Should Gavin Williamson shorten the school holidays?

[A Challenge]

or the teacher-assessment system will have to continue for a few more years

I've quoted a very specific parts of your post, but I don't think that teacher assessment for longer than you can't do exams, the system may be better this year (even then I'm not convinced) but last year the teacher grading system was such a farce they had to give the teacher grades, which is not a good idea, teachers are under such pressure for results that if they don't think there's going to any changes at least some of them will systematically raise grades in their classes, and the only other option is correcting by previous grades, which doesn't really work, as proved.

 

[Monty]

The various posts above explain why people are so “up in arms” about it, and how it will be easier said than done to extend school days or term lengths.

But since nobody is suggesting viable alternatives...

You can't put mental health below that though. If that means the children will be behind where they ordinarily would be then so be it. Material will have to be removed from the syllabuses, or the teacher-assessment system will have to continue for a few more years to alleviate the need to teach nonsense which is specific to the exams.

What is the point of kids being in school if they will be stressed to the point of inability to take in any more information?

Your damned if you do, damned if you don't. If the government simply took the attitude writing off a year and half of education for thousands of children with no real options to correct it then the public would be castigating them just badly if not worse than whats being suggested.

 

[Darandio]

It's as if the teachers, pupils and us parents have been doing absolutely nothing for the last 12 months...........

Week after week of juggling schoolwork with jobs and the answer is to work them even harder. Why did we even bother?

 

[3rd rail land]

Perhaps an option is to offer extra lessons after the regular school has finished but make them optional much like extra revision classes are optional. Those who care about their education will attend but nobody will be forced to turn up.
Staff would need to paid extra for this and not be extended to suck it up as it's 'in the interest of the children'.

I think it will only be viable if the kids are already at school. It will be virtually impossible to get them to come in during holidays for extra lessons. The numbers that would show up would be so low it wouldn't be worth it.

 

[Ianno87]

Perhaps an option is to offer extra lessons after the regular school has finished but make them optional much like extra revision classes are optional. Those who care about their education will attend but nobody will be forced to turn up.
Staff would need to paid extra for this and not be extended to suck it up as it's 'in the interest of the children'.

I think it will only be viable if the kids are already at school. It will be virtually impossible to get them to come in during holidays for extra lessons. The numbers that would show up would be so low it wouldn't be worth it.

I'd be amenable to it being based on my kids' teachers recommendations. i.e. "We think your child would benefit from a bit of support in Subject X, would they like to attend an extra class after school on Tuesday?"

 

[3rd rail land]

I'd be amenable to it being based on my kids' teachers recommendations. i.e. "We think your child would benefit from a bit of support in Subject X, would they like to attend an extra class after school on Tuesday?"

That was my line of thinking. Optional is the way to go. Any other way simply won't work IMO.

 

[birchesgreen]

I can’t see how it would work this year. Holidays and plans are already made and booked. Going forward, there is possibly an argument for a shorter summer holiday, made up by adding weeks to other holidays elsewhere in the year. Indeed I remember this being talked about when I was at school.

It was talked about when I was in school too, when Thatcher was in power. I think its one of those policies which raises it's ugly head once a generation after the people who worked out how unsuitable it was have retired.

 

[LAX54]

Suggestion of not only shorter holidays, but longer days too, so who will teaching in the longer hours / shorter holidays ? it won't be the current Teachers that's for sure, they alreday put in a 14 hour day with prep and marking !

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Mar 2021 ==

Not sure why people are so up in arms about it, if children's education isn't to suffer the only realistic options are to either extend the school day, extend the term or you ramp up the homework. Either way the kids will be doing more work to play catch up.

As stated... WHO is going to take on this extra work ?

 

[3rd rail land]

Suggestion of not only shorter holidays, but longer days too, so who will teaching in the longer hours / shorter holidays ? it won't be the current Teachers that's for sure, they alreday put in a 14 hour day with prep and marking !

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Mar 2021 ==


As stated... WHO is going to take on this extra work ?

The government may well try to use supply teachers to cover the extra work, which in my opinion is not a good idea. Pupils don't like it when they get an unknown teacher teaching them. Its one thing getting a new teacher at the start of a school year but quite another getting a new person part way through or just for extra holiday lessons.

 

[Typhoon]

I can’t see how it would work this year. Holidays and plans are already made and booked.

Exactly. The minute the 'Road Map' was announced, holiday bookings apparently shot through the roof. If this policy had been intended, it needed to be flagged up and discussed in December. Unfortunately forward planning does not seem to be one of Mr Williamson's strong points (exams fiasco last summer). To me it just looks like he's trying to show that he is proactive. They'll shovel a modicum of money down which schools will have to bid for then blame schools for not taking up the offer (enough will do so for Williamson and Johnson to have a few photo-ops). When I taught in a school, we used to take parties of kids hill walking first week of the holidays, staff enjoyed it, kids enjoyed it and I bet they got more out of it than they would have done cooped up in a classroom being taught by (possibly disinterested) supply teachers.

 

[SS4]

Hopefully this won’t be the case, but who knows with this government. I cannot see the benefit of lengthening school days at all. Bear in mind many teachers spend the rest of the day after the students have left for meetings, planning, marking, or teaching after-school clubs or lessons (yes, not all students go home at 3pm!).

If we do end up with industrial action from teaching staff, I wonder whose side the right-wing press will be on?

The right-wing press despise industrial action as a rule and will go out of their way to misrepresent it as much as possible. Combine that with an immense distaste for local authorities and I can confidently guess they will not be on the side of the staff. I would be interested in seeing teachers implementing work to rule with the work they do in their own time.

As for shortening the summer holidays I don't think it should be done this year as this "home-schooling" is closer to normal school but at home than the home-schooling of old which had more flexibility around timings and it's been stressful for everyone.

However, I do think that it should be looked at in the future. Is six weeks excessive in the worst weather of the year? Off the top of my head I'd make summer a four week break and make Christmas and Easter three weeks each but then it's well known that hot weather befuddles the brain - perhaps we would have better results with a new school year with exams taking place in winter or spring?

 

[A Challenge]

It would be better (though too much effort to change it in my view, especially now) if English schools used a Scottish-style term system, as the weather is generally better in June and early July than August (not actually checked that statistically, though it's what it seems like to me)

 

[HST43257]

They cannot do something like taking away the Summer Holidays, or even part of it.

As someone who isn’t far from doing GCSEs, I can say that most people’s (of my age) mental health is at an extreme low and the government are looking to take away the main mental health reliever of the year, straight before hundreds of thousands of youngsters make advanced preparations for exams? Did they, or did they not, say that mental health was one of the government’s biggest priorites? This lot sure love to mislead us.

From my own point of view, I want to explore the country and have a great time feeling as good as I can before I get bogged down in a year of intense study.

 

[Typhoon]

They cannot do something like taking away the Summer Holidays, or even part of it.

As someone who isn’t far from doing GCSEs, I can say that most people’s (of my age) mental health is at an extreme low and the government are looking to take away the main mental health reliever of the year, straight before hundreds of thousands of youngsters make advanced preparations for exams? Did they, or did they not, say that mental health was one of the government’s biggest priorites? This lot sure love to mislead us.

From my own point of view, I want to explore the country and have a great time feeling as good as I can before I get bogged down in a year of intense study.

Start by looking at the poll at the top of the page. Not only does this reflect the views of this forum, but I would say that it reflects the views of people countrywide. People, whether in work, university or college, or like you need a break. It has been proposed by an out-of-touch minister who is just trying to pretend he is taking some action. There will be stuff put on which will be voluntary, some will attend, many won't. He can then say that he has ticked the box. Will it be a success? Look at his track record (exams last year). Depends what there is to offer, some might even be enjoyable.

However, if you have plans that don't involve sitting in front of a screen all day then there is a fair chance that you will learn more from getting out and about. You will probably get more exercise too. When I was at primary school (60 years ago), I learnt a lot about Britain's imports by sitting on wharves with friends watching ships going up and down the River Thames and it encouraged me to find out more about the countries they came from. The world is your classroom, make use of it this summer and have a happy holiday.

 

[HST43257]

Start by looking at the poll at the top of the page. Not only does this reflect the views of this forum, but I would say that it reflects the views of people countrywide. People, whether in work, university or college, or like you need a break. It has been proposed by an out-of-touch minister who is just trying to pretend he is taking some action. There will be stuff put on which will be voluntary, some will attend, many won't. He can then say that he has ticked the box. Will it be a success? Look at his track record (exams last year). Depends what there is to offer, some might even be enjoyable.

However, if you have plans that don't involve sitting in front of a screen all day then there is a fair chance that you will learn more from getting out and about. You will probably get more exercise too. When I was at primary school (60 years ago), I learnt a lot about Britain's imports by sitting on wharves with friends watching ships going up and down the River Thames and it encouraged me to find out more about the countries they came from. The world is your classroom, make use of it this summer and have a happy holiday.

Gavin simply doesn’t understand that people have feelings and aren’t just numbers or things on a lIET. If he does this stuff with schools the people of this country will make him realise that there are other people out there and he needs to understand how we work and feel before making decisions potentially affecting our lives.

I can agree with optional extra classes, I may even attend one or two couple myself. I want to learn, and I may even support an extra half hour or hour in classrooms at the end of the regular school day if it means catching up that little bit more. My point is, there are 12 weeks a year of no education for a very very good reason and no one has a right to fully mess with them.

And, you’re right, not all learning happens in the classroom. I’ve learnt so much from going round the country and exploring. I don’t think Mr Williamson understands anything similar to this.

 

[davetheguard]

IMHO, there's only one thing Gavin Williamson should do, and that is to resign as he appears to have completely failed to master his brief. He may, or may not, be a very able MP - but he doesn't appear to me to be fit for a ministerial post of any description. Whatever happens, please, please, please don't give him transport instead!

 

[Typhoon]

IMHO, there's only one thing Gavin Williamson should do, and that is to resign as he appears to have completely failed to master his brief. He may, or may not, be a very able MP - but he doesn't appear to me to be fit for a ministerial post of any description. Whatever happens, please, please, please don't give him transport instead!

Grayling Mark II

(He's been at DfT before - PPS to McLoughlin)

 

[Hey 3]

IMHO, there's only one thing Gavin Williamson should do, and that is to resign as he appears to have completely failed to master his brief. He may, or may not, be a very able MP - but he doesn't appear to me to be fit for a ministerial post of any description. Whatever happens, please, please, please don't give him transport instead!

Indeed.

 

[A Challenge]

Grayling Mark II

(He's been at DfT before - PPS to McLoughlin)

Gove, Grayling, (Gavin) Williamson - seems to me that having G at the beginning of your name makes you less competent as a minister

 

[DB]

But since nobody is suggesting viable alternatives...

As with a lot of the damage inflicted by the government in the past year, there may well be no real way to undo it.

But the government was, and still is, focused on badly thought through measures to be seen to be doing something. No doubt there will be a lot of collective hand-wringing in this country soon from all those who cheered on the draconian restrictions while managing to ignore the predictable long term consequences. There will be much wailing that 'nobody told us this would happen'.

 

[Bayum]

Short term my school holidays won't be changed as its a private school.

If they attempt to do it long term I wouldn't be happy, from a personal perspective my partner (a teacher) is able to go back home abroad for the entire 8 week summer holiday and though i work in school holidays, I like the long period in summer to work less hours and take my annual leave.

The long summer period is also when schools are able to do large maintenance projects

Until the rest of the country’s school holidays change and parents start demanding bang for their buck…

 

[Jamiescott1]

Until the rest of the country’s school holidays change and parents start demanding bang for their buck…

We're in a position as one of top schools in country where we are not swayed by things like that

 

[Bayum]

We're in a position as one of top schools in country where we are not swayed by things like that

Lucky you. We’re in the top 50 and our parents are still snapping at our necks

 

[Darandio]

Gavin Williamson should take a holiday. Preferably using a one way ticket to a predator infested uninhabited island, he can take Mary Ramsay for company.

 

[yorkie]

But since nobody is suggesting viable alternatives...

There can be no mandatory alternative.

As I type this, I am still not allowed to run extra-curricular activities for students, either at lunch time or after school. So the gap is still widening. It has now been over a year since I was able to run any such activities.

There should be funding for fun additional extra-curricular activities but they cannot be mandatory.

 

[Energy]

Material will have to be removed from the syllabuses, or the teacher-assessment system will have to continue for a few more years to alleviate the need to teach nonsense which is specific to the exams.

What gets removed is now largely up to the teachers, in September some subjects had parts removed, particularly removing coursework which couldn't be done due to having to be at home (such as DT/Woodwork). What gets tested in the assessments is up to the teachers, there is no fixed order in which a course is taught so different schools will have covered different bits. To make sure the grades are fair (so removing the entire test is pointless as it couldn't contribute to the grade) they will be compared to the distribution of grades the school has in normal years, e.g is 30% got grade 6s in 2018 then around 30% will get grade 6s in 2021.

Should school holidays get shortened? No. Mental health is more important than a child learning something which they will not use. If they are going to do maths at A level then they should learn what they missed of maths, but if they are going to do hairdressing course at college then it isn't necessary. Worth remembering that overstressed people do not learn as well...