New national restrictions in Scotland

[221129]

Meetings. She should try Zoom. It's terrible, but it might give her some insight into why work-from-home isn't working for the rest of the population

Do as I say, not as I do. I also noticed one of her own party got into bother yesterday having traveled from the central belt to the highlands repeatedly.

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

Do as I say, not as I do. I also noticed one of her own party got into bother yesterday having traveled from the central belt to the highlands repeatedly.

Of course that wasn't mentioned at today's Daily Show.

She has also been spotted in a lift with a colleague in the Scottish Parliament buildings, even though the Scottish Government (i.e. her own) guidance says "lifts should only be used by disabled people, for essential purposes, or on a one person per lift basis".

 

[221129]

Of course that wasn't mentioned at today's Daily Show.

She has also been spotted in a lift with a colleague in the Scottish Parliament buildings, even though the Scottish Government (i.e. her own) guidance says "lifts should only be used by disabled people, for essential purposes, or on a one person per lift basis".

Lets not forget her face mask blunder as well!

 

[najaB]

I would assume you won't be privy to the day-to-day activities of Ms Sturgeon, but what kinds of activities are you referring to, that she might do daily, that require her physical attendance in Edinburgh?

Obviously I don't have access to her diary, but it is almost certain that whatever she has to do the communications and IT infrastructure will be superior at her office than it will be at any other location.

Was it appropriate for her to visit the Western General Hospital, which was in level 3 at the time of her visit, to see "preparations for the vaccine rollout"? Because it seemed to me like just a photo-op.

That's debatable, but Health is a devolved matter and her responsibility so it does fall under her remit. Did she have to visit in person? Quite possibly not, but she certainly wasn't stepping out of her lane to do so.

 

[92002]

You mean the same as Nicola Sturgeon does every day? It is allowed in law to travel between England and Scotland and around Scotland for work purposes. So he didn't commit any offences.

Nobody in Scotland is allowed to travel between Scotland and England. In addition nobody is allowed to leave their local council area. The restrictions are in Scottish law and are enforced by fines. It will be for the Procurator Fiscal to decide if it was a valid work purpose. Which clearly it appears it was not.

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

Obviously I don't have access to her diary, but it is almost certain that whatever she has to do the communications and IT infrastructure will be superior at her office than it will be at any other location.

I think that probably goes for a lot of other workers who are currently legally required to work from home at the moment? Why is Ms Sturgeon any different?

(before someone brings up "oh what about UK briefings" - 1) they're not daily, 2) Boris Johnson lives there, 3) there's no legal mandate to work from home in England)

That's debatable, but Health is a devolved matter and her responsibility so it does fall under her remit. Did she have to visit in person? Quite possibly not, but she certainly wasn't stepping out of her lane to do so.

Perfect, so Boris Johnson wasn't out of his line to visit a vaccine-production factory yesterday either, which will provide supplies to the UK (and the rest of the world).

 

[221129]

Nobody in Scotland is allowed to travel between Scotland and England.

You say this,

It will be for the Procurator Fiscal to decide if it was a valid work purpose.

But then say this. So which is it? You either are allowed to travel for a set of defined reasons or you can't.

 

[XAM2175]

Would Sturgeon not be staying at Bute House in Edinburgh most of the time?

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

Would Sturgeon not be staying at Bute House in Edinburgh most of the time?

As I understand it she is chauffeured from Uddingston. Any TV interviews seem to be done from there too, unless Bute House has a bonnie garden and conservatory!

 

[najaB]

Would Sturgeon not be staying at Bute House in Edinburgh most of the time?

I believe it's undergoing renovations - or at least it was at the time of the first lockdown. She had mentioned in an interview that it was okay for workmen to be there repairing a ceiling because there was nobody living there currently.

Perfect, so Boris Johnson wasn't out of his line to visit a vaccine-production factory yesterday either, which will provide supplies to the UK (and the rest of the world).

Had that been the only place he visited then you might make that argument. But it was not.

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

Had that been the only place he visited then you might make that argument. But it was not.

Ah yes, he visited the Queen Elizabeth Hospital in Glasgow too, which processes PCR tests for the UK.

I don't see an issue with that either? If Scotland was independent we wouldn't be processing tests for England.

 

[devon_metro]

Nobody in Scotland is allowed to travel between Scotland and England. In addition nobody is allowed to leave their local council area. The restrictions are in Scottish law and are enforced by fines. It will be for the Procurator Fiscal to decide if it was a valid work purpose. Which clearly it appears it was not.

This is not true. There are various valid reasons for leaving Scotland or your council area.

As for Boris, he probably should not have travelled so he could maintain the highground over hypocrite Sturgeon, however he did. He was clearly on official government business, so is clearly working. Remember, the policy of the government of the United Kingdom is to maintain the union, therefore is he is campaigning for the union, it is official government work. The Scottish Government likes to use this line frequently when using government time/money for promoting independence. From what I saw, he visiting a UK testing lab and observed the UK armed forces assisting with the vaccine effort. In addition, as the Scottish government is currently screwing up the vaccine distribution, you could probably argue the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom has a valid reason to be on the ground finding out why.

 

[bramling]

This is not true. There are various valid reasons for leaving Scotland or your council area.

As for Boris, he probably should not have travelled so he could maintain the highground over hypocrite Sturgeon, however he did. He was clearly on official government business, so is clearly working. Remember, the policy of the government of the United Kingdom is to maintain the union, therefore is he is campaigning for the union, it is official government work. The Scottish Government likes to use this line frequently when using government time/money for promoting independence. From what I saw, he visiting a UK testing lab and observed the UK armed forces assisting with the vaccine effort. In addition, as the Scottish government is currently screwing up the vaccine distribution, you could probably argue the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom has a valid reason to be on the ground finding out why.

I agree with all that. Of course, Sturgeon has a number of reasons to wish to deflect attention away from herself at the present time, one of which being the Salmond debacle.

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

I found this on Twitter: https://twitter.com/DanMcC1990/status/1354747687220994053?s=20

I went toe-to-toe with an SNP supporter on Radio Scotland who tried to argue that Sturgeon travelling to Edinburgh to meet staff at the Western General in December was okay, but the Prime Minister meeting frontline staff in Scotland is wrong. Nationalist hypocrisy at its best!

(Audio clip)

Sums Scottish nationalism up quite well. It's ok for Nicola Sturgeon to go to a hospital for a photo-op because "I have a preference for her".

 

[najaB]

From what I saw, he visiting a UK testing lab and observed the UK armed forces assisting with the vaccine effort. In addition, as the Scottish government is currently screwing up the vaccine distribution, you could probably argue the Prime Minister of the United Kingdom has a valid reason to be on the ground finding out why.

Which is why I noted above that it's debatable if the visit breached the law or not. The first visit definitely was in his remit, the second is borderline (the armed forces are in his remit, health is not) and the last point should be the subject of four-nations discussions, rather than him getting personally involved.

 

[devon_metro]

Which is why I noted above that it's debatable if the visit breached the law or not. The first visit definitely was in his remit, the second is borderline (the armed forces are in his remit, health is not) and the last point should be the subject of four-nations discussions, rather than him getting personally involved.

But ultimately the UKG is still responsible as the Westminster parliament is sovereign. It could choose to legislate on health matters if it saw fit. Nationalists are free to argue this is wrong (and most unionists would also agree it should not interfere in devolved matters), but as things stand, Scotland is not independent. Therefore I think any argument of the Prime Minister of a sovereign nation visiting a part of said nation as being illegal is folly. FM of Scotland, Wales or N.I. has no jurisdiction over England, so the same argument would not apply. Personally, I think Sturgeon probably has a case for traveling to Edinburgh for government business, but it's the hypocrisy that I disagree with. She should also consider staying in Edinburgh during the week to minimise travel.

 

[najaB]

Therefore I think any argument of the Prime Minister of a sovereign nation visiting a part of said nation as being illegal is folly.

The issue isn't that the PM left England but that he entered Scotland when there was a law, passed by the Scottish parliament that (ostensibly) made it illegal for him to do so.

The Scottish legal system is separate to the English and Welsh one, so it seems that he could be prosecuted in Scotland for violating Scottish law.

She should also consider staying in Edinburgh during the week to minimise travel.

That I agree with.

 

[221129]

violating Scottish law

But he didn't. So no he couldn't.

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

The issue isn't that the PM left England but that he entered Scotland when there was a law, passed by the Scottish parliament that (ostensibly) made it illegal for him to do so.

sigh

It is also illegal to leave your own local authority in Scotland without reasonable excuse.

If travelling for work purposes is a reasonable excuse for Nicola Sturgeon to travel between Uddingston (South Lanarkshire) and Edinburgh (LA in its own right) almost daily, then why is it not a good enough reason for Boris Johnson to travel between London and the central belt on a one off occasion?

 

[najaB]

But he didn't. So no he couldn't.

That depends on if the procurator fiscal believes that he had a valid reason to cross the border.

 

[devon_metro]

The issue isn't that the PM left England but that he entered Scotland when there was a law, passed by the Scottish parliament that (ostensibly) made it illegal for him to do so.

But it is legal for people to enter Scotland for a host of reasons, including work. The legislation reflects this. The police are not going to prosecute the Prime Minister. There are plenty of more valid (and harmful) violations of the rules that the police and/or Scottish Government should be focussing on than the visit of the head of state. We should also remember that Police Scotland facilitated his visit with armed escorts etc., so I assume they would need to refer themselves if they were to then seek prosecution.

 

[317 forever]

During heatwaves, should we also walk like an Egyptian?

Yes we should at any time of year. It means we can hear my favourite song of the 80s.

 

[najaB]

There are plenty of more valid (and harmful) violations of the rules that the police and/or Scottish Government should be focussing on than the visit of the head of state. We should also remember that Police Scotland facilitated his visit with armed escorts etc., so I assume they would need to refer themselves if they were to then seek prosecution.

I agree it's highly unlikely that anything will come of it.

Edit: Re the Police Scotland comment - only if Police Scotland encouraged his visit. Once they were aware than he was coming they would be obligated to provide security since he is, after all, the PM.

 

[HSTEd]

There are plenty of more valid (and harmful) violations of the rules that the police and/or Scottish Government should be focussing on than the visit of the head of state.

Quick note, Boris Johnson is not the Head of State, he is the Head of Government.

 

[greyman42]

That depends on if the procurator fiscal believes that he had a valid reason to cross the border.

Do you seriously believe it would ever come to the attention of the procurator fiscal?

 

[najaB]

Do you seriously believe it would ever come to the attention of the procurator fiscal?

Apparently several people have made reports to Police Scotland, so it's not beyond the realms of possibility. Unlikely, but possible.

Police receive complaints about Boris Johnson's trip to Scotland

POLICE Scotland has received complaints about Boris Johnson’s trip to Scotland, it has been confirmed.

www.thenational.scot

 

[Stathern Jc]

The National hardly seems to be the most objective of publications to rely on the content of.
Its' headlines often look more like "The Vitriol"

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

From the BBC Live Feed

Ms Sturgeon explains tomorrow's statement will outline other measures to keep the virus under control, even when restrictions begin to ease.

The first minister points out: "The current lockdown is working."

She says we should all be encouraged by the latest figures, but adds the caveat that case numbers are still too high.

Further hotel quarantine measures I expect. But what other arbitrary rules do we reckon could be announced?

 

[najaB]

The National hardly seems to be the most objective of publications to rely on the content of.

I agree completely where opinion is concerned, but for a matter of fact - that complaints have been made - it's as reliable as any other.

 

[Journeyman]

The National hardly seems to be the most objective of publications to rely on the content of.
Its' headlines often look more like "The Vitriol"

Good old McPravda.