAIR

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Electrification - every penny of the 16 billion. Focus would be on freight routes. F2N plus N to Birmingham Lawley street very very high up. Then B and H to the quarries and through to Taunton.
 

Purple Orange

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Electrification - every penny of the 16 billion. Focus would be on freight routes. F2N plus N to Birmingham Lawley street very very high up. Then B and H to the quarries and through to Taunton.
What is F2N, N to Birmingham and B amd H?

And why freight routes?
 

xotGD

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Wick to Oslo rail tunnel. Calling at Shetland.
 

HST43257

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All infill electrification you can dream of, plus major other wiring projects. A hundred or more Class 93s to replace anything diesel loco operated that runs under any wires.
 

GRALISTAIR

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What is F2N, N to Birmingham and B amd H?

And why freight routes?
F2N is freight 2 Nuneaton and B and H is the Berks and Hants Line which runs from Reading to Taunton via Westbury. And I guess N to Birmingham is Nuneaton to Birmingham.
F2N is the acronym often used in the industry for Felixtowe Port to Nuneaton. Then Nuneaton to Birmingham Lawley Street to Nuneaton so then you have got Birmingham to Leicester for passengers too - actually to Peterborough.

I like concentrating on freight because even the most brain-dead politician must know by now that heavy freight is not realistically possible by battery or hydrogen. I like getting big wins out of the way. They nearly always have passenger advantages too - especially the Berks and Hants line - electric all the way to Taunton would be a big chunk.

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: ==

All infill electrification you can dream of, plus major other wiring projects. A hundred or more Class 93s to replace anything diesel loco operated that runs under any wires.
A man after my own heart - I love your thinking.
 
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Irascible

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Hmm. I think I might invest a chunk of it into a research organisation looking at ways to shift more national freight to rail without making it unattractive ( eg local automated container handling facilities rather than huge terminals ). Wonder what gauge clearing every main line to W12 would cost - that'd certainly have interesting implications for passenger use. Perhaps I'd look at a new rail-connected port further down the channel, it'd cut some shipping time. Then probably build an entirely new main line to fix every issue that part of the country has... and then probably have to sponsor regional rail freight for a while.

I suspect I actually want to resurrect BR Research - only with a broader remit & attached think-tank - & then fund it's output.

--

Either electrify spinal routes or build new ones if that'd serve better, clear bottlenecks by whatever means ( especially if I'm trying to get more freight back ), resite badly positioned stations even if it means tunneling, and my pet list of westcountry shouldn't-have-shuts ( which is currently, um, Ilfracombe, and I'd send any new line down the Exe valley instead of the current one ), obviously. I wonder how far £16bn would really go ( about the cost of the chunnel? ) - I don't actually know, so that's making what I'd want to do with it a bit vague so this is all entirely not what the OP asked for.
 
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cle

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Yep mine would be quite boring.

Electrification (Didcot to Coventry, Market Harborough to Doncaster/Grantham, Derby back to Brum and Bristol Parkway, Cardiff-Swansea, Ely to Peterborough and Norwich)
Quad Didcot to Oxford
Extra tracks between MKC and Bletchley
Chiltern refresh (wires, platform lengthening, station rebuilds for loops/passing/platforms, extra track here and there)

I've probably spent it. No reopenings. Maximise what we've got - make it electric, long and then if possible, more frequent.
 

Aictos

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All infill electrification you can dream of, plus major other wiring projects.
To a degree I agree but I wouldn't just electrify all infill, only those that actually had a decent business case.
 

JohnElliott

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£16bn ought to cover a rail tunnel from the mainland to the Isle of Wight (as planned in the 1910s) and a link to the existing Ryde-Shanklin line.

I'd also be tempted to reinstate the GCML, Woodhead, the Withered Arm and Uckfield-Lewes just to stop the same discussions showing up again and again. Oh, and the Euston Arch and the station buildings of Crystal Palace High Level if I can find somewhere to put them.

If there's any pocket change left over in the jam jar, Horsham - Crawley - Gatwick - Three Bridges - East Grinstead - Tunbridge Wells as a metro. And I'll have a railway line to the village where I live so I can take the train to London without driving to a railhead, thanks.
 

Irascible

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I'd be half tempted by putting the Highgate-Finsbury Park line back ( although I'm not sure what I'd attach it to! ), did not enjoy getting the bus from Crouch End at all. For 16bn I could afford to quad track Drayton Park-Moorgate and in fact continue it on to Bank like it really should do ( and probably build the Bank platforms from gold... bank indeed. ). Actually, add Moorgate-Bank tunnels as a more serious suggestion - getting from GN suburbia to the Docklands, the Moorgate-Bank bit was qutie an annoyance after a day's grind & then a slog back on the DLR ( the rollercoaster to Bank can only be entertaining for so long ).

I'd also be tempted to reinstate the GCML, Woodhead, the Withered Arm and Uckfield-Lewes just to stop the same discussions showing up again and again. Oh, and the Euston Arch and the station buildings of Crystal Palace High Level if I can find somewhere to put them.
Presumably rebuilt into their state in their heyday? complete with replica stock. Although pathing on the GCML for HS2 trains and Butler Henderson clones should be entertaining.

Is there anywhere in the UK that could use a modern narrow-gauge line? ( metre gauge or similar, so practically full size, not North Wales sized ). Tighter radius curves & steeper inclines are probably the only place it'd save on construction over standard gauge, so it'd have to be somewhere with a lot of scenery to be worth it.
 

Harpers Tate

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Some interesting ideas, thanks.

@Purple Orange Perfectly valid and I tend to agree, but whilst I didn't exclude light rail in the brief, non-rail contributions would be outside the scope of the brief.

@GRALISTAIR Electrification of existing routes is specifically excluded from the brief

@HST43257 Ditto, as is provision of rolling stock.

@Irascible Freight traffic isn't part of the brief unless it accompanies passenger use. The brieff is specifically about construction, not "reasearch". Electrification of existing routes is specifically excluded.

@cle Again, your suggestions are outside the brief.

I'm not suggesting these aren't valid things to do. But if the "benefactor" offered you the money with the very strings I have outlined attached, then you wouldn't qualify.

Thanks, all. Any more?
 

Aictos

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Surely the consideration to deliver access for all should be considered as that is a requirement for new station platforms I believe.

That being the case I would deliver step free access with lifts to:

ECML

Biggleswade
Hertford North
Gordon Hill
Alexandra Palace

MML

Flitwick
Harlington
Leagrave
Luton

As to reopening or upgrading freight lines to passenger use, I would complete the Ivanhoe line by upgrading the current freight only line between Leicester and Burton-on-Trent to passenger use with reopened stations at Coalville and Ashby de la Zouch with the former being the first to be reopened.
 

Metrolink

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My list would be:
  • Doubling all of the line between Coventry and Leamington Spa
  • Doubling Stockport - Stalybridge for passenger use for 3tph (peak) use (1tph Stalybridge- Hazel Grove, 1tph Stalybridge - Stockport, 1tph Huddersfield - Alderley Edge (peak) (if your wondering))
  • Doubling Ely section
  • Electrification of the hope valley line
  • Funding Rolling Stock improvements
  • Tunnel between Bradford FS and Bradford interchange
  • New track layout that allows Atherton trains to use North Western Station and carry on to Preston etc.
  • Merseyrail to Wigan
  • Some sort of Leeds, Wakefield, Bradford, and Harrogate light rail connecting the cities and towns across West Yorkshire
  • (Enthusiasts choice here) Reopen York - Beverley
  • Thirsk - Ripon Spur
  • New station at Garstang for Barrow and Windermere Service
  • Daventry Parkway in Weeton Bec off the A45 serving Daventry
Any thoughts?
 
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Harpers Tate

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@Metrolink No money is offered for items 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 (electrification or doubling of existing route; rolling stock) on your list.
 

Metrolink

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@Metrolink No money is offered for items 1, 2, 3, 4 and 5 (electrification or doubling of existing route; rolling stock) on your list.
To be completely honest the only one I could answer would be my 5th point of the list: which I would estimate £1.5bn of the £16bn budget. However, for the other example I wouldn’t be to sure where to place a guess on the cost :s. I will edit my previous reply and those in bold would be my biggest priority.
 

zwk500

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To be completely honest the only one I could answer would be my 5th point of the list: which I would estimate £1.5bn of the £16bn budget. However, for the other example I wouldn’t be to sure where to place a guess on the cost :s. I will edit my previous reply and those in bold would be my biggest priority.
The OP was referring you to post #1:
Suppose £16bn was handed to you with the caveat that you may only spend it on building railway routes for passenger use (with freight also permitted). Upgrading (eg electrification, doubling) of existing passenger routes is not part of your scope; conversion of freight-only routes for passenger use (construction of stations, capacity improvements) may be considered. You do not have to consider the cost of rolling stock nor of operating any services. You are merely providing infrastructure.
 

EssexGonzo

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Could we cover the Brentwood to Shenfield cutting please, just to keep the noise down? Cheers.
 
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