UK face coverings discussion

[scrapy]

The 0.1% of people who are fined are people actually spoken to by BTP. I'd guess that less than 0.1% of those not wearing a covering properly are actually spoken to by BTP, the chances of actually getting fined for not wearing a covering are probably more like 0.001%. It would be interested to know what percentage of rail users are genuinely exempt.

 

[DB]

I use one of those when travelling to England. The samount of people who tell me it isn't valid is ridiculous - I've heard variants on 'it's not a green lanyard, we don't accept it' more times than I can count. This includes a Avanti TM who ordered me off a train at the next stop (the fact that that was where I wanted anyway is beside the point).

Did you put in a complaint to Avanti? Staff behaving like this need to be told by their managers what the rules are. Many appear to be making up their own.

 

[VauxhallandI]

Are those plastic visors that a lot of people seem to be wearing acceptable under the legislation? I thought the legislation specifically referred to 'cloth' face coverings. I suppose the visor wearers may have an exemption under law, but decide to wear a visor instead of going 'naked'.

I'm not sure what the point of visors is though (other than to have something on display). Whether you agree with face coverings or not, isn't the theory that the cloth acts like a filter, so when you exhale any virus particles in your breath are trapped in the cloth rather then being dispersed? Surely all the visor does is direct your breath down/to the sides but wouldn't actually 'trap' any covid or stop it spreading in the same way that cloth might (theoretically)?

I went to my local community hospital last week for a blood test. When they saw my lanyard they gave me a face shield to wear.

So many mixed messages and theories even from medical professionals

 

[gnolife]

Did you put in a complaint to Avanti? Staff behaving like this need to be told by their managers what the rules are. Many appear to be making up their own.

I haven't had chance yet - this was on yesterday mornings 0940 off GLC, but I'll be putting one on as soon as I can

 

[trainophile]

Where they went wrong with the whole concept was the heavy emphasis from the start that "you are wearing it to protect other people". It's touchingly naive that they thought this would actually encourage the unselfish public to obediently comply. Of course it had the opposite effect in this "I'm alright Jack" world we live in.

 

[Richard Scott]

Where they went wrong with the whole concept was the heavy emphasis from the start that "you are wearing it to protect other people". It's touchingly naive that they thought this would actually encourage the unselfish public to obediently comply. Of course it had the opposite effect in this "I'm alright Jack" world we live in.

The other issue is the dubious benefits. If there was some good scientific evidence rather than silly slogans people would be more compliant. There would still be some, admittedly, but most will comply if reasons are proven and explained but there not. I'll wear one for as little time as necessary but I'm doing it under duress and for no other reason as have yet to be convinced of the benefits.

 

[DelayRepay]

The other issue is the dubious benefits. If there was some good scientific evidence rather than silly slogans people would be more compliant. There would still be some, admittedly, but most will comply if reasons are proven and explained but there not. I'll wear one for as little time as necessary but I'm doing it under duress and for no other reason as have yet to be convinced of the benefits.

Not helped by the fact we were originally told there was no benefit, and I remember some of the government scientists originally saying they do more harm than good (facemasks, not the scientists!). This changed to weak evidence of benefit in certain settings, before they became mandatory.

 

[STINT47]

Not helped by the fact we were originally told there was no benefit, and I remember some of the government scientists originally saying they do more harm than good (facemasks, not the scientists!). This changed to weak evidence of benefit in certain settings, before they became mandatory.

If used correctly I believe they have a very small benefit.

The problem is the practicality of using them outside of a clinical setting and human nature means they are rarely used correctly. Add in the fact that social distancing has gone out the window, as many feel their mask is a shield that stops the virus and you have a perfect storm for an increase in cases.

Be like Sweden not like France.

 

[island]

If used correctly I believe they have a very small benefit.

The problem is the practicality of using them outside of a clinical setting and human nature means they are rarely used correctly. Add in the fact that social distancing has gone out the window, as many feel their mask is a shield that stops the virus and you have a perfect storm for an increase in cases.

Be like Sweden not like France.

Precisely what I have been saying for some time.

The vast majority of the studies cited as evidence that masks “work” are predicated on them being put on and taken off correctly, in a clinical environment, disposed of after four hours’ use, etc. etc.

 

[initiation]

Not helped by the fact we were originally told there was no benefit, and I remember some of the government scientists originally saying they do more harm than good (facemasks, not the scientists!). This changed to weak evidence of benefit in certain settings, before they became mandatory.

I always recall this interview. The points raised haven't changed.

I am with the poster above that I will very reluctantly not kick up a fuss, but I take all reasonable measures to mean I avoid situations where I have to. So good bye physical shops and I haven't been on a train in 6 months (was a daily commuter).

 

[Bantamzen]

The other issue is the dubious benefits. If there was some good scientific evidence rather than silly slogans people would be more compliant. There would still be some, admittedly, but most will comply if reasons are proven and explained but there not. I'll wear one for as little time as necessary but I'm doing it under duress and for no other reason as have yet to be convinced of the benefits.

Indeed, had the government taken the Swedish approach right at the beginning, i.e. a calm, informed, measured approach, instead of switching from a fairly calm start to the hysteria-inducing one they chose from late March we more than likely would be in a far better position right now.

 

[Huntergreed]

Saw this sign at Stratford station:



Way to enforce a totally pointless rule,waste money on doing so, and make those with exemptions feel even further discouraged from travelling than they already do.

 

[35B]

Indeed, had the government taken the Swedish approach right at the beginning, i.e. a calm, informed, measured approach, instead of switching from a fairly calm start to the hysteria-inducing one they chose from late March we more than likely would be in a far better position right now.

And the public would have obeyed it? There's more to the "success" of the Swedish model than just that calm messaging.

 

[DB]

And the public would have obeyed it? There's more to the "success" of the Swedish model than just that calm messaging.

Yes, I think so - given how high compliance with the lockdown was in March and April.

Will be harder now because a large number of people have lost all belief in the government.

 

[Skimpot flyer]

Yes, I think so - given how high compliance with the lockdown was in March and April.

Will be harder now because a large number of people have lost all belief in the government.

and government have lost all belief in people following the ever-more absurd rules voluntarily, so are threatening big fines.
Now two MPs have been exposed (by members of the public) travelling on the train / tube without masks. Neither claimed to be exempt, so can they really be surprised if compliance starts falling away soon? I’m heartily sick of the ‘rules for the plebs don’t apply to us’ attitude

 

[Reliablebeam]

Saw this sign at Stratford station:

View attachment 83974

Way to enforce a totally pointless rule,waste money on doing so, and make those with exemptions feel even further discouraged from travelling than they already do.

One of the best things about this photo is the 'chin ornament' theme of the lady!

I've not been on the tube this week so I'll be interested to what happens - sounds like the police are either too busy or got bored of it!

 

[stuartl]

One of the best things about this photo is the 'chin ornament' theme of the lady!

I've not been on the tube this week so I'll be interested to what happens - sounds like the police are either too busy or got bored of it!

BTP were at Blackpol north yesterday stopping people arriving without a mask.

 

[bramling]

One of the best things about this photo is the 'chin ornament' theme of the lady!

I've not been on the tube this week so I'll be interested to what happens - sounds like the police are either too busy or got bored of it!

More than likely come from Sadiq Khan. Masks seem to be the only thing he can come up with regarding this whole thing.

 

[trebor79]

More than likely come from Sadiq Khan. Masks seem to be the only thing he can come up with regarding this whole thing.

And another lockdown to completely destroy whatever is left of his city's economy.

 

[Class800]

Cartgate Lodge cafe on the A303 has a sign saying 'No mask. No service' and asking anyone who is exempt to go to the side window - for outdoor service (others go inside and can see products, some are self-service, but they have to take away since tables closed). Any thoughts, in favour or against?

 

[Huntergreed]

Cartgate Lodge cafe on the A303 has a sign saying 'No mask. No service' and asking anyone who is exempt to go to the side window - for outdoor service (others go inside and can see products, some are self-service, but they have to take away since tables closed). Any thoughts, in favour or against?

Against - I mean what if it’s raining? That just seems over the top and discriminatory, obviously the business is run by someone strongly pro-mask who believes they will make them “safe”.

 

[Bletchleyite]

Cartgate Lodge cafe on the A303 has a sign saying 'No mask. No service' and asking anyone who is exempt to go to the side window - for outdoor service (others go inside and can see products, some are self-service, but they have to take away since tables closed). Any thoughts, in favour or against?

If it isn't possible to maintain 2m distancing inside, in favour. If it would be possible in some way, that should be done first.

 

[Class800]

I'm against too - though I can wear one. I wear something rather opulent that is compliant - but more for fashion purposes (young lady). Not sure if allowing access via the side window fulfils their reasonable adjustment requirement under equality laws - might do, might not...

 

[Huntergreed]

On this LNER Train I’m on, we’re just about to arrive at Durham. A woman who is alighting here just forced her 3/4 year old child to mask up (the child clearly didn’t want to and found it uncomfortable), she said if he doesn’t he’ll be “dirty” and put himself and his granny (who he was going to visit) “at serious risk”. Honestly some people are just so deluded when it comes to this

 

[jtuk]

That's child abuse, pure and simple

 

[43066]

I don't pay for a tv license but I do pay for a tv licence.

As a paid up grammar Nazi myself, I’m hanging my head in shame. I blame autocomplete.

 

[bramling]

On this LNER Train I’m on, we’re just about to arrive at Durham. A woman who is alighting here just forced her 3/4 year old child to mask up (the child clearly didn’t want to and found it uncomfortable), she said if he doesn’t he’ll be “dirty” and put himself and his granny (who he was going to visit) “at serious risk”. Honestly some people are just so deluded when it comes to this

It’s actually really scary and sobering how easily people are led into adopting and embracing behaviours.

I can well see how a certain political movement last century took hold.

 

[35B]

That's child abuse, pure and simple

I take it you’ve never had to deal with a strong willed small child, not wanting to do what you need/want them to do?

 

[Bantamzen]

I take it you’ve never had to deal with a strong willed small child, not wanting to do what you need/want them to do?

You think telling a toddler that they might put granny at "serious risk" isn't a form of abuse?

 

[birchesgreen]

You think telling a toddler that they might put granny at "serious risk" isn't a form of abuse?

Yes especially if Granny does catch it anyway, the child would think it was their fault.