Further Restrictions Announced by Johnson (22/09)

[DustyBin]

Last night I was in one of the more down-trodden pubs in the centre of Bolton. The minute I walked in I was asked to put a mask on, was invited to have my name/number taken, chose a seat and they came to me with my beer and card reader. There was one group close together, but I know them as a group of mates anyway, and when they spoke to me they wore masks and kept distant.

If I wanted to catch CV, I think the only way to get it from that pub would eb to lick the carpet!! But they will eb forced to close despite doing everything right. And the net result will be...cases still on the up.

Precisely this. We don’t punish the entire aviation industry when one airline’s shoddy maintenance results in an accident. Deal with the problem businesses and let the others carry on.

 

[greyman42]

Tonight's news about Boris Johnson's two week mini lockdown

Have i missed something here?

 

[bramling]

Have i missed something here?

There’s clearly something afoot.

The uncertainty is as bad as any restrictions - for example should one cancel any hotel bookings for next week?

 

[Bletchleyite]

The uncertainty is as bad as any restrictions - for example should one cancel any hotel bookings for next week?

I wouldn't make one at the moment, but with hotels it's almost always "non-cancellable at all" or "cancellable up to earliest check-in time on the day of arrival", so no need to rush either.

 

[yorksrob]

On the latest news bulletin, the Government has apparently said that there "is now evidence that considerable transmission of the virus takes place in hospitality venues".

Let's see if they publish this evidence, including how hospitality compares with other sectors.

 

[bramling]

I wouldn't make one at the moment, but with hotels it's almost always "non-cancellable at all" or "cancellable up to earliest check-in time on the day of arrival", so no need to rush either.

It’s not an issue for me, however a relative has had a week in Devon booked from this Sunday. I think the cut-off for cancellation is something like tonight (which does strike me as unusual).

Personally I’d be tempted to run with it, though if it was in something like northern England then I’d be more wary. From what I gather it’s booked on a credit card, which would add some extra protection.

Either way however it’s not good for hotels. The place I was in last week (west Wales) went from largely full at the start of the stay to pretty much empty by the time we left. This uncertainty is devastating, especially as allegedly the weather is supposed to improve a bit from next week. We don’t even know if hotels are something BJ is actually thinking about, just that the media are on it - though presumably there‘a probably been a leak somewhere.

 

[Yew]

On the latest news bulletin, the Government has apparently said that there "is now evidence that considerable transmission of the virus takes place in hospitality venues".

Let's see if they publish this evidence, including how hospitality compares with other sectors.

I think it's next in line, after the "growing evidence" for masks.


Conveinient how it's came out just as there is political pressure to intervene in hospitality venues too. That seems to have happened an awful lot over the last few months.

 

[trebor79]

On the latest news bulletin, the Government has apparently said that there "is now evidence that considerable transmission of the virus takes place in hospitality venues".

Let's see if they publish this evidence, including how hospitality compares with other sectors.

Filed in the same places as the "growing evidence" supporting the mask mandate no doubt...

 

[Bantamzen]

Last night I was in one of the more down-trodden pubs in the centre of Bolton. The minute I walked in I was asked to put a mask on, was invited to have my name/number taken, chose a seat and they came to me with my beer and card reader. There was one group close together, but I know them as a group of mates anyway, and when they spoke to me they wore masks and kept distant.

If I wanted to catch CV, I think the only way to get it from that pub would eb to lick the carpet!! But they will eb forced to close despite doing everything right. And the net result will be...cases still on the up.

I wouldn't recommend that, the amount of cleaning products and sanitiser soaked into the carpets would be likely to give you a far worse time than the virus!

On the latest news bulletin, the Government has apparently said that there "is now evidence that considerable transmission of the virus takes place in hospitality venues".

Let's see if they publish this evidence, including how hospitality compares with other sectors.

Well a couple of weeks ago some newspapers were citing PHE / ONS data as showing that hospitability was responsible for about 5% of track and trace contact data. So unless suddenly pubs have been filled to the rafters, with punters licking each others faces, I suspect as with other "growing evidence" of stuff touted by the government, we will see exactly stuff all proof.

 

[kez19]

I think it's next in line, after the "growing evidence" for masks.


Conveinient how it's came out just as there is political pressure to intervene in hospitality venues too. That seems to have happened an awful lot over the last few months.

But still... we can’t be bothered to support that industry... I hope karma bites back on all the politicians UK wide..

 

[Domh245]

Well a couple of weeks ago some newspapers were citing PHE / ONS data as showing that hospitability was responsible for about 5% of track and trace contact data. So unless suddenly pubs have been filled to the rafters, with punters licking each others faces, I suspect as with other "growing evidence" of stuff touted by the government, we will see exactly stuff all proof.

It's curious, because the government's surveillance report shows that food/hospitality institutions remain firmly at the bottom of the pile in terms of COVID-19 incidents (fig 20 in this report) at about 4% now - of course, a COVID 19 incident isn't the same as COVID transmission, but it's certainly a good representation of where the "problem" is

 

[STINT47]

I think evidence magically grows to support whatever the politicians feel like doing this week, which for Boris is whatever Scorland did the week before.

 

[DB]

I think evidence magically grows to support whatever the politicians feel like doing this week, which for Boris is whatever Scorland did the week before.

Or rather, it's claimed to grow!

Perhaps now that the media is becoming more at odds with the government they will start demanding evidence for these claims, unlike with the "growing evidence" for masks where they just parroted the official line.

 

[yorksrob]

Well a couple of weeks ago some newspapers were citing PHE / ONS data as showing that hospitability was responsible for about 5% of track and trace contact data. So unless suddenly pubs have been filled to the rafters, with punters licking each others faces, I suspect as with other "growing evidence" of stuff touted by the government, we will see exactly stuff all proof.

Not at any of the pubs I've frequented, but then again I lead a fairly sheltered life

== Doublepost prevention - post automatically merged: 8 Oct 2020 ==

It's curious, because the government's surveillance report shows that food/hospitality institutions remain firmly at the bottom of the pile in terms of COVID-19 incidents (fig 20 in this report) at about 4% now - of course, a COVID 19 incident isn't the same as COVID transmission, but it's certainly a good representation of where the "problem" is

Cheers, that's a very handy statistical round-up.

 

[kez19]

Or rather, it's claimed to grow!

Perhaps now that the media is becoming more at odds with the government they will start demanding evidence for these claims, unlike with the "growing evidence" for masks where they just parroted the official line.

Yet you could say where have the media been during this whole scenario, more like lapdogs but because the public are no longer buying it the media now starts switching sides, there to think media wasn’t bias but clearly is (saying this as for both Scottish and UK level)

No wonder I have read on the internet that people don’t trust politicians let alone media (funny old world!) and even speaking to people

 

[SJN]

Maybe it could be something to do with the fact you only give your details in hospitality places and most people will have been somewhere so they are just assuming they picked it up in those places. Could just have easily got it on a train/bus or supermarket but how would anyone know.

 

[packermac]

Precisely this. We don’t punish the entire aviation industry when one airline’s shoddy maintenance results in an accident. Deal with the problem businesses and let the others carry on.

We do if EASA or the FAA think it warrants it.

 

[STINT47]

In Nottingham we know restrictions are coming. People are worried for their jobs, mental health, family etc and there was a feeling of anxiety and tension in the city today.

Everyone wants clarity. At least if we know we can prepare and do what needs to be done to get through it but what do we get...... politicians putting out an email referencing an article in The Times.

Im totally fed up with this now and my mental health and that of a friend I met today for lunch is going backwards.

If spitting image wrote this the script would be rejected as to far fetched to be believed.

 

[Howardh]

In Nottingham we know restrictions are coming. People are worried for their jobs, mental health, family etc and there was a feeling of anxiety and tension in the city today.

Everyone wants clarity. At least if we know we can prepare and do what needs to be done to get through it but what do we get...... politicians putting out an email referencing an article in The Times.

Im totally fed up with this now and my mental health and that of a friend I met today for lunch is going backwards.

If spitting image wrote this the script would be rejected as to far fetched to be believed.

I now firmly believe it's a political game rather than save lives/NHS. The Tories/Johnson/Cummings have gone down an one-way street and will never, ever admit they are wrong, so we will be in and out, mostly in, lockdown for months and months to come.
10pm rule - no justification whatsoever.
Shutting pubs and cafes....ditto.
Keeping schools and colleges open spreading covid like wildfire? Check.
All it needs is one act of civil disobedience to trigger the country going up in flames. The government that conned everyone into Brexit on the grounds of freedom and independence (what a joke) is keeping us all imprisoned at home without parole for an unspecified time. That's against our human rights isn't it??

 

[DB]

I now firmly believe it's a political game rather than save lives/NHS. The Tories/Johnson/Cummings have gone down an one-way street and will never, ever admit they are wrong, so we will be in and out, mostly in, lockdown for months and months to come.

Unless the backbench discontent gains momentum and Johnson gets ousted - which is far from impossible.

 

[Howardh]

Unless the backbench discontent gains momentum and Johnson gets ousted - which is far from impossible.

Looks like the Tories have already lost the support of the "red wall" that voted for them last year. I'm also upset that Starmer is going along with Johnson in supporting him, the 10pm curfew defies logic - is something relatively new and Starmer should oppose.

 

[DelayRepay]

I wonder if the 'evidence' related to hospitality comes from Track and Trace?

Given that pubs etc. are now very hot on taking contact details, I wonder if more cases are being identified linked to pubs, rather than there actually being more cases linked to pubs? It's a possibility I think.

My mum lives in Yorkshire, although not an area with restrictions at the moment. I went to visit her a few days ago, because I suspect I won't be allowed to see her again for a little while

 

[Silverlinky]

I struggle to accept some of the posts on here which make it sound like the UK, or more specifically the UK government are playing a political game.

Has anyone looked what is going on in many European countries and cities?

In todays news.....Ukraine, Poland, Czech Republic and Slovakia have all announced record single day case figures, France is adding more cities to its harsh lockdown which sees bars and restaurants closed completely, Brussels has just closed all bars and cafes for a month, Italy has just announced that mask wearing is now compulsory at all times outdoors, Germany is worried about increasing cases and has brought in overnight stay bans and controls on gatherings again.

Many countries also have a 10pm curfew (Austria, Czech, Denmark, Finland, Slovakia), Portugal has an 8pm curfew. In Poland they have just made a ruling that you need to carry a medical certificate showing you don't have to wear a mask

Of course our government has not covered itself in glory over its handling of the crisis, but we are by no means alone in that.

 

[DB]

I struggle to accept some of the posts on here which make it sound like the UK, or more specifically the UK government are playing a political game.

Has anyone looked what is going on in many European countries and cities?

In todays news.....Ukraine, Poland, Czech Republic and Slovakia have all announced record single day case figures, France is adding more cities to its harsh lockdown which sees bars and restaurants closed completely, Brussels has just closed all bars and cafes for a month, Italy has just announced that mask wearing is now compulsory at all times outdoors, Germany is worried about increasing cases and has brought in overnight stay bans and controls on gatherings again.

Many countries also have a 10pm curfew (Austria, Czech, Denmark, Finland, Slovakia), Portugal has an 8pm curfew. In Poland they have just made a ruling that you need to carry a medical certificate showing you don't have to wear a mask

Of course our government has not covered itself in glory over its handling of the crisis, but we are by no means alone in that.

All that really seems to show is that other countries are also resorting to tokenism. It seems that the response to an entirely predictable rise in cases, as happens with all respiratory infections at this time of year, is to be seen to be doing something, even where there is clearly no evidence to justify it. E.g. masks outside - why?

 

[bramling]

I struggle to accept some of the posts on here which make it sound like the UK, or more specifically the UK government are playing a political game.

Has anyone looked what is going on in many European countries and cities?

In todays news.....Ukraine, Poland, Czech Republic and Slovakia have all announced record single day case figures, France is adding more cities to its harsh lockdown which sees bars and restaurants closed completely, Brussels has just closed all bars and cafes for a month, Italy has just announced that mask wearing is now compulsory at all times outdoors, Germany is worried about increasing cases and has brought in overnight stay bans and controls on gatherings again.

Many countries also have a 10pm curfew (Austria, Czech, Denmark, Finland, Slovakia), Portugal has an 8pm curfew. In Poland they have just made a ruling that you need to carry a medical certificate showing you don't have to wear a mask

Of course our government has not covered itself in glory over its handling of the crisis, but we are by no means alone in that.

Yet meanwhile Sweden seem to be doing okay.

All these countries bought time (didn’t Poland even go as far as closing its borders for a while?), yet here they no further forward and each having incurred massive costs in a number of ways, both economic and in terms of mental health.

 

[DB]

Yet meanwhile Sweden seem to be doing okay.

All these countries bought time (didn’t Poland even go as far as closing its borders for a while?), yet here they no further forward and each having incurred massive costs in a number of ways, both economic and in terms of mental health.

And it's now hitting at the time when all other respiratory infections start to peak.

 

[Silverlinky]

Yet meanwhile Sweden seem to be doing okay.

All these countries bought time (didn’t Poland even go as far as closing its borders for a while?), yet here they no further forward and each having incurred massive costs in a number of ways, both economic and in terms of mental health.

Define ok.......?

A slightly HIGHER positive case to population ratio than the UK, and a slightly LOWER death to population ratio. Are you saying that if we'd done nothing we'd be no worse off?

 

[PHILIPE]

I now firmly believe it's a political game rather than save lives/NHS. The Tories/Johnson/Cummings have gone down an one-way street and will never, ever admit they are wrong, so we will be in and out, mostly in, lockdown for months and months to come.
10pm rule - no justification whatsoever.
Shutting pubs and cafes....ditto.
Keeping schools and colleges open spreading covid like wildfire? Check.
All it needs is one act of civil disobedience to trigger the country going up in flames. The government that conned everyone into Brexit on the grounds of freedom and independence (what a joke) is keeping us all imprisoned at home without parole for an unspecified time. That's against our human rights isn't it??

I thought that Brexit came about due to the majority of the people voting for it.

 

[Richard Scott]

I thought that Brexit came about due to the majority of the people voting for it.

Know it's off topic but being pedantic it was the majority of those that voted not the majority of people voting for it as many of those that could have voted didn't but that's another matter entirely.

 

[johnnychips]

Define ok.......?

A slightly HIGHER positive case to population ratio than the UK, and a slightly LOWER death to population ratio. Are you saying that if we'd done nothing we'd be no worse off?

Who knows? This virus has behaved in unexpected ways. It seems to have a relatively high death rate (compared with Spanish and ‘normal ‘ flu) amongst older people that wasn’t expected initially which led to a high death rate in care homes, which Sweden has admitted they cocked up - we haven’t yet - but now it seems to be infecting a lot of people with mild or no symptoms.