Merseytravel 'One Day Ranger'...

[Sephs]

Hello,

Sorry to jump straight in to posting straight away, I stumbled across your forum and thought it would be the best place to ask (hope this is the right section!)
As the title says, I have a Merseytravel One Day Ranger pass. I asked my stepdad to buy me a Saveaway but he got the wrong thing. The man on the desk at the station said they no longer sell Saveaways and that this pass was the equivalent to one.
Now with a Saveaway, I can use all local bus services as well as Merseyrail with no problems.

Is this pass really the same? I have the feeling I won't be able to use Arriva buses with it.

Any help is really appreciated, thank you

 

[sonic2009]

Hello,

Sorry to jump straight in to posting straight away, I stumbled across your forum and thought it would be the best place to ask (hope this is the right section!)
As the title says, I have a Merseytravel One Day Ranger pass. I asked my stepdad to buy me a Saveaway but he got the wrong thing. The man on the desk at the station said they no longer sell Saveaways and that this pass was the equivalent to one.
Now with a Saveaway, I can use all local bus services as well as Merseyrail with no problems.

Is this pass really the same? I have the feeling I won't be able to use Arriva buses with it.

Any help is really appreciated, thank you

is it a national rail ticket bought from your local station? if so, it's the same as a saveaway, just it's printed on a national rail ticket. that's all so should have same functions as a saveaway... other memebers will confirm,

here's the leaflet for it. http://www.merseytravel.gov.uk/articleimages/Saveaway Mar10.pdf

 

[OwlMan]

Rail stations do not issue scratchcard type "Saveaways". They issue a normal rail ticket which is used like a scratchcard.

What does your ticket have printed on it?

 

[Pumbaa]

Hi Sephs,

Yes its the same. The rail ticket has the date printed on it; the scratch-off feature of the Saveaways is to give a valid date to guards, bus drivers etc. Just show the ticket and you'll be fine. It has the same validity, same everything, as a Saveaway and is a Saveaway in all but the name and how its presented.

As an aside, they sell them in all Merseyside stations, and I have bought one as afar as Warrington and Wigan before.

Hope that helps!

 

[Sephs]

Thank you all for the super speedy replies!

collybs, my ticket has the following printed onto it:
Class: STD
Ticket type: DAY TICKET
Start date: 27 JLY 10
Issued at: (local train station)
Available: MTRAV SAVEAWAY ALL AREAS
Valid: AS ADVERTISED ONEDAY

Then at the bottom it says 'one day ranger' as I wrote in the topic title.

Big reassurance, the leaflet does confirm it, so thank you! Would seem you're all right. It's so I can get to and from work tomorrow so it was vital I got it right first time. You've all been a brilliant help, thank you again!

:P

 

[Solent&Wessex]

It might not be the same.

There have been a few changes to names and ticket types in that area and not all appear to be the same. For example, there is a "Mersey Rail Family area Ticket" which has appeared recently. It is not mentioned anywhere in the staff fares manual, but is mentioned on the National Rail, Northern and Mersey Rail websites. Sadly all 3 websites give differing information as to what and where it is valid for. There is no mention of it in the staff fares manual and when asking for a leaflet recently at Lime Street I was told that they had never seen one.

When I was faffing around with my Avantix the other week I noticed a load of MerseyRail / Travel tickets listed, some of which I had never heard of and can find no reference to anywhere. It may be that you have one of these tickets, although without looking at prices and other details I cannot be sure.

 

[Sephs]

It might not be the same.

There have been a few changes to names and ticket types in that area and not all appear to be the same. For example, there is a "Mersey Rail Family area Ticket" which has appeared recently. It is not mentioned anywhere in the staff fares manual, but is mentioned on the National Rail, Northern and Mersey Rail websites. Sadly all 3 websites give differing information as to what and where it is valid for. There is no mention of it in the staff fares manual and when asking for a leaflet recently at Lime Street I was told that they had never seen one.

When I was faffing around with my Avantix the other week I noticed a load of MerseyRail / Travel tickets listed, some of which I had never heard of and can find no reference to anywhere. It may be that you have one of these tickets, although without looking at prices and other details I cannot be sure.

Thanks for replying, kwvr45.

I haven't seen/heard of these before either. I'm worried if I get on a bus tomorrow they won't let me on with it.

Think I'll give Merseytravel a bell tomorrow before I leave for work and hear what they have to say.

Thanks again all

 

[Ivo]

I bought a Saveaway less than two weeks ago. It covers all Merseyrail services, all Merseytravel buses and the Mersey Ferry.

Do not worry. The Saveaway is perfectly valid on any Merseytravel bus in Merseyside, even if it straddles outside the boundary such as the 47 to Banks. I am not sure about longer distance services though; they probably will not accept it.

It is basically the same as a Travelcard in London, only with ferry use (one single journey only though). And the ticket details you mention are exactly like mine.
--- old post above --- --- new post below ---
If you give me a moment I'll scan mine in so you can check it

 

[Ivo]

Here we are Sorry it took so long; it's been a while since I used the scanner!

My father also had one and he had no trouble either.

 

[Sephs]

Thank you for your reply, Ivo. It's lovely of you to have scanned that in for me, I really appreciate your efforts and kindness

I'm just a little worried about the fact a few of the buses we have to catch are bound to be Arriva. I can usually use a regular saveaway with all of the different bus services so hopefully I can get away the same way tomorrow. Fingers crossed!

Thanks again everyone

 

[First class]

Not valid Monday to Friday between 0631 and 0929.

It is valid on all buses, trains and ferries covered by the boundary of your ticket. You won't have ANY problems at all using them, so long as you are in the right area and using at the correct times.

Rough guide to areas:

Area A- St Helens/Earelstown/Huyton/Rainford
Area B- Birkenhead and the Wirral
Area C- Liverpool-Bootle-Seaforth-Crosby-Speke-Halewood-Huyton-Kirkby
Area D- Formby, Freshfield, Ainsdale and generally up to Southport/Crossens
All Areas - All the above

The map on the last page shows validity area:
http://www.merseytravel.gov.uk/articleimages/Saveaway Mar10.pdf

The main TOCs that have problems are TPE (when diverted or peak calls at HNX) and EMT (between LIV and LPY, HNX). PTE products are valid on them, so with TPE they are valid to Newton-le-Willows if diverted or from Hunts Cross to Liverpool in the evening. They are also valid for travel with EMT between Liverpool and Liverpool South Parkway, however, some guards don't always accept this. London Midland are fully aware and know exactly what they are.

 

[Mojo]

Here we are Sorry it took so long; it's been a while since I used the scanner!

My father also had one and he had no trouble either.

Who punched a hole in it? Is that so they can verify you have only made 1 ferry trip?

 

[First class]

Merseyrail clip all tickets including rovers. There is no limit on ferry journeys.

 

[Jordy]

What is the point of clipping a one day rover?

 

[yorkie]

Do they clip them once or keep clipping?

A 14 day ALR could look like swiss cheese by the end of it.

And as for a 12 month season, you'd need a replacement every month!

 

[Ivo]

Didn't I post a copy of my Anglia Plus ticket? It had THREE holes in it! And I made that exact point (well, not "swiss cheese" but I did say that it may be harder to read). I assume that some people just don't look. I've never had a Travelcard clipped, although having said that I'm not even sure when I was last subject to an inspection with a Travelcard...! This ticket was clipped on the very first journey I made - Southport to Sandhills.

Here's the post in question. One of the holes is hard to see (top-right).

And kudos to Mojo for asking about the hole(s) in both instances!

 

[First class]

The point of "clipping" is:

1) If the correct stamp is used, (i.e. with a headcode), it provides you with proof that you were on a train that might have been delayed (i.e. for charter compensation).

2) It prevents you from returning a ticket claiming it to be 'unused' and applying for a refund for whatever reason, as it has clearly been used already.

3) Particularly Merseyrail, it gives the guard an opportunity to 'interact' with the customer. (good customer service etc)...

4) When stamping, you also get to hold the ticket physically so you could check for any forgeries or photocopies of rangers/rovers which are unfortunately quite common.

Merseyrail don't 'clip' seasons, but every other ticket they will clip, as do many other TOCs.

On Merseyrail the ticket will only be clipped once by a guard, unless the RPIs get on later and stamp it with the Revenue Protection black stamper.

 

[yorkie]

The point of "clipping" is:

1) If the correct stamp is used, (i.e. with a headcode), it provides you with proof that you were on a train that might have been delayed (i.e. for charter compensation).

So if the 'wrong' clip is used or you don't see a guard, what happens then?

2) It prevents you from returning a ticket claiming it to be 'unused' and applying for a refund for whatever reason, as it has clearly been used already.

So what happens elsewhere in the country where seasons, rangers, rovers, travelcards etc are not clipped? Can you return those? (I think not...!)

Also, why clip something that costs less than £10 for that reason? The admin fee of £10 means no refund can be applied for anyway.

3) Particularly Merseyrail, it gives the guard an opportunity to 'interact' with the customer. (good customer service etc)...

You can interact without making a ticket look like swiss cheese.

4) When stamping, you also get to hold the ticket physically so you could check for any forgeries or photocopies of rangers/rovers which are unfortunately quite common.

A ticket can be held without stamping. By your logic, if a ticket has to be stamped to check for forgeries, then someone with a 14 day ALR who has their ticket checked daily, will have a ticket that cannot be read after a few days. How will you then tell if it's a forgery if you can't make out what the ticket says?

Merseyrail don't 'clip' seasons, but every other ticket they will clip, as do many other TOCs.

Is that because seasons are not susceptible to fraud? That's strange, I was told it was the other way round and that seasons were most susceptible to fraud.

On Merseyrail the ticket will only be clipped once by a guard, unless the RPIs get on later and stamp it with the Revenue Protection black stamper.

So this customer interaction you talk about only happens once? and the check for fraud only happens once? So if anyone was up to no good they'd clip their ticket at home? And if a delay occurs on any subsequent trains after the first one, there is no 'proof' you were on the train. What implication does that have, other than to make point 1) pointless?

Your reasons make absolutely no sense to me!

 

[First class]

So if the 'wrong' clip is used or you don't see a guard, what happens then?

Well it doesn't get clipped, you would still have to provide (some) evidence you were delayed another way.

Also, why clip something that costs less than £10 for that reason? The admin fee of £10 means no refund can be applied for anyway.

No, not strictly true. An immidiate refund can be obtained if there is a delay you did not know about. e.g. I buy a ticket the day before. I use the ticket throughout the next day, it is not stamped. At 7pm there is a huge cockup of disruption. I go to the ticket office and demand a full refund due to a delay I was not made aware of when purchasing, I claim I have decided not to travel. Besides, it could be any ranger/rover ticket, not just a saveaway.


At the end of the day, it is the railway's ticket. If a guard wishes to stamp it FOR WHATEVER reason, he/she can and will. Some guards will do it so they can have a chat with you about your day, some will do it to check for forgeries.
If it ends up looking like a Swiss cheese, why worry? It is the railway's ticket they are punching holes in! Doesn't make it any less valid!

If an RPI stamp is clearly visible on a saveaway then I would certainly assume the ticket is fine and dandy... as I expect it to have been fully checked. Therefore I would not spend too much time focusing on validity/clipping, but there would be nothing stopping me from talking to the customer. For the record, Merseyrail RPI/Guard stamps have very clear differences.

I can get a Penzance - Wick single ticket, and break my journey as much as I like. How many stamps could I end up collecting then?!! It makes absolutely no difference to the passenger or the journey being undertaken.

 

[mickey]

It is basically the same as a Travelcard in London, only with ferry use (one single journey only though). And the ticket details you mention are exactly like mine.

Do you have a source for this? I use Saveaways regularly and have never seen or heard anything about this! Certainly the ferry staff have never followed such a rule so anyone reading this should assume they'll be ok.

With respect to the other comments, I have no problem with clipping tickets if the guard chooses to do so (providing the clippings don't make a mess of the train, of course!). Though despite being a daily user of Merseyrail I've had it done only once in at least a year, which implies that it's not a hugely frequent occurrence. And on that occasion they only clipped people on local journeys - they left longer distance tickets for someone else to do.

 

[First class]

 

[Sephs]

Hi all, just thought I'd feedback!

Had no problems at all using any of the buses locally. No questions asked and I was treated the same as though I had a regular saveaway.

Thank you all so much for your replies, you have a great little forum here with some cracking members.

Thanks again!

 

[Ivo]

On behalf of everyone,

You're welcome If you ever need any help, we're only a few clicks away.

Anyway, my source for the Saveaway Ferry restriction is the conversation I had with the lady who issued me my ferry crossing ticket :roll: It sounded a bit odd to me too; after all, who is to stop you trying more than once if the staff are different?

 

[mickey]

Anyway, my source for the Saveaway Ferry restriction is the conversation I had with the lady who issued me my ferry crossing ticket :roll: It sounded a bit odd to me too; after all, who is to stop you trying more than once if the staff are different?

A thought came to me about this over breakfast this morning, in case anyone finds this in future...

With Merseytravel tickets (including Saveaways) you have to collect a paper ticket at the terminal before boarding the ferry, as you did. These (free) tickets can then only be used once - and are usually collected on arrival, - but there's nothing to stop you using the same Saveaway again to get another one, e.g. for the return journey. Presumably that's what the lady meant when you were there.

 

[faddy]

A thought came to me about this over breakfast this morning, in case anyone finds this in future...

With Merseytravel tickets (including Saveaways) you have to collect a paper ticket at the terminal before boarding the ferry, as you did. These (free) tickets can then only be used once - and are usually collected on arrival, - but there's nothing to stop you using the same Saveaway again to get another one, e.g. for the return journey. Presumably that's what the lady meant when you were there.

Quite right there, Mickey. What you can't do is stay on the boat for the round trip.

 

[mickey]

Quite right there, Mickey. What you can't do is stay on the boat for the round trip.

Unless you get off, acquire another paper ticket straight away and get back on the boat before it leaves. At off-peak times on the Liverpool side, which is usually the only place they do on-boat ticket checks, there is plenty of time for this as the boat sits there for ten minutes; on the Wirral side you'd need to make sure you were one of the first off but could easily do it.