New lockdown in England, including school closures, announced by Johnson, 4/1/21

[bramling]

They do, although of course there is a reason why that happens every year at exactly the time schools go back, and not a few weeks later when the weather starts to turn....

There’s certainly some linkage with schools going back, and it’s pretty logical as this will be overnight opening up new inter-personal networks which quite simply weren’t there before. It wouldn’t surprise me if there was a bit of a pre warm-up last year with the EOTHO scheme.

 

[DB]

There’s certainly some linkage with schools going back, and it’s pretty logical as this will be overnight opening up new inter-personal networks which quite simply weren’t there before. It wouldn’t surprise me if there was a bit of a pre warm-up last year with the EOTHO scheme.

A few weeks either way probably isn't going to make a lot of difference though - it's going to happen in September or October whatever.

 

[ABB125]

I haven't yet seen any information regarding universities (although I haven't yet looked on the government website either!); I'm guessing online "learning" will be the plan, similar to schools? As well as staying at parental homes rather than moving back to university at the start of term. If that is the case, I want my accommodation (university owned halls of residence) payment reduced appropriately!

I don't think any specific end date for the new lockdown was announced, although February half term was mentioned. I have a feeling that it will be longer than that; I would be willing to bet money on the lockdown continuing until March 23rd, ready to be lifted for the anniversary of the first lockdown...

 

[bramling]

I haven't yet seen any information regarding universities (although I haven't yet looked on the government website either!); I'm guessing online "learning" will be the plan, similar to schools? As well as staying at parental homes rather than moving back to university at the start of term. If that is the case, I want my accommodation (university owned halls of residence) payment reduced appropriately!

I don't think any specific end date for the new lockdown was announced, although February half term was mentioned. I have a feeling that it will be longer than that; I would be willing to bet money on the lockdown continuing until March 23rd, ready to be lifted for the anniversary of the first lockdown...

More than likely his greatness will do an easement in time for the half term - something like unlimited distance for exercise. I suppose we can look forward to Bournemouth beach being on the front pages round then!

 

[Solent&Wessex]

I haven't yet seen any information regarding universities (although I haven't yet looked on the government website either!); I'm guessing online "learning" will be the plan, similar to schools? As well as staying at parental homes rather than moving back to university at the start of term. If that is the case, I want my accommodation (university owned halls of residence) payment reduced appropriately!

I don't think any specific end date for the new lockdown was announced, although February half term was mentioned. I have a feeling that it will be longer than that; I would be willing to bet money on the lockdown continuing until March 23rd, ready to be lifted for the anniversary of the first lockdown...

Universities have to teach online until at least Mid February except for a few specific courses. The guidance says students should stay wherever they are now and study from there but not travel back and forward between home and uni.

At work we have been carrying quite a lot of students back to Uni over the last few days so I suspect, if they follow the guidance, some will be stuck in university accommodation whilst others will be stuck at home. I suppose where people prefer to be depends on individual circumstances and especially the type of accommodation you live in away from home.

 

[philjo]

I haven't yet seen any information regarding universities (although I haven't yet looked on the government website either!); I'm guessing online "learning" will be the plan, similar to schools? As well as staying at parental homes rather than moving back to university at the start of term. If that is the case, I want my accommodation (university owned halls of residence) payment reduced appropriately!

I don't think any specific end date for the new lockdown was announced, although February half term was mentioned. I have a feeling that it will be longer than that; I would be willing to bet money on the lockdown continuing until March 23rd, ready to be lifted for the anniversary of the first lockdown...

The gov.uk guidance mentions that medical, veterinary and teacher training students are included in those who will still receive teaching in person. Other subjects would be remote learning.
All students returning must take COVID tests and quarantine before start of teaching.

 

[ANDREW_D_WEBB]

Because I'm really going to catch COVID from sitting in a park, miles from anybody else, enjoying a picnic with my household...beyond a joke, again.

In reality, how many people are out having a picnic in January and February? Seems a very odd choice of leisure activity to include, indicative of the rushed nature of the guidance.

I would be willing to bet money on the lockdown continuing until March 23rd, ready to be lifted for the anniversary of the first lockdown...

Agreed, Boris blustering on the TV about squashing the virus and inviting us all to enjoy tea and crumpets next to a bonfire of muzzles.

 

[Yew]

As usual a load of opposition consisting of the same narrow minded stuff as of months past. The fact is that the new strain is causing hospitalisation rates to soar, at a time of year where demand for NHS services peaks, and there is no sign of it slowing down, never mind easing. The fact is that in some areas the NHS is reaching or approaching its limit. The fact is that the virus spreads through close contact via aerosols, so minimising close contact is likely the best (only) way to slow it down before a widespread vaccination can take effect. It has been seen that tier 3 and 4 measures are insufficient to ease the virus propagation, and logic states that easing restrictions and encouraging people to mingle won't do any better, so the only logical alternative is to impose harder restrictions to further restrict people mixing, for a period of time until the pressure on the hospitals eases and the vaccine can take hold.

You can whinge all you like about the effect on the economy, but ultimately if the NHS collapses, we'll all have more to worry about than money, so it is in all our best interests to avoid that happening. This is an unprecedented national emergency which requires major severe measures to get through it, and denying reality doesn't change reality, deal with it. The UK is one of the worst countries in the world affected by COVID, probably thanks to fannying about this time last year when cases were first reported, instead of making a strong leadership decision, shutting the borders and locking down immediately like they did in New Zealand. Sometimes making sacrifices now is necessary to avoid an even worse fate in the future. We dithered around the first time and tried to avoid making the sacrifices, we are paying the price for it now. The best thing to do is not repeat the mistakes of the past and the consequence of the past, but act now to avoid a worse fate down the line. I'm glad the government has had the courage to implement the lockdown when the evidence strongly suggests it is needed. It is How going to last forever.

How many people are you willing to hurt in this questionably effective campaign of lockdowns? How much long term suffering are you willing to accept as your stake on the greatest most reckless gamble in the history of public health?

This is nothing more than a campaign of barbaric psychological torture, I hope those that advocate are able to avoid being on the receiving end in the future.

 

[ABB125]

More than likely his greatness will do an easement in time for the half term - something like unlimited distance for exercise. I suppose we can look forward to Bournemouth beach being on the front pages round then!

Probably.
One benefit of the lockdown is that I no longer have to cross the border from tier 3 to 4 when going to the railway for photography purposes...

 

[Kite159]

Here we go again...

... At least I don't have to worry about crossing from tier 4 into tier 3 for some shopping

 

[jtuk]

Great, more government-sponsored manslaughter of the poor and young

 

[theageofthetra]

And still no testing whatsoever at our airports or ports. Madness.

 

[roversfan2001]

Johnson, Hancock and co will have some serious blood on their hands when this is all over.

 

[Silverlinky]

Interesting reading this thread......sounds like the TV and politicians, especially opposition ones!
Boris this , Boris that, Boris hasn't got a clue, how does Boris sleep at night, and other similar posts......

As someone else pointed out, the opposition leaders were actually calling for full lockdowns before, Starmer has changed from a position of lockdown costing jobs and wrecking the economy to actually calling for tougher action.

There is no political party out there actually calling for less restrictions than those being put in place. Sturgeon is jumping the gun as usual and locking down "her" country, you can't travel in or out. NI are in a 6 week lockdown already, Wales had circuit breakers where England didn't.

Precious little suggestion as to what is the alternative to these lockdowns? There are (according to the figures) around 27000 people now in hospital suffering with Covid.....the whole lockdown process is to try and keep these figures down to stop the health service/hospitals from being overwhelmed. We are not alone in this as a country, in fact we have some of the tamest lockdowns going, no curfews here, no filling out a form just so you can go to the shop, no military on the street stopping you and asking where you are going and what you are doing.

The more NHS staff tied up in hospitals treating those with Covid, the fewer NHS staff there will be to administer the vaccines, whether that's the people actually giving the jabs, or the administrative side to keep track with who's had what, what vaccines are coming in, how to move them around the country etc etc.

 

[Yew]

Great, more government-sponsored manslaughter of the poor and young

It doesn't go on the Covid death count though, so it doesn't matter.

 

[Silverlinky]

And still no testing whatsoever at our airports or ports. Madness.

And? I was under the impression that travellers coming in from other countries were less of a risk than people living in this country as almost all other countries in the world have a lower case rate than we do.....

 

[Yew]

Precious little suggestion as to what is the alternative to these lockdowns? There are (according to the figures) around 27000 people now in hospital suffering with Covid.....the whole lockdown process is to try and keep these figures down to stop the health service/hospitals from being overwhelmed. We are not alone in this as a country, in fact we have some of the tamest lockdowns going, no curfews here, no filling out a form just so you can go to the shop, no military on the street stopping you and asking where you are going and what you are doing.

Focused protection of the vulnerable, like every pandemic plan included until Fergurson decided he wanted to try out the tools of communist dictators.

 

[Mag_seven]

You can whinge all you like about the effect on the economy, but ultimately if the NHS collapses, we'll all have more to worry about than money, so it is in all our best interests to avoid that happening.

And the NHS will collapse if there is no economy - a healthy economy is essential to fund a working NHS.

 

[wellhouse]

I'm a bit confused by this bit

So does that mean I can meet a friend I don't live with, outside, for exercise? Would a walk in the park count as exercise?

Yes....

"outdoor exercise. This should be done locally wherever possible, but you can travel a short distance within your area to do so if necessary (for example, to access an open space)"

but...

" If you need to travel you should stay local – meaning avoiding travelling outside of your village, town or the part of a city where you live – and look to reduce the number of journeys you make overall."

 

[Silverlinky]

Focused protection of the vulnerable, like every pandemic plan included until Fergurson decided he wanted to try out the tools of communist dictators.

You mean the shielding of the CEV people? The roll out of the vaccines to those vulnerable people first? That sort of thing? Or are/were you advocating locking down (more robustly) only those vulnerable people whilst allowing the rest of us to go on as normal?

 

[heart-of-wessex]

I have a school run in 1 coach, usually 2 coaches because the whole route has 90 kids, but doing the whole run because there is possibly one or two key worker kids on. We've agreed to take them in to school since this announcement is last minute, but after tomorrow the parents will have to make their own arrangements, as the boss cannot afford to ferry one or two pupils to/from school for 6-8 weeks

 

[Spamcan81]

Interesting reading this thread......sounds like the TV and politicians, especially opposition ones!
Boris this , Boris that, Boris hasn't got a clue, how does Boris sleep at night, and other similar posts......

As someone else pointed out, the opposition leaders were actually calling for full lockdowns before, Starmer has changed from a position of lockdown costing jobs and wrecking the economy to actually calling for tougher action.

There is no political party out there actually calling for less restrictions than those being put in place. Sturgeon is jumping the gun as usual and locking down "her" country, you can't travel in or out. NI are in a 6 week lockdown already, Wales had circuit breakers where England didn't.

Precious little suggestion as to what is the alternative to these lockdowns? There are (according to the figures) around 27000 people now in hospital suffering with Covid.....the whole lockdown process is to try and keep these figures down to stop the health service/hospitals from being overwhelmed. We are not alone in this as a country, in fact we have some of the tamest lockdowns going, no curfews here, no filling out a form just so you can go to the shop, no military on the street stopping you and asking where you are going and what you are doing.

The more NHS staff tied up in hospitals treating those with Covid, the fewer NHS staff there will be to administer the vaccines, whether that's the people actually giving the jabs, or the administrative side to keep track with who's had what, what vaccines are coming in, how to move them around the country etc etc.

Hooray. Someone talking a bit of sense on this thread. No matter how damaging these restrictions are, the damage caused by allowing the virus to spread uncontrolled would be much greater.

 

[DB]

You mean the shielding of the CEV people? The roll out of the vaccines to those vulnerable people first? That sort of thing? Or are/were you advocating locking down (more robustly) only those vulnerable people whilst allowing the rest of us to go on as normal?

No lockdowns at all - measures to allow those who are at risk to stay at home (if they wish), such as guaranteed deliveries of food, medication, etc. Guaranteed not to lose income, etc.

There would have been nothing controversial about this until this year, but the narrative now seems to be that we can't 'lock up' those at risk because it's not fair, but we can 'lock up' the whole poplation.

 

[roversfan2001]

Hooray. Someone talking a bit of sense on this thread. No matter how damaging these restrictions are, the damage caused by allowing the virus to spread uncontrolled would be much greater.

There's a whole spectrum of options between 'allowing the virus to spread uncontrolled' and going in and out of lockdowns for months on end. The majority of locktivists conveniently ignore this fact.

 

[packermac]

So a long 6 week lockdown at least. Why not a 3 week lockdown and then a review at that point? In 3 weeks from now the effects of the vaccinations may well have finally kicked in. A 6 week lockdown(at least), many people are going to find that pretty tough to say the least. And also what happened to Johnson's previous statement that "The tiering system has a sunset of 3rd February, and there will be a vote in parliament on 27th January for whether it should continue until the end of March."?? What happened to that, has that gone out the window now?

I really just can't believe this, a THIRD full national lockdown. You just couldn't make this stuff up.

How many vaccination effects will have kicked in within 3 weeks, very few is the answer. They were talking about mid to late Feb to get the over 70's and the three groups above done. Then you have 3 weeks for those to be valid. No point in reviewing after 3 weeks.

 

[DB]

Hooray. Someone talking a bit of sense on this thread. No matter how damaging these restrictions are, the damage caused by allowing the virus to spread uncontrolled would be much greater.

The stats indicate that these lockdowns have at most a very small effect (if at all) - and that's likely to be even less with a more infectious strain.

Your approach looks very much like the old "we must do something, and this is something" approach.

 

[Silverlinky]

Hooray. Someone talking a bit of sense on this thread. No matter how damaging these restrictions are, the damage caused by allowing the virus to spread uncontrolled would be much greater.

But nobody is going to believe that unless it is allowed to happen....only when there were 100000 cases and 2000 deaths per day would they turn round and say "yeah, it was actually the right thing to do at the time".......

Don't get me wrong, Lockdowns are not the answer....they have only provided short term respite from spiralling case numbers, and that is indisputable.....however one the restrictions are lifted the numbers go back up again. Its not rocket science is it?

The only way out is and has always been a vaccine.....forget herd immunity, forget shutting the borders like New Zealand did, forget even a world beating track and trace system, none of these will truly defeat the virus....and neither will vaccines, but they give us the best chance of keeping things under control.

 

[Yew]

How many vaccination effects will have kicked in within 3 weeks, very few is the answer. They were talking about mid to late Feb to get the over 70's and the three groups above done. Then you have 3 weeks for those to be valid. No point in reviewing after 3 weeks.

Legally, the restrictions are required to be as minimal as possible.

 

[221129]

the damage caused by allowing the virus to spread uncontrolled would be much greater

Source please.

 

[Yew]

Hooray. Someone talking a bit of sense on this thread. No matter how damaging these restrictions are, the damage caused by allowing the virus to spread uncontrolled would be much greater.

Ah, the 'let it rip' fallacy.