Could the Formartine and Buchan line be reopened?

[Wynd]

Because both need investment but is it there ?

Sorry, are you questioning if the investment in rail in the north east is justified?

 

[Tobbes]

Not quite following you here. Why do Fife lines prohibit progress in the North East?

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Its very difficult to justify Peterhead from the south given the development. Especially when the existing alignment could be used. Hence why I made these proposals.




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Sorry, I'd missed this. Very interesting, and it does show hard hard it is to serve both Peterhead and Fraserburgh well. I was playing with Google Earth and wondering if the line could follow the Peterhead bypass from Boddam and head north- in effect moving your triangular junction east to the western outskirts of Peterhead. Such an alignment would allow competitive Fraserburgh to Peterhead journeys rather than having to go to Maude first.

 

[Wynd]

d hard it is to serve both Peterhead and Fraserburgh well. I was playing with Google Earth and wondering if the line could follow the Peterhead bypass from Boddam and head north- in effect moving your triangular junction east to the western outskirts of Peterhead. Such an alignment would allow competitive Fraserburgh to Peterhead journeys rather than having to go to

Not at all!

My own intuition is that going to Maude is a poor proposition.

As you say moving the junction east makes the offering to the customer more attractive. One of the key points of the project is to make journey times drastically shorter than they currently are.

 

[waverley47]

The train will never be quicker in this part of the world, it's too hilly. But it doesn't have to be, it just has to be competitive.

Anything less than an hour to Fraserburgh and less than forty minutes to Peterhead is going to work. Aberdeen is quite a nuclear city, and the station serves the CBD well.

I'd argue the main problem with this scheme is platform and track capacity to the north of Aberdeen, once that is solved the rest is a no brainer.

 

[Wynd]

The train will never be quicker in this part of the world, it's too hilly. But it doesn't have to be, it just has to be competitive.

Anything less than an hour to Fraserburgh and less than forty minutes to Peterhead is going to work. Aberdeen is quite a nuclear city, and the station serves the CBD well.

I'd argue the main problem with this scheme is platform and track capacity to the north of Aberdeen, once that is solved the rest is a no brainer.

The F&B must be on for one of the flattest lines in Scotland surely...? But i do take your point. It will be quicker than the bus, but competitive with driving.


Indeed, north end of Aberdeen, Platforms 8 & 9 and the two tunnels are key bottlenecks that require attention going forwards.

 

[waverley47]

The F&B must be on for one of the flattest lines in Scotland surely...? But i do take your point. It will be quicker than the bus, but competitive with driving.


Indeed, north end of Aberdeen, Platforms 8 & 9 and the two tunnels are key bottlenecks that require attention going forwards.

The landscape is up there with the flattest, but the geography works against it.

The railway has to go around the hills, which although aren't steep, are still high, with a big moor between Greenheads and Kilmundy. You have to along the coast, or up to Maud and down the river, no up and over. Along the coast is pricy and there are access issues, around Maud is a long and indirect way to go. A straight line would be perfect, but that's not going to happen.

 

[Hardcastle]

Sorry, are you questioning if the investment in rail in the north east is justified?

No am questioning is the finance is available am all for reopening lines some of which should never have closed in the first place with no thought about the future.

 

[waverley47]

No am questioning is the finance is available am all for reopening lines some of which should never have closed in the first place with no thought about the future.

The line did close though, so arguing over the sensibilities of whomsoever decided to do that is neither here nor there.

In the UK, yes, there is the finance available. The willpower to deliver is the problem. In the next decade, the Scottish Government will be jumping through every hoop imaginable to invest in public transport and reach net zero.

The north east is the next logical line after Levenmouth, along with perhaps Hawick. It makes sense that these will be pursued, however there are also a lot of other commitments to fund as well. Building a metro in Glasgow and wiring the network won't come cheap, so it's probably a decade away, but sooner or later someone in government will look at that line and see it as an easy win.

The moment the Scottish government look at Peterhead and Fraserburgh and decide it's worth it, the track record suggests that it probably will be built.

 

[Tobbes]

@Bald Rick noted that the costs per mile of a new versus a reopened railway weren't too far apart, so this suggests a new, optimised, alignment north of Ellon, as the kink via Maude adds considerable distance.