New 4-tier system for England

[yorksrob]

I might be more accepting of having my xmas plans in dissarray (family live down south) if I could comiserate up here in the pub.

But since we're locked in eternal tier 3 with below average infection rates, I'm much less inclined to cut the Government and its advisors any slack in it.

 

[DB]

And I'm sure pubs and other businesses that keep restocking and rehiring only to then have the door shut on them again with little notice will be happy too. The economic damage would be catastrophic, but probably not much worse than now.

Of course they wouldn't be happy - they are being placed in an impossible situation either way, and the government seems completely indifferent to all the businesses they are going to destroy (and have already destroyed).

 

[kristiang85]

Of course they wouldn't be happy - they are being placed in an impossible situation either way, and the government seems completely indifferent to all the businesses they are going to destroy (and have already destroyed).

I meant "happy" in relative terms - surely businesses would much rather have a 3 month certainty with maybe tougher restrictions so they can put long term planning in place, and qualify for state aid, rather than never knowing each week if they are going to be shut or not, yet still having to invest in staffing and supplies.

 

[Jamiescott1]

If more restrictions are announced for the South East will Parliament be recalled to pass them into law?

 

[Bantamzen]

Boris to hold a press conference, complete with Vallance and Whitty.

Immediate total lockdown in 4... 3....2

Oh for @#4*$ sake.....

Things aren't going to "get tough" - they have been for months now in theatre and events. We're seeing some major company failures and significant redundancies (in some cases over 50% of the workforce) already.
A lot of workers are freelance or casual and many are amongst the "excluded" who have received nothing from either furlough or SEISS. Even funded places like the National Theatre let all their casual staff go in August.

While venues have received some support the supply chain has been badly neglected and is in serious danger of collapse which will then make recovery for the industy even harder.
Credit must be given to ScotGov as they have given grants to suppliers at a level that, I know from talking to colleagues in the industry, has definitely saved many jobs and indeed some companies from collapse

The biggest issue just now is short-notice Tier changes - the English Lockdown MkII and now London going from 2-3 has kicked London's theatres in the balls twice now in close succession. National Theatre actually opened and closed (permanently) a show on the same night
We filmed our local panto as there was no chance of getting it on stage but now even the cinema showings have been cancelled as East Lothian has moved from Level 2 to 3 on just 3 days notice - all the casual FOH staff will now have no work for the rest of the year and revenue is now lost as it won't be recovered from streaming

Outside of your own house a theatre or cinema is about as safe as you can get with all the measures in place and yet we are, once again, closed by law

You could substitute "hospitality" in the above as that sector has exactly the same problems (and the two industries are very much entwined and co-dependent)

Trust me when I say this, I know all too well how bad it has been this year. But the way things are going 2020 will be a walk in the park, the future is not only going to see entire industries in these sectors & their supply chains collapse, but it will see far less disposable income for a good many people leading to collapses way beyond these sectors.

 

[Mojo]

Wouldn’t surprise me to hear some kind of lockdown or travel bans in London and the South East. There seems to be a widespread belief that it is out of control in certain regions or that there are some kind of double standards in play. This was one of the tricks they played on us back in the spring, with stories about how bad it apparently was in London scaring plenty of those in other regions. I even had family members still telling me back in early autumn how bad it was in London despite the figures showing that it was substantially worse in the North West and Yorkshire & Humberside; it seems people are very willing to believe that it must be bad somewhere, but then when the evidence shows it’s bad where they live they can’t quite comprehend it because it isn’t noticeable.

Would certainly pacify the North and maybe even help Boris recover some of his losses in the polls in those regions.

 

[philosopher]

If they do impose tighter restrictions today, such as restricting travel from London and the Southeast, does anyone know how soon they can be implemented? Will it have to be debated in Parliament?

 

[HSTEd]

If they do impose tighter restrictions today, such as restricting travel from London and the Southeast, does anyone know how soon they can be implemented? Will it have to be debated in Parliament?

Doubtful, Boris has been ruling by decree since March and he has a great deal of powers under the enabling acts available to him.

 

[Class 33]

A news conference at 4pm with darn Whitty and Valance yet again! With those two appearing, this will not be good atall. They'll be babbling their usual scare mongering nonsense again. Absolutely sick of the sight of those two. These two should have been sacked a few months ago when they predicted deaths could reach 4,000 a day within a matter of weeks.

 

[Peter Mugridge]

Boris to hold a press conference, complete with Vallance and Whitty.

Immediate total lockdown in 4... 3....2

Scheduled for 16.00.

Appears from BBC reports that it's this fast spreading new mutation that is worrying them - even though it appears ( going by a lot of posts on this forum yesterday ) to be far less severe.

 

[Scotrail12]

Why would Whitty, Vallance & Johnson expect people to listen to them at this point when all 3 have been proven to be incompetent and arguably frauds? Anyone who even tunes into this press conference is adding to the problem.

 

[Richard Scott]

Why would Whitty, Vallance & Johnson expect people to listen to them at this point when all 3 have been proven to be incompetent and arguably frauds? Anyone who even tunes into this press conference is adding to the problem.

I won't be listening to them, for all the qualifications of the first two they haven't spoken a word of sense since all this began.

 

[rumoto]

And here we have the measures that Boris is expected to impose to London and the South East:

https://twitter.com/Carolin64723572/status/1340288874472493059

BREAKING: Christmas cancelled for London, South East and East, as areas moved into new Tier 4 with “stay at home” message by law. Christmas bubbles only allowed for Tiers 1 - 3 on Xmas Day with “stay local message”. International travel not advised. Latest plan.

 

[Class 33]

Whilst I can't stand the sight and sound of Whitty and Valance, I'll still be tuning into this press conference to see "live" what is announced today. Could be that they'll saying Christmas is cancelled and we'll all to stay at home, a travel ban, or even yet another bloody national lockdown again. It's not going to be good by the looks of it though with those two appearing.

Fed up all this. When will it ever end??!! We've got the vaccines being rolled out now!!! Therefore we need to start easing all these stupid restrictions and get life back to normal!

 

[kristiang85]

Whilst I can't stand the sight and sound of Whitty and Valance, I'll still be tuning into this press conference to see "live" what is announced today. Could be that they'll saying Christmas is cancelled and we'll all to stay at home, a travel ban, or even yet another bloody national lockdown again. It's not going to be good by the looks of it though with those two appearing.

Fed up all this. When will it ever end??!! We've got the vaccines being rolled out now!!! Therefore we need to start easing all these stupid restrictions and get life back to normal!

I feel this 'mutation' is rather convenient. Boris wants to put in more restrictions, but couldn't as he promised to let us have Christmas. Now this new mutation has come to light (one of 12,700 identified) just at the right time to announce there is new information we should be scared of and he will have to change plans, or at least allow people to spend Christmas together but only if they live in the same area.

 

[RomeoCharlie71]

And here we have the measures that Boris is expected to impose to London and the South East:

https://twitter.com/Carolin64723572/status/1340288874472493059

From a slightly more official source: https://twitter.com/nickeardleybbc/status/1340299821480079361?s=21

NEW: A fourth tier of restrictions is set to be introduced in London and South East of England, sources have told the BBC.

PM press conference at 1600

 

[brad465]

And here we have the measures that Boris is expected to impose to London and the South East:

https://twitter.com/Carolin64723572/status/1340288874472493059

There's one seedy side I can think of to this, given the said Tier 4 areas are Tory heartlands, we could be looking at a rebellion like no other this year so far. Maybe not enough to stop the measures being implemented (especially if Parliament is bypassed), but it increases the chances of a leadership challenge succeeding, either through disgruntlement among affected Tory MPs and/or losses in opinion polling that prompt action faster.

 

[Trackman]

Fed up all this. When will it ever end??!! We've got the vaccines being rolled out now!!! Therefore we need to start easing all these stupid restrictions and get life back to normal!

Yes, our spirits were lifted and there was looking like light at the end of the tunnel. Reminds me of a picture someone had on the wall at NR, 'The light at the end of the tunnel is an oncoming train'.

My mate texted me earlier who works in education, he's had an email this morning saying the school will not re-open in the new year and it will be learn from home etc.. can they do this?

 

[6862]

Am I the only one who feels like we're moving torwards a raising of the Berlin Wall type moment here? I study at a university in the south and had planned to visit my parents in the north this Christmas. Now I feel I am faced with a choice : go and visit them and likely never return to the place I regard as home (where I study), or stay here and never see them again.

 

[kristiang85]

So if people are forced to stay at home, then there is going to be a massive run on the supermarkets now given many will have assumed they would be eating with family/friends. Surely that's just going to make the risk of spread even worse?

 

[DB]

So if people are forced to stay at home, then there is going to be a massive run on the supermarkets now given many will have assumed they would be eating with family/friends. Surely that's just going to make the risk of spread even worse?

What proportion will just ignore any rule changes and carry on with what they are intending to do? I suspect it'll be a lot!

 

[johntea]

I just read somewhere, apologies I can't remember where, a rumour that Tier 1-3 will be reduced to a supposed 'Christmas Day only' restriction

Absolutely nobody will take any notice, my sister isn't going to drive 90 miles on the morning of 25th December then 90 miles back on the evening of the 25th December! She'll be down on 24th December and travelling back on the 26th December as she does every year! (she drives but last time I checked there are 0 or at best a handful of public transport services on 25th December and not much choice on the 26th December anyway!)

 

[philosopher]

Am I the only one who feels like we're moving torwards a raising of the Berlin Wall type moment here? I study at a university in the south and had planned to visit my parents in the north this Christmas. Now I feel I am faced with a choice : go and visit them and likely never return to the place I regard as home (where I study), or stay here and never see them again.

I am in a similar situation in that in live alone in London and am in a bubble with my mum in Birmingham. I was planning to go up on Tuesday but unless they keep allowing support bubbles between London / Southeast and other regions I either have choice of going up this evening and not knowing when I will be able to return or spending Xmas alone.

I have not probably met anyone for the past week so realistically it is very unlikely I am infected.

 

[Mojo]

What proportion will just ignore any rule changes and carry on with what they are intending to do? I suspect it'll be a lot!

Unfortunately I’ve got no choice because the person that’s supposed to be coming does listen to the rules! Going to be an awful lot of wasted food...

 

[nlogax]

Looks like the rumours I was hearing last night are about to be confirmed. This is 2020's final kick in the cojones for millions of people. Am assuming this starts on Monday, so I'm driving to Scotland tomorrow and not coming back until the new year. No point waiting around.

 

[Paul_10]

A news conference at 4pm with darn Whitty and Valance yet again! With those two appearing, this will not be good atall. They'll be babbling their usual scare mongering nonsense again. Absolutely sick of the sight of those two. These two should have been sacked a few months ago when they predicted deaths could reach 4,000 a day within a matter of weeks.

Oh god not that old chestnut again

You just don't like Whitty and Vallance because they say stuff you don't want too hear. They are realists, they know what they are talking about and I rather listen to them than Boris Johnson who you probably like because he gives you (false) hope. The 4000 deaths a day could perhaps be presented better but they showed that outcome(and it was NOT a prediction) if nothing was done.

This is a serious situation we are seeing in the south and east and also Wales where cases are out of control, Xmas should of been cancelled weeks ago, we should not of got worked up over one poxy day and now it's the worst case scenario where the PM is effectively cancelling Xmas just under a week until Xmas day and after all the planning about Xmas bubbles nonsense.

Start listening to Whitty and Vallence, they are the guys who do talk sence even if they give news you don't want to hear.

 

[Yew]

(and it was NOT a prediction)

To quote Douglas Adams: " If it looks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, we have at least to consider the possibility that we have a small aquatic bird of the family Anatidae on our hands."

 

[C J Snarzell]

I had a feeling weeks ago, when the second UK lockdown came to an end that there was always a possibility of a third lockdown and I'm kind of anticipating this is the direction the UK government is going to take yet again.

The pattern I've seen in Boris Johnson decision making is that he seems to lag behind Northern Ireland, Scotland & Wales in implementing something, then inevitably he follows suit and imposes a similar approach to his counterparts in the three other nations.

However, I do believe that what he ever does decide in the next few hours or days - we cannot go on and be subject to a fourth, then a fifth lockdown and so on coupled by Tiering inbetween which is almost as restrictive.

In the last fortnight, I have seen two people I know who are coping really badly with depression and anxiety - the devastation it is doing to mental health and a rise in alcohol/drug dependancy is becoming a growing tidal wave.

Boris does need to consider a future end game to all this now instead on continuing to bury his head in the sand pit.

CJ

 

[TheSel]

Will people please STOP saying that Christmas might be cancelled.

CHRISTMAS WILL NOT BE CANCELLED. DECEMBER 25 WILL STILL BE CHRISTMAS DAY.

Celebrations might be different, but the date and its significance will not change.

 

[DB]

Oh god not that old chestnut again

You just don't like Whitty and Vallance because they say stuff you don't want too hear. They are realists, they know what they are talking about and I rather listen to them than Boris Johnson who you probably like because he gives you (false) hope. The 4000 deaths a day could perhaps be presented better but they showed that outcome(and it was NOT a prediction) if nothing was done.

This is a serious situation we are seeing in the south and east and also Wales where cases are out of control, Xmas should of been cancelled weeks ago, we should not of got worked up over one poxy day and now it's the worst case scenario where the PM is effectively cancelling Xmas just under a week until Xmas day and after all the planning about Xmas bubbles nonsense.

Start listening to Whitty and Vallence, they are the guys who do talk sence even if they give news you don't want to hear.

Thought it wouldn't be long before we heard the Locktivist view!

Do you seriously believe that all these outcomes which they predict are certain / very likely to happen if nothing is done? Such preductions in all countries have been consistently unreliable, and there is no correlation at all between the severity of measures and the outcomes.