Speculation on better services for Pembrokeshire

[Anonymous10]

Used to see use on summer Saturdays where an unit would arrive into the bay from Pembroke, sit there for ~ 20 minutes before shunting onto the mainline to form a Whitland - Swansea (?) service

ok thanks didn't know

 

[fishwomp]

I've seen Whitland bay platform in use in recent years - unplanned but not unusual, and, if I remember rightly, on a through service.. eh what?!

Imagine (and this is not hard...) the service off the branch is late, by 30 minutes. You are a service due to go down the branch, and sitting in the down through platform.

What are your options?

1. Sit there until the 30 minutes late service arrives to release the token for the branch. Block the mainline - including services that may, on their return, propagate delays back to Swansea and beyond. You may be delaying Milford Haven or a Fishguard boat train, or an oiler.

2. Go forward to the start of the token section, and set back into the bay platform. Note, you won't have the token at this point in time - as the P&T line is occupied - you will have spoken to the signalman as you passed Whitland box (and left empty handed) and he would tell you the plan. Sit in the bay, await the up service to leave the branch and return its token, and then you collect the token and proceed.

I'm not 100% sure of the legitimacy of letting the down service go as far as the start of the token section, I don't know what overlaps the signal has. The service coming off the branch would need appropriate signal overlap. Perhaps this move is only allowed if the service is actually 30 minutes late - ie. has not left Tenby, and therefore not yet picked up the token for the Whitland section. Further, the decision would have been made to not make it wait at Tenby - as it would propagate even more delay onto the mainline, whereas the down service gets an hour at Pembroke Dock to relax...

 

[Envoy]

that would be nice to see but how long has it been since the bay platform was last used

Well, you just get the bay going again if a shuttle would work. I note that in Cornwall, you have several branch lines linked by shuttles to main line services; Looe, Falmouth, Newquay and St.Ives come to mind. Of course, the mainline in Cornwall also has more trains than anything west of Carmarthen - Cross Country Voyagers, GWR 4 coach HST’s, GWR 158’s and direct services to London IET’s. (Greater population west of Plymouth than west of Swansea plus more tourists).

 

[edwin_m]

Is token exchange for the Pembroke line still at the signal box at the east end of Whitland station? Token exchange during the station stop would go quite a way towards making a return journey possible within 2hr.

 

[fishwomp]

Is token exchange for the Pembroke line still at the signal box at the east end of Whitland station? Token exchange during the station stop would go quite a way towards making a return journey possible within 2hr.

Yes, it is still at the box - it would help decrease the overlapping time required by almost 5 minutes I guess, if it moved - but all the signalling needs to be automated to win big here, not just moved!

 

[anthony263]

I personally think the Pembroke dock branch needs extra passing loops either side of tenby including at Manorbier with linesmen increases west of tenby the problem seems to be the various level crossings.

Ideally I think there should be a service every 30 minutes between swansea and carmarthen with trains every 2 hours west to Pembroke dock milford haven a nd fishguard hbr. Tenby could get an hourly peak service with units attaching etc at Whitland

 

[Anonymous10]

I personally think the Pembroke dock branch needs extra passing loops either side of tenby including at Manorbier with linesmen increases west of tenby the problem seems to be the various level crossings.

Ideally I think there should be a service every 30 minutes between swansea and carmarthen with trains every 2 hours west to Pembroke dock milford haven a nd fishguard hbr. Tenby could get an hourly peak service with units attaching etc at Whitland

id like to see a hourly shuttle on the branch to Carmarthen with a 3rd small bay introduced if needed so as to allow all Pembrokeshire branches to get this treatment (if warranted)

 

[Bald Rick]

I personally think the Pembroke dock branch needs extra passing loops either side of tenby including at Manorbier with linesmen increases west of tenby the problem seems to be the various level crossings.

Ideally I think there should be a service every 30 minutes between swansea and carmarthen with trains every 2 hours west to Pembroke dock milford haven a nd fishguard hbr. Tenby could get an hourly peak service with units attaching etc at Whitland

I’m confused. You want a train every two hours to Pembroke - as now (roughly), but also more loops?

 

[fishwomp]

I’m confused. You want a train every two hours to Pembroke - as now (roughly), but also more loops?

The obvious solution - the Cleddau tunnel and reopening the Neyland branch, or - projecting straight line from Pembroke Dock - to the old Newton Noyes MOD depot line and into Milford Haven to make the loop. Since Weymouth lost its harbour line, the UK needs a replacement.

 

[ChiefPlanner]

I personally think the Pembroke dock branch needs extra passing loops either side of tenby including at Manorbier with linesmen increases west of tenby the problem seems to be the various level crossings.

Ideally I think there should be a service every 30 minutes between swansea and carmarthen with trains every 2 hours west to Pembroke dock milford haven a nd fishguard hbr. Tenby could get an hourly peak service with units attaching etc at Whitland

Well ,being devolved now - I suggest you contact your representatives and ask for it ? - no one can blame a distant London based organisation for train service specs anymore.

I do sympathise though- having links to SW Wales (even born there) , there is a distinct lack of interest from seemingly all quarters. However - in the past road (and industrial estates) were the answer for the future.

 

[anthony263]

I’m confused. You want a train every two hours to Pembroke - as now (roughly), but also more loops?

To allow for service enhancements in the future etc

 

[Anonymous10]

The obvious solution - the Cleddau tunnel and reopening the Neyland branch, or - projecting straight line from Pembroke Dock - to the old Newton Noyes MOD depot line and into Milford Haven to make the loop. Since Weymouth lost its harbour line, the UK needs a replacement.

or have a tram train similar to the valleys from platform 2 pembroke dock round over 1 side of cleddau bridge (2 very wide paths turn one into a tram way) then run it along to neyland and over onto the tracks to Milford haven with a platform 2 being reinstalled opinions?

 

[Rhydgaled]

I’m confused. You want a train every two hours to Pembroke - as now (roughly), but also more loops?

He also said 30 minute interval Carmarthen - Swansea which requires Pembroke Dock trains to pass around Templeton. No need for Manorbier loop though if you only want 0.5tph to Pembroke Dock.

That said, I do think St. Clears, Kidwelly and Ferryside probably warrant only 1tph and should all be served by the same train. Thus you wouldn't get a clockface 30 minute interval at all three of Swansea, Carmarthen and Whitland - if you made it clockface at Swansea the two services MIGHT be close enough to each other by Whitland for the Tenby loop to work.

The obvious solution - the Cleddau tunnel and reopening the Neyland branch, or - projecting straight line from Pembroke Dock - to the old Newton Noyes MOD depot line and into Milford Haven to make the loop. Since Weymouth lost its harbour line, the UK needs a replacement.

I have thought extending the Pembroke Dock line to Haverfordwest through Neyland would be very useful, but using a low-level bridge with the ability to slide open for shipping rather than a tunnel (for a Cleddau tunnel Pembroke Dock station would probably need to be in the tunnel, otherwise the gradient into the tunnel would be really steep). Way too expensive though sadly.

or have a tram train similar to the valleys from platform 2 pembroke dock round over 1 side of cleddau bridge (2 very wide paths turn one into a tram way) then run it along to neyland and over onto the tracks to Milford haven with a platform 2 being reinstalled opinions?

Nice bit of out-of-the-box thinking there, but I think once you loose the ability to run a through train (with toilets) from Swansea/Cardiff to Pembroke Dock via Haverfordwest you might as well just have bus connection to Haverfordwest.

Well ,being devolved now - I suggest you contact your representatives and ask for it ? - no one can blame a distant London based organisation for train service specs anymore.

They can't blame train service specs on London, but mention infrustructure (eg. passing loops) and Cardiff will blame London for lack of investment. Well they do if you ask about electrification anyway.

 

[Anonymous10]

He also said 30 minute interval Carmarthen - Swansea which requires Pembroke Dock trains to pass around Templeton. No need for Manorbier loop though if you only want 0.5tph to Pembroke Dock.

That said, I do think St. Clears, Kidwelly and Ferryside probably warrant only 1tph and should all be served by the same train. Thus you wouldn't get a clockface 30 minute interval at all three of Swansea, Carmarthen and Whitland - if you made it clockface at Swansea the two services MIGHT be close enough to each other by Whitland for the Tenby loop to work.

I have thought extending the Pembroke Dock line to Haverfordwest through Neyland would be very useful, but using a low-level bridge with the ability to slide open for shipping rather than a tunnel (for a Cleddau tunnel Pembroke Dock station would probably need to be in the tunnel, otherwise the gradient into the tunnel would be really steep). Way too expensive though sadly.

Nice bit of out-of-the-box thinking there, but I think once you loose the ability to run a through train (with toilets) from Swansea/Cardiff to Pembroke Dock via Haverfordwest you might as well just have bus connection to Haverfordwest.

They can't blame train service specs on London, but mention infrustructure (eg. passing loops) and Cardiff will blame London for lack of investment. Well they do if you ask about electrification anyway.

honestly the train link to haverfordwest / Milford haven would not replace current services it would complement giving flexibility to allow journey's to be made affordably and with a smaller carbon foot print running to Milford haven with the option to go into haverfordwest west maybe (my dream would see it run through town to near the hospital and loop back (on roads admittedly however this is way to expensive) instead i would suggest it serving pembroke dock West llanion (cleddau bridge), honey borough/ neyland maybe a stop at each ?? then another stop at steynton and Milford haven if continuing on to haverfordwest i would add a stop at Johnston and merlins bridge plus Pembrokeshire college. consider it a Pembrokeshire metro with you able to make a complete circuit of the county by rail (nearly)

 

[adrock1976]

A few years ago I had designed a suggested West Wales Taktplan which is buried deep somewhere in this section.

If I remember right, I had Swansea/Abertawe to Whitland via Carmarthen every 30 minutes calling all stations (Kidwelly and Ferryside alternating i.e. every 60 minutes each), then every 60 minutes to each of Milford Haven and Tenby, calling all stations. Further extended from Tenby to Pembroke Dock every 2 hours.

I also had a Cardiff - Fishguard Harbour via the Swansea District, calling Bridgend, Pyle, Port Talbot Parkway, Morriston Neath Road, somewhere near Pontlliw, Llanelli, Whitland, Clarbeston Road, Fishguard & Goodwick, and Harbour every 2 hours. The opposite hour had a train every 2 hours to either Llandeilo or Llandovery.

This was tied in with the Swansea - Shrewsbury via Llandovery (every 2 hours Swansea - Llandovery and Llandrindod Wells - Shrewsbury, with a train every 4 hours running through the middle section between Llandovery and Llandrindod Wells joining up at each end). Obviously, infrastructure interventions (i.e. double track) were required on the Pembroke branch and between Pantyffynon (or Pontarddullais, whichever one once had a diverging route on the right to somewhere) and Ammanford or Llandeilo.

What I did not illustrate that with the three stations between Cardiff and Bridgend, and the two either side of Neath was that I had intended for those to be served with a half hourly Maestaeg - Caerffili via Ninian Park and a Swansea - Port Talbot Parkway shuttle every 30 minutes (I'm sure that due to the length and with of the island platform at Port Talbot, that a bay platform could be carved at the Swansea end).

 

[Anonymous10]

A few years ago I had designed a suggested West Wales Taktplan which is buried deep somewhere in this section.

If I remember right, I had Swansea/Abertawe to Whitland via Carmarthen every 30 minutes calling all stations (Kidwelly and Ferryside alternating i.e. every 60 minutes each), then every 60 minutes to each of Milford Haven and Tenby, calling all stations. Further extended from Tenby to Pembroke Dock every 2 hours.

I also had a Cardiff - Fishguard Harbour via the Swansea District, calling Bridgend, Pyle, Port Talbot Parkway, Morriston Neath Road, somewhere near Pontlliw, Llanelli, Whitland, Clarbeston Road, Fishguard & Goodwick, and Harbour every 2 hours. The opposite hour had a train every 2 hours to either Llandeilo or Llandovery.

This was tied in with the Swansea - Shrewsbury via Llandovery (every 2 hours Swansea - Llandovery and Llandrindod Wells - Shrewsbury, with a train every 4 hours running through the middle section between Llandovery and Llandrindod Wells joining up at each end). Obviously, infrastructure interventions (i.e. double track) were required on the Pembroke branch and between Pantyffynon (or Pontarddullais, whichever one once had a diverging route on the right to somewhere) and Ammanford or Llandeilo.

What I did not illustrate that with the three stations between Cardiff and Bridgend, and the two either side of Neath was that I had intended for those to be served with a half hourly Maestaeg - Caerffili via Ninian Park and a Swansea - Port Talbot Parkway shuttle every 30 minutes (I'm sure that due to the length and with of the island platform at Port Talbot, that a bay platform could be carved at the Swansea end).

personally i prefer the entire branch being hourly with a connecting train tram same as will be used to treherbert

 

[Caaardiff]

Whitland to Tenby is timed at approx 29 mins stopping Narberth, Kilgetty and Saundersfoot.
With some creative timings, could the future split at Swansea remain attached and both trains continue to Whitland and split. One carrying on to Milford Haven and the other running non stop to Tenby and back to Whitland, then continuing on to Carmarthen or Swansea to attach to the next North service? Without the stops between Whitland and Tenby should save enough time to turn back and get to Whitland within an hour.

Would that work?
It could compliment the Swansea/Carmarthen - Pembroke stopper and provide an additional couple of services with a direct link from the North and SWML during the peak summer months to Tenby.

 

[Rhydgaled]

As an Aberystwyth graduate with an interest in integrating transport, I look to provide improved bus services from Aberystwyth and connections between bus and train services at Fishguard Harbour. This bus timetable is based around the six direct services between Cardigan and Aberaeron that existed in 2010, with extension through to Fishguard Harbour and some changes to better fit with potential rail services. The buses would interwork with 50 and 550 services (Cardigan to Aberystwyth/Aberaeron via New Quay) throughout the day, I only included one of these on the timetable as I wanted to focus on the Fishguard workings. In the case of the 18:38 journey from Fishguard Harbour, this would carry the TC5 service number as far as Cardigan where the destination display would be changed to 550 to Aberaeron.

	TC5​	TC5​	TC5​	TC5​	TC5​	TC5​	550​	TC5​	TC5
Fishguard Harbour	-​	-​	09:38​	12:38​	15:38​	-​	18:38	20:38	22:38
Goodwick Town Centre	-​	07:41​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Fishguard Town Hall arr.	-​	07:47​	09:45​	12:45​	15:45​	-​	18:45​	20:45​	22:45
Fishguard Town Hall dep.	-​	07:50​	09:48​	12:48​	15:48​	-​	18:48​	20:48​	22:48
Cardigan Finch Square arr.	-​	08:30​	10:28​	13:28​	16:28​	-​	19:28​	21:28​	23:28
Cardigan Finch Square dep.	07:15​	08:36​	10:36​	13:36​	16:36​	18:36​	19:36​	-​	-​
Aberporth	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	19:55	-​	-​
New Quay	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	20:26	-​	-​
Aberaeron Alban Square arr.	07:57​	09:18​	11:18​	14:18​	17:18​	19:18​	20:45	-​	-​
Aberaeron Alban Square dep.	08:00​	09:21​	11:21​	14:21​	17:21​	19:21​	20:51​	-​	-​
Aberystwyth arr.	08:40​	09:58​	11:58​	14:58​	17:58​	19:58​	21:28​	-​	-​
Aberystwyth dep.	08:45​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Penglais Campus	08:50​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Llanbardan Campus	08:55​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​

	TC5​	TC5​	TC5​	TC5​	TC5​	TC5​	550​
Aberystwyth dep.	-​	07:15​	10:15​	13:15​	16:05​	18:15​	20:45​
Penglais Campus	-​	-​	-​	-​	16:10​	-​	-​
Llanbardan Campus	-​	-​	-​	-​	16:15​	-​	-​
Aberaeron Alban Square arr.	-​	07:52​	10:52​	13:52​	16:52​	18:52​	21:22​
Aberaeron Alban Square dep.	-​	07:55​	10:55​	13:55​	16:55​	18:55​	21:29​
New Quay	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	21:45​
Aberporth	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	22:14​
Cardigan Finch Square arr.	06:50​	08:37​	11:37​	14:37​	17:37​	19:37​	22:35​
Cardigan Finch Square dep.	06:52​	08:43​	11:43​	14:43​	17:43​	19:43​	-​
Fishguard Town Hall arr.	07:32​	09:23​	12:23​	15:23​	18:23​	19:23​	-​
Fishguard Town Hall dep.	07:35​	09:26​	12:26​	15:26​	18:26​	20:26​	-​
Goodwick Town Centre	07:40​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Fishguard Harbour arr.	-​	09:33​	12:33​	15:33​	18:33​	20:33​	-​

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 13 Feb 2021 ==

With the bus services established, here is the connecting Fishguard rail service that I would use as the basis for the Pembrokeshire timetable. Some of the sectional running times used I drew from memory so this may not be entirely accurate. I would envisage that the xx:14 departure from Clarbeston Road to Swansea would be a regular hourly fixture with the service running to/from Milford Haven in the hours not shown below. This would provide Milford Haven with an hourly service except for gaps around 07:50, 09:50, 15:50, 18:50 and 20:50 which I would fill with express Cardiff services using the same pattern as the Fishguard boat trains except that west of Whitland they would call at Haverfordwest and Milford Haven (and maybe Johnston) only instead of the two Fishguard stations. East of Carmarthen, this Cardiff service would be hourly.

Ferry arrive

​

​

​

11:15​

​

​

​

​

21:25​

Fishguard Harbour

-​

06:18​

07:53

09:53​

13:02​

-​

15:53

18:53​

20:53​

23:02​

-​

-​

Fishguard & Goodwick

-​

06:21​

07:56

09:56

13:05​

-​

15:56​

18:56

20:56

23:05​

-​

-​

Clarbeston Road

-​

06:39​

08:14​

10:14​

-​

-​

16:14​

19:14​

21:14​

-​

-​

-​

Clunderwen

-​

06:46​

08:21

10:21

-​

-​

16:21​

19:21​

21:21

-​

-​

-​

Pembroke Dock

05:45​

-​

-​

-​

-​

13:15​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

15:50​

Tenby arr.

06:15​

-​

-​

-​

-​

13:44​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

15:20​

Tenby dep.

06:18​

-​

-​

-​

-​

13:50​

-​

-​

-​

-​

16:10​

15:26​

Whitland arr.

06:47

06:53

08:28

10:28

13:35​

14:19

16:28​

19:28​

21:28​

23:35​

16:33​

15:55​

Whitland dep.

06:56​

06:56

08:29​

10:29​

13:36​

14:56​

16:29​

19:29​

21:29​

23:36​

-​

-​

St. Clears

07:05​

07:05

-​

-​

-​

15:05​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

Carmarthen arr.

07:14​

07:14

08:44​

10:44​

13:51​

15:14​

16:44​

19:44​

21:44​

23:51​

-​

-​

Carmarthen dep.

07:17​

07:17​

08:47​

10:47​

13:54​

15:17​

16:47​

19:47​

21:47​

23:54​

-​

-​

Ferryside

07:27​

07:27​

-​

-​

-​

15:27​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

Kidwelly

07:32​

07:32​

-​

-​

-​

15:32​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

Pembrey & Burry Port

07:37​

07:37​

09:05​

11:05​

-​

15:37​

17:05​

20:05​

22:05​

-​

-​

-​

Llanelli arr.

07:42​

07:42​

09:10​

11:10​

14:16​

15:42​

17:10​

20:10​

22:10​

00:16​

-​

-​

Llanelli dep.

07:43​

07:43​

09:11​

11:11​

14:17​

15:43​

17:11​

20:11​

22:11​

00:17​

-​

-​

Gowerton

07:50​

07:50​

09:18​

11:18​

-​

15:50​

17:18​

20:18​

22:18​

-​

-​

-​

Swansea High Street

08:01​

08:01​

09:29​

11:29​

-​

16:01​

17:29​

20:29​

22:29​

-​

-​

Tawe Valley Parkway

-​

-​

-​

-​

????​

-​

-​

-​

-​

????​

Port Talbot Parkway

-​

-​

-​

-​

14:47​

-​

-​

-​

-​

00:47​

Bridgend

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

-​

Cardiff Central

-​

-​

-​

-​

15:17​

-​

-​

-​

-​

01:17​

Cardiff Central	-​	-​	-​	09:53​	-​	-​	-​	-​	19:53​
Bridgend	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Port Talbot Parkway	-​	-​	-​	10:23​	-​	-​	-​	-​	20:23​	-​
Tawe Valley Parkway	-​	-​	-​	????​	-​	-​	-​	-​	????​	-​
Swansea High Street	-​	-​	07:41​	-​	12:11​	13:41​	16:41​	18:41​	-​	-​
Gowerton	-​	-​	07:52​	-​	12:22​	13:52​	16:52​	18:52​	-​	-​
Llanelli arr.	-​	-​	07:59​	10:53​	12:29​	13:59​	16:59​	18:59​	20:53​	-​
Llanelli dep.	-​	-​	08:00​	10:54​	12:30​	14:00​	17:00​	19:00​	20:54​	-​
Pembrey & Burry Port	-​	-​	08:06​	-​	12:36​	14:06​	17:06​	19:06​	-​	-​
Kidwelly	-​	-​	-​	-​	12:41​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Ferryside	-​	-​	-​	-​	12:46​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Carmarthen arr.	-​	-​	08:24​	11:16​	12:56​	14:24​	17:24​	19:24​	21:16​	-​
Carmarthen dep.	05:17​	06:27	08:27	11:19​	12:59​	14:27​	17:27​	19:27​	21:19​	-​
St. Clears	-​	-​	-​	-​	13:08​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Whitland arr.	05:32​	06:42	08:42	11:34​	13:17​	14:42​	17:42	19:42​	21:34​	-​
Whitland dep.	05:33​	06:43	08:43	11:35	13:18​	14:43	17:43	19:43	21:35​	15:43​
Tenby arr.​	-​	-​	-​	-​	13:47​	-​	-​	-​	-​	16:06​
Tenby dep.​	-​	-​	-​	-​	13:50​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Pembroke Dock​	-​	-​	-​	-​	14:19​	-​	-​	-​	-​	-​
Clunderwen	05:40​	06:50	08:50	-​	-​	14:50	17:50	19:50	-​	-​
Clarbeston Road	05:47​	06:57	08:57	-​	-​	14:57	17:57	19:57	-​	-​
Fishguard & Goodwick	06:05​	07:15	09:15	12:05​	-​	15:15	18:15	20:15	22:05​	-​
Fishguard Harbour	06:08​	07:18	09:18	12:08	-​	15:18	18:18	20:18	22:08	-​
Ferry depart	​	​	​	13:10​	​	​	​	​	23:45​

Whitland to Tenby is timed at approx 29 mins stopping Narberth, Kilgetty and Saundersfoot.
With some creative timings, could the future split at Swansea remain attached and both trains continue to Whitland and split. One carrying on to Milford Haven and the other running non stop to Tenby and back to Whitland, then continuing on to Carmarthen or Swansea to attach to the next North service? Without the stops between Whitland and Tenby should save enough time to turn back and get to Whitland within an hour.

Would that work?
It could compliment the Swansea/Carmarthen - Pembroke stopper and provide an additional couple of services with a direct link from the North and SWML during the peak summer months to Tenby.

If you want to detach from a Milford/Fishguard service in one direction and attach onto one on the way back then it isn't just getting to Tenby and back within the hour you need to worry about. You also need to get back to Whitland at the right time for the 'main line service' to be passing and I don't think you can do that. I've added a few Pembroke Dock services to my Fishguard timetable above to try and illustrate the issues.

 

[Caaardiff]

If you want to detach from a Milford/Fishguard service in one direction and attach onto one on the way back then it isn't just getting to Tenby and back within the hour you need to worry about. You also need to get back to Whitland at the right time for the 'main line service' to be passing and I don't think you can do that. I've added a few Pembroke Dock services to my Fishguard timetable above to try and illustrate the issues.

The attachment would be at Carmarthen or Swansea, to go along with the long term plans to split/attach the 197s at Swansea. The unit can wait until the next service coming through arrives without blocking any lines.

 

[backontrack]

The thing is: aside from Whitland/Tenby/Pembroke/Dock, there are three small towns on the line: Narberth, Saundersfoot and Manorbier. All of these places have some degree of tourist potential.

But their railway stations are really far away from the settlements themselves - the latter two especially. This hardly incentivises train travel, does it now? It's a miracle Tenby's is so central, the way the others are so distant.

 

[Anonymous10]

The thing is: aside from Whitland/Tenby/Pembroke/Dock, there are three small towns on the line: Narberth, Saundersfoot and Manorbier. All of these places have some degree of tourist potential.

But their railway stations are really far away from the settlements themselves - the latter two especially. This hardly incentivises train travel, does it now? It's a miracle Tenby's is so central, the way the others are so distant.

it needs to be remembered Saundersfoot is only a 25 minute walk from the village i do say only in a rather wierd way but the walk is actually very scenic and very enjoyable i have seen many tourists do it as it can take 15-20 to find somewhere to park and would rather enjoy the scenery and i would hardly call manorbier a town its more a small village but we digress i believe its usage warants a better service as most dont use it due to the lack of service

 

[Rhydgaled]

I think Saundersfoot station is closer by rail to Kilgetty station (which IS within the town/village it serves) than it is by road to Saundersfoot town/village. If I recall correctly there is also quite a height difference between Saundersfoot (down next to the beach) and its station (at the top of the hill) so could be quite a strenuous walk between the two.

There really isn't much near Saundersfoot station at all. An idea I had a while back was to close Saundersfoot station and have the TOC provide/subsidise a bus service between Kilgetty and Tenby via Saundersfoot on which rail tickets to/from Saundersfoot would be valid.

 

[Bald Rick]

I think Saundersfoot station is closer by rail to Kilgetty station (which IS within the town/village it serves) than it is by road to Saundersfoot town/village. If I recall correctly there is also quite a height difference between Saundersfoot (down next to the beach) and its station (at the top of the hill) so could be quite a strenuous walk between the two.

There really isn't much near Saundersfoot station at all. An idea I had a while back was to close Saundersfoot station and have the TOC provide/subsidise a bus service between Kilgetty and Tenby via Saundersfoot on which rail tickets to/from Saundersfoot would be valid.

Saundersfoot station is both closer, and lower, than Kilgetty. It’s still up a big hill though. Anyone who has walked from Tenby Harbour to Saundersfoot Harbour via the Coast path will tell you how hilly that part of the world is (you do about 1000 ft of ascent and descent in about 4 miles).

It would need to be a small bus too, as the rail over road bridges to get into Saundersfoot are low and arched.

 

[Rhydgaled]

Saundersfoot station is both closer, and lower, than Kilgetty. It’s still up a big hill though. Anyone who has walked from Tenby Harbour to Saundersfoot Harbour via the Coast path will tell you how hilly that part of the world is (you do about 1000 ft of ascent and descent in about 4 miles).

It would need to be a small bus too, as the rail over road bridges to get into Saundersfoot are low and arched.

There are existing bus services (before COVID anyway, not sure if they're still going) between Kilgetty and Tenby via Saundersfoot, but I don't remember them passing Saundersfoot station so, to minimise costs by using existing services where possible, I suggested buses running from Kilgetty station rather than Saundersfoot. I probably have walked the section of the coast path in question, as I have walked most of the Pembrokeshire coast path, but in the other direction. It certainly is hard work with lots of climbing so, although from Saundersfoot it is a shorter walk to Saundersfoot station than to Kilgetty, I considered that Saundersfoot station is probably too strenuous a walk to be of value.

 

[Anonymous10]

There are existing bus services (before COVID anyway, not sure if they're still going) between Kilgetty and Tenby via Saundersfoot, but I don't remember them passing Saundersfoot station so, to minimise costs by using existing services where possible, I suggested buses running from Kilgetty station rather than Saundersfoot. I probably have walked the section of the coast path in question, as I have walked most of the Pembrokeshire coast path, but in the other direction. It certainly is hard work with lots of climbing so, although from Saundersfoot it is a shorter walk to Saundersfoot station than to Kilgetty, I considered that Saundersfoot station is probably too strenuous a walk to be of value.

I've used one which does believe the one going to pentlepoir does also granted it's a long way up but my experience wasnt that it was steep not after the very start