New lockdown in England, including school closures, announced by Johnson, 4/1/21

[bramling]

The current BBC website headline is saying "Too early to tell if lockdown will end in spring"

I'm pretty sure that spring lasts from March until June. I can asure Johnson that my lockdown will be enfing either in or before spring.

Yes I’m picking up a rather concerning vibe that some people clearly are pushing for this to be extended right through the year. Note how the schools going back seems to now have gently moved to “Easter”, so that in practice means start of summer term (thus even more damaging for exams than last year).

This is the problem with the line they’ve taken, there’s no obvious exit strategy that’s going to pacify the lockdown enthusiasts until *everyone* has been vaccinated, by which time they will probably be claiming that those vaccinated early will need re-vaccinating or something.

I am increasingly and reluctantly coming to the view that this isn’t going to end without some form of showdown. It’s true what’s been posted here that furlough is pacifying many, whilst the work from homes and those with ulterior political objectives are driving this, taking advantage of a spineless government.

 

[Controller1701]

No, I need to repeat it as that's the case. No need for any discussions, I'm afraid. Kids need school, full stop! As for two week closure before Christmas local school near enough was, didn't change anything, still kept it closed. The wider implications seem very overstated to me as I put earlier what difference does it make if kids pick it up anyway? Quite a few around here have and not had any detrimental affect on anyone else. Instead of going on about they'll be thousands of deaths we need to get a grip on reality and stop treating this like impending Armageddon.

I take it from this comment about children needing school that you support the following measures

1 - Reduce the summer holidays from six weeks to at the most one week, the Christmas holiday goes from Christmas Eve to the 2nd of January, the only time off for Easter is Good Friday to Easter Monday, and all half term holidays removed (Allows the children to spend more time in school as they need school)
2 - Compulsory lessons on both Saturday and Sunday (Gives the children more time in the schools they need)
3 - The school day extended from 07:00 to 18:00 each day (That gives a few extra hours of the needed school time for Children)
4 - Any removal of children during the new legally mandated term times (See note 1) results not in a fine, but a custodial sentence and children being made a ward of the state (This will ensure that they receive all this school that is needed as you state)

 

[tommy2215]

This is absurd. There is no other way to put it. The Government are intentionally trying to spread fear, hopelessness and despair among the population so they face little opposition to continuing lockdown. Pushing the lockdown for so long will give lots of fuel to conspiracy theories and undermine confidence in the vaccine.

 

[Darandio]

I take it from this comment about children needing school that you support the following measures

1 - Reduce the summer holidays from six weeks to at the most one week, the Christmas holiday goes from Christmas Eve to the 2nd of January, the only time off for Easter is Good Friday to Easter Monday, and all half term holidays removed (Allows the children to spend more time in school as they need school)
2 - Compulsory lessons on both Saturday and Sunday (Gives the children more time in the schools they need)
3 - The school day extended from 07:00 to 18:00 each day (That gives a few extra hours of the needed school time for Children)
4 - Any removal of children during the new legally mandated term times (See note 1) results not in a fine, but a custodial sentence and children being made a ward of the state (This will ensure that they receive all this school that is needed as you state)

Now you are being stupid. Was that some facetious way of saying kids don't need school?

 

[joncombe]

This is absurd. There is no other way to put it. The Government are intentionally trying to spread fear, hopelessness and despair among the population so they face little opposition to continuing lockdown. Pushing the lockdown for so long will give lots of fuel to conspiracy theories and undermine confidence in the vaccine.

Of course. That much was obvious with the latest Whitty-backed campaign which was essentially "if you go out people will die".

 

[yorksrob]

Yes I’m picking up a rather concerning vibe that some people clearly are pushing for this to be extended right through the year. Note how the schools going back seems to now have gently moved to “Easter”, so that in practice means start of summer term (thus even more damaging for exams than last year).

This is the problem with the line they’ve taken, there’s no obvious exit strategy that’s going to pacify the lockdown enthusiasts until *everyone* has been vaccinated, by which time they will probably be claiming that those vaccinated early will need re-vaccinating or something.

I am increasingly and reluctantly coming to the view that this isn’t going to end without some form of showdown. It’s true what’s been posted here that furlough is pacifying many, whilst the work from homes and those with ulterior political objectives are driving this, taking advantage of a spineless government.

I made the mistake of reading the comments on the BBC website just now.

We get the Governments we deserve.

 

[Bantamzen]

If our leaders were rational thinkers or remotely sane they would take this approach. But we are ruled by dictatorial maniacs, and they won't avoid a chance to keep us locked away for as long as possible. They don't care about the economic or mental effects of their measures. So even though the cure is definitely worse than the illness, they will continue it. I too suspect that we will not leave lockdown until May at the earliest and I suspect the tier restrictions are here to stay for another year at least. Yes there will be nothing left, but remember that nothing matters except Covid.

But they do care about money. And when all of a sudden there's nothing there to get them votes, they will sit up and take notice.

 

[joncombe]

Let me put this bluntly, we cannot afford to keep everything shut. We are already over half a trillion further into public spending deficit, over 800,000 jobs have been sunk and millions more are on a knife edge. And those lost jobs and furloughed staff mean lost tax revenue, money that is needed to plug the massive deficit which is now the same or even more than GDP (which will likely sink).

I used to believe this, people were saying this back in April last year, and through the summer and the autumn. As you demonstrate it's still being said now, but sadly I don't see any evidence of it coming true. At least months ago we had people like the chancellor expressing concern about this. Now he has gone very quiet, which is ominous.

 

[bramling]

I made the mistake of reading the comments on the BBC website just now.

We get the Governments we deserve.

I was reading a similar one discussing masks last night, mainly talking about masks on trains.

Reading some of the associated “have your say” comments - all I can say is wow.

“I bet these people who don’t wear masks are the sort of people who don’t wash their hands after going to the toilet, so you can bet they have the virus”. This is the sort of mentality we are now up against.

 

[6862]

But they do care about money. And when all of a sudden there's nothing there to get them votes, they will sit up and take notice.

They'll just cancel elections, giving the usual reason that it's not safe.

 

[bramling]

They'll just cancel elections, giving the usual reason that it's not safe.

The trouble is elections aren’t even on the radar at the moment. Local elections don’t really matter that much (and as you say they can be deferred), but there’s no general election until 2024. Firstly that’s far enough away not to be too high on anyone’s priority list (unless perhaps you’re a Conservative MP with a marginal seat), and secondly it’s simply not an issue for Boris as he will be long gone by then, back to writing funny magazine articles seeing how many people he can insult.

The only thing we can really do at the moment is ensure MPs are made aware of feelings, especially those in marginal seats. I wonder if it might even be worth writing to the likes of Steve Baker or Graham Brady. The latter would be where any “men in grey coats” movement emanates.

 

[HSTEd]

Ultimately continuous lockdown for the next four years is in the Conservative partys electoral interests.
The only thing that matters is to increase the number of old people who get there.

They can crush the winter flu peaks for the next few years if they keep this up.

 

[Bantamzen]

I used to believe this, people were saying this back in April last year, and through the summer and the autumn. As you demonstrate it's still being said now, but sadly I don't see any evidence of it coming true. At least months ago we had people like the chancellor expressing concern about this. Now he has gone very quiet, which is ominous.

While its true the pro-lockdown crowd are still getting their way, no Tory government can stand free spending and paying for people sitting around doing nothing for too long. Its way too engrained into Conservative thinking for this to go on for much longer. Rumours from No.11 are that when the Chancellor found out the extent & cost of furlough back in September he hit the roof. Well we have several more months under our belt at an average cost of around £30 billion a month (for context the NHS budget for 2019-20 was £141 billion). There may not be signs on the surface, but believe me pressure will be mounting rapidly.

They'll just cancel elections, giving the usual reason that it's not safe.

Well the US managed it under Trump, so they'd have to have an amazing excuse to get away with it here.

 

[MikeWM]

The only thing we can really do at the moment is ensure MPs are made aware of feelings, especially those in marginal seats. I wonder if it might even be worth writing to the likes of Steve Baker or Graham Brady. The latter would be where any “men in grey coats” movement emanates.

I'm not sure about Baker - he makes the right noises, but doesn't seem to be good at following through when it comes to actually voting.

I've been impressed by Brady recently though (along with Desmond Swayne and Charles Walker and one or two others).

 

[Domh245]

Well we have several more months under our belt at an average cost of around £30 billion a month (for context the NHS budget for 2019-20 was £141 billion).

and there's no end in sight either :/

Rishi Sunak set to extend Covid-19 furlough scheme past April

Rishi Sunak is reportedly set to extend the government's flagship furlough scheme beyond the end of April in his 3 March Budget.

www.cityam.com

Rishi Sunak is reportedly set to extend the government’s furlough scheme beyond the end of April in his 3 March Budget.

The chancellor is drawing up plans to extend the £82bn scheme into the summer as the UK looks set to have strict Covid restrictions in place for several months.

Read more: Rishi Sunak mulls over a UK corporation tax hike in March Budget


The scheme, which sees the government pay up to 80 per cent of wages up to £2,500 a month, was originally supposed to end last October.

The UK’s Covid cases are steadily falling, however deaths are at their highest ever point as the UK rolls out the Pfizer and AstraZeneca vaccines.

Foreign secretary Dominic Raab said on Sunday that he hoped the England Covid lockdown could be eased by March, while media reports on Monday speculated that stringent conditions could be in place until May.

A source close to Sunak told Bloomberg that “support for jobs isn’t going to end” while most businesses cannot open and that the chancellor is likely to extend the furlough scheme beyond April.


It comes days after the CBI and the British Chambers of Commerce, two of the UK’s largest business groups, called for an extension of Sunak’s furlough scheme.

CBI director-general Tony Danker said: “The government must once again stand shoulder-to-shoulder with businesses to underwrite support for the duration, helping viable enterprises to last the course.”

Mayor of London Sadiq Khan also backed the call for an extension of the furlough scheme and an extension of the business rates holiday past March.

“Current plans to end the business rates holiday in March and then the furlough scheme in April create a huge financial cliff edge for employers,” Khan said.

“Without the certainty that support will remain in place for as long as it is needed, many more businesses could decide to cut their losses and close permanently now.”

 

[HSTEd]

More subsidy heroin for zombie businesses.

 

[joncombe]

and there's no end in sight either :/

Rishi Sunak set to extend Covid-19 furlough scheme past April

Rishi Sunak is reportedly set to extend the government's flagship furlough scheme beyond the end of April in his 3 March Budget.

www.cityam.com

Yes all the hall marks of a reapeat of 2020.

Most restrictions in place until summer and even then continue with Track and Trace, Masks, Quarantine (and now Covid test too), social distancing etc. Then we get to the autumn and "we'd better not reduce restrictions at a time when the NHS will be under pressure". And so it continues until the public wakes up and realises the only way restrictions will end is if there there is wide spread ignoring of them, by the public and businesses alike. Unfortunately with most of the public seemingly wanting more and more restrictions, nothing is going to change soon.

 

[kristiang85]

Ah, meanwhile those of us who work normally continue to fund the goverment's hush money to make sure the majority of the vocal public are happy with this situation...

 

[abn444]

Ultimately continuous lockdown for the next four years is in the Conservative partys electoral interests.
The only thing that matters is to increase the number of old people who get there.

They can crush the winter flu peaks for the next few years if they keep this up.

That's a pretty blinkered view given there's quite a few older people who realise they don't have much time left anyway and don't want to waste what's left in lockdowns (plus its quite blinkered to think only old people vote Conservative) while there's quite a few younger Labour supporters who support these restrictions and actually want even more, people who are never going to vote Tory no matter what they do

 

[bramling]

More subsidy heroin for zombie businesses.

It’s not just zombie businesses but zombie people. We now seem to have a subset who are happy to live a life of doing little more than walk around the block, days out to the garden centre / supermarket / B&Q, or down to the town centre to sit on a bench drinking takeaway coffee.

Never underestimate how much some people are content with this existence. All the more so when the most intrusive restrictions are eased and they can drive wherever they like without the (even now remote) possibility of being questioned by the police.

 

[Bantamzen]

and there's no end in sight either :/

Rishi Sunak set to extend Covid-19 furlough scheme past April

Rishi Sunak is reportedly set to extend the government's flagship furlough scheme beyond the end of April in his 3 March Budget.

www.cityam.com

Quite honestly I don't believe that Sunak would be so easily extending it, especially not before the budget. It may be there are pressures on him to do so, but frankly I don't think even a Chancellor in this joke of a government would be doing something so reckless this far out.

 

[chris11256]

The problem is that it's probably the right call. How can furlough be removed while the government is still dictating what can & can't open and what we can & can't do. It can realistically only be removed when there's a definite timeline for proper reopening, not tiers.

 

[Freightmaster]

Would be amazed at this point if a pub or restaurant opens this year. I did think that restrictions would completely end in April 2022, now I think it’s more likely lockdown will end then and restrictions in April 2023.

You honestly think that will will be in a lockdown (i.e. schools/shops/hairdressers/etc closed,
no holidays permitted within in the UK, no meeting up with friends/family indoors and so on)
for a further 14 months??!!

I don't think anyone in this country other than most extreme of the Zero Covid maniacs would
tolerate 14 weeks, never mind 14 months...






MARK

 

[Class 33]

and there's no end in sight either :/

Rishi Sunak set to extend Covid-19 furlough scheme past April

Rishi Sunak is reportedly set to extend the government's flagship furlough scheme beyond the end of April in his 3 March Budget.

www.cityam.com

Jesus Christ. This is unbelievable. Absolutely beyond a joke now this is.

 

[Mag_seven]

or down to the town centre to sit on a bench drinking takeaway coffee.

I have to confess I did that today, but I'm glad to report I'm not on furlough so please don't have a go.

 

[Class 33]

Yet another Downing Street News Conference in a mo. This one with Priti Patel. Am not expecting anything positive in this one. I can bet she'll be saying "We are at a critical point right now...." and ordering us that we must still keep sticking to the restrictions!

 

[Mintona]

I have absolutely no desire to see restrictions in place any longer than necessary. I’m just guessing at what the government will do, considering that nothing except covid counts for anything these days.

 

[joncombe]

Yet another Downing Street News Conference in a mo. This one with Priti Patel. Am not expecting anything positive in this one. I can bet she'll be saying "We are at a critical point right now...." and ordering us that we must still keep sticking to the restrictions!

Yes the rumours I heard is it's basically to threaten us all that if we don't stick rigidly to the rules they will introduce more restrictions. Time will tell.

 

[RichJF]

Yes the rumours I heard is it's basically to threaten us all that if we don't stick rigidly to the rules they will introduce more restrictions. Time will tell.

I'm sure I'm not the only one, but I've stopped watching or paying attention to anything senior Tories say anymore.

The reptetitive press conferences & lockdown measures have normalised COVID into the public's mind. This is one of the reasons why adherence to lockdown rules are becoming harder.

 

[bramling]

Quite honestly I don't believe that Sunak would be so easily extending it, especially not before the budget. It may be there are pressures on him to do so, but frankly I don't think even a Chancellor in this joke of a government would be doing something so reckless this far out.

Well, if restrictions are properly eased around May, Boris could then walk away sometime around June/July claiming that the vaccine programme has been a success. So keeping furlough going would then avoid the risk of things kicking off and causing Boris to go under a dark cloud.

It feels at times like we’re never going to get rid of flaming furlough.