Trivia: Counties served by one TOC and the county with the most TOCs

[lancededcena]

I was thinking about the (English) counties served by only one TOC and the only one I can really think of is Suffolk with Greater Anglia. Any others?

I would think West Midlands county (Birmingham) has the most: Avanti West Coast, Chiltern Railways, West Midlands Trains (WMR/LNR), CrossCountry, Transport For Wales: any others?

 

[Islineclear3_1]

But doesn't GA also serve the counties of Essex and Hertfordshire?

Similarly with SouthEastern. It mainly serves Kent but forages into East Sussex

 

[cav1975]

Medway (no longer part of Kent) - South Eastern
Isle of Wight - Island Line

 

[Lewlew]

I was going to say Rutland but even that has two (EMR and CrossCountry)

 

[lancededcena]

But doesn't GA also serve the counties of Essex and Hertfordshire?

Similarly with SouthEastern. It mainly serves Kent but forages into East Sussex

I was referring to the TOCs which serves at least one station in a county, not the least amount of counties that a TOC serves, if that makes any sense.

 

[Energy]

Cornwall only has GWR and XC so close. Isle of Wight is only SWR/Island Line if you count it as a county.

 

[lancededcena]

Devon only has GWR and XC so close.

Doesn't Devon have South Western Railway too?

 

[_toommm_]

Surely the answer to the county with the most TOCs this is the same answer to what station has the most TOCs calling at it - I think Manchester Piccadilly, Doncaster, and Stockport were up there:

Greater Manchester (Manchester and Stockport):
- Avanti West Coast
- CrossCountry
- East Midlands Railway
- Northern
- Transpennine Express
- Transport for Wales

South Yorkshire (Doncaster):
- CrossCountry
- East Midlands Railway
- Grand Central
- Hull Trains
- LNER
- Northern
- Transpennine Express

 

[lancededcena]

Medway (no longer part of Kent) - South Eastern
Isle of Wight - Island Line

Medway is part of the ceremonial county of Kent so not counted (as well as Thurrock, Milton Keyness, Bournemouth Christchurch and Poole etc)
I forgot about Island Line too, but I kinda regarded it as part of SWR (lack of distinct branding) but that technically counts.

 

[Gareth]

Surely it's Greater London that has the most.

Merseyside can match South Yorkshire's seven...

Avanti
LNW
TfW
EMR
TPE
Northern
Merseyrail

 

[alistairlees]

I was thinking about the (English) counties served by only one TOC and the only one I can really think of is Suffolk with Greater Anglia. Any others?

I would think West Midlands county (Birmingham) has the most: Avanti West Coast, Chiltern Railways, West Midlands Trains (WMR/LNR), CrossCountry, Transport For Wales: any others?

I think the answer is just Isle of Wight, served only by SWR.

Suffolk is served by EMR trains at Brandon, though it seems that the railway line is the county border at that point, so you might be able to argue that it’s only if westbound EMR trains stop that this is true. At the moment only one EMR train a day stops, so far as I can tell - and that’s eastbound. Make of that what you will!

 

[lancededcena]

I think the answer is just Isle of Wight, served only by SWR.

Suffolk is served by EMR trains at Brandon, though it seems that the railway line is the county border at that point, so you might be able to argue that it’s only if westbound EMR trains stop that this is true. At the moment only one EMR train a day stops, so far as I can tell - and that’s eastbound. Make of that what you will!

Brandon station is physically in Norfolk so nope that doesn't count, however it serves the Suffolk town so kinda half correct.

 

[mirodo]

Surely the answer to the county with the most TOCs this is the same answer to what station has the most TOCs calling at it - I think Manchester Piccadilly, Doncaster, and Stockport were up there:

If you add York’s 6 (LNER, Cross Country, Grand Central, TPE, Northern, EMR) to the Hull Trains service at Selby, then North Yorkshire ties for first place with seven.

 

[Gareth]

Greater London has pretty much everything bar TPE, Northern, TfW, Merseyrail and Scotrail.

 

[alistairlees]

Brandon station is physically in Norfolk so nope that doesn't count, however it serves the Suffolk town so kinda half correct.

The OS 1:25000 map shows the border parallel and immediately adjacent to the railway line (albeit on the south side) at that point. Whether that means it is south of the line, or is actually on the line (but is shown south of the line for readability), I don’t know.
The local history website http://www.brandonsuffolk.com/history-of-brandon-suffolk.php does seem to suggest that the railway line forms the border, though, meaning that the two platforms would be in different counties. Unless there is a very small deviation, of course.

 

[alistairlees]

Greater London has pretty much everything bar TPE, Northern, TfW, Merseyrail and Scotrail.

And cross country?

 

[lancededcena]

The OS 1:25000 map shows the border parallel and immediately adjacent to the railway line (albeit on the south side) at that point. Whether that means it is south of the line, or is actually on the line (but is shown south of the line for readability), I don’t know.
The local history website http://www.brandonsuffolk.com/history-of-brandon-suffolk.php does seem to suggest that the railway line forms the border, though, meaning that the two platforms would be in different counties. Unless there is a very small deviation, of course.

Hmmm interesting, doing my own research, the general consensus is that the border is the River Little Ouse and the station is north of that so it is part of Norfolk but it seems like Suffolk and Norfolk moved their county signs further towards the station but I don't trust them, when I go on road trips the county signs are often a few metres from the actual border anyway (according to Google Maps), but I could be wrong and that is the official boundary.

Also Wikipedia thinks its Norfolk but Google Maps think its Suffolk, confusing confusing.

 

[alistairlees]

Hmmm interesting, doing my own research, the general consensus is that the border is the River Little Ouse and the station is north of that so it is part of Norfolk but it seems like Suffolk and Norfolk moved their county signs further towards the station but I don't trust them, when I go on road trips the county signs are often a few metres from the actual border anyway (according to Google Maps), but I could be wrong and that is the official boundary.

Also Wikipedia thinks its Norfolk but Google Maps think its Suffolk, confusing confusing.

Whilst this is not perfect, it is at least clear that the border runs parallel to the railway line at this point: https://www.suffolk.gov.uk/assets/Roads-and-transport/public-rights-of-way/Brandon.pdf

 

[si404]

Medway is part of the ceremonial county of Kent so not counted

A clarification of what you meant by counties would have been nice to begin with if we're only counting certain types of counties. (It's definitely not your fault the whole thing is a mess!)

Medway wouldn't count anyway due to Thameslink's Luton-Rainham service.

Though they don't count, here's some non-metropolitan counties with only 1 TOC:
Swindon: GWR
Thurrock: c2c
Blackburn with Darwen: Northern

With Ceremonial Counties (which may also be other types of counties), City of London (while failing to beat Rutland's 2 TOCs with 1 station) does well with 6 TOCs despite only 6 stations.

1. Southeastern (Blackfriars, Cannon Street)
2. GTR: Thameslink (City Thameslink, Blackfriars), Great Northern (Moorgate)
3. London Overground (Liverpool St)
4. TfL Rail (Liverpool St)
5. Greater Anglia (Liverpool St)
6. c2c (Fenchurch St)

 

[mirodo]

https://norfolkcc.maps.arcgis.com/apps/webappviewer/index.html shows the border as being the southern boundary of the railway land.

 

[London Trains]

Greater London...

Avanti West Coast
C2C
Caledonian Sleeper
Chiltern Railways
East Midlands Railway
Greater Anglia
Great Western Railway
GTR (Southern/Thameslink/Great Northern)
London North Eastern Railway
London Overground
Southeastern
South Western Railway
West Midlands Trains (LNWR)

If open access counts:

Hull Trains
Grand Central
Eurostar
Heathrow Express

 

[Lewlew]

Greater London...

Avanti West Coast
C2C
Caledonian Sleeper
Chiltern Railways
East Midlands Railway
Greater Anglia
Great Western Railway
GTR (Southern/Thameslink/Great Northern)
London North Eastern Railway
London Overground
Southeastern
South Western Railway
West Midlands Trains (LNWR)

If open access counts:

Hull Trains
Grand Central
Eurostar
Heathrow Express

Don't forget TfL Rail and London Underground (Bakerloo Queen's Park - Harrow as well as District line Richmond and Wimbledon branches all run on Network Rail track)

Heathrow Express is run by GWR now so does that make it similar to Gatwick/Stansted Express?

 

[London Trains]

Heathrow Express is run by GWR now so does that make it similar to Gatwick/Stansted Express?

Yep, just forgot it was GWR operated now.

 

[Class465pacer]

The following counties (in England) have 6 or more TOCs serving it:

Cheshire - 8 (TfW, EMR, Caledonian Sleeper, WMT, Northern, CrossCountry, Avanti West Coast, Merseyrail)

Greater London - 17 (Southeastern, WMT, Avanti West Coast, Overground, Caledonian Sleeper, c2c, LNER, Thameslink-GN, Hull Trains, Grand Central, Greater Anglia, Tfl Rail, Chiltern Railways, GWR, Southern, SWR, Eurostar)

Greater Manchester - 6 (Northern, TransPennine Express, TfW, CrossCountry, EMR, Avanti West Coast)

Hertfordshire - 10 (Avanti West Coast, WMT, Southern, LNER, Hull Trains, Thameslink-GN, EMR, Chiltern Railways, Greater Anglia, Overground)

City of London - 6 (TfL Rail, Thameslink-GN, Southeastern, Greater Anglia, c2c, Overground)

Merseyside - 7 (Merseyrail, EMR, WMT, Northern, TransPennine Express, TfW, Avanti West Coast)

North Yorkshire - 6 (CrossCountry, EMR, TransPennine Express, Grand Central, LNER, Northern)

South Yorkshire - 7 (CrossCountry, EMR, Hull Trains, TransPennine Express, Grand Central, Northern, LNER)

West Yorkshire - 6 (CrossCountry, LNER, EMR, TransPennine Express, Northern, Grand Central)

 

[4REP]

Moray County (Scotland) by scotrail only?

 

[4REP]

Elgin and Nairn railway stations in Moray are only run by Scotrail

 

[mirodo]

The following counties (in England) have 6 or more TOCs serving it:

Cheshire - 8 (TfW, EMR, Caledonian Sleeper, WMT, Northern, CrossCountry, Avanti West Coast, Merseyrail)

Greater London - 17 (Southeastern, WMT, Avanti West Coast, Overground, Caledonian Sleeper, c2c, LNER, Thameslink-GN, Hull Trains, Grand Central, Greater Anglia, Tfl Rail, Chiltern Railways, GWR, Southern, SWR, Eurostar)

Greater Manchester - 6 (Northern, TransPennine Express, TfW, CrossCountry, EMR, Avanti West Coast)

Hertfordshire - 10 (Avanti West Coast, WMT, Southern, LNER, Hull Trains, Thameslink-GN, EMR, Chiltern Railways, Greater Anglia, Overground)

City of London - 6 (TfL Rail, Thameslink-GN, Southeastern, Greater Anglia, c2c, Overground)

Merseyside - 7 (Merseyrail, EMR, WMT, Northern, TransPennine Express, TfW, Avanti West Coast)

North Yorkshire - 6 (CrossCountry, EMR, TransPennine Express, Grand Central, LNER, Northern)

South Yorkshire - 7 (CrossCountry, EMR, Hull Trains, TransPennine Express, Grand Central, Northern, LNER)

West Yorkshire - 6 (CrossCountry, LNER, EMR, TransPennine Express, Northern, Grand Central)

North Yorkshire also has Hull Trains at Selby.

 

[Gareth]

And cross country?

Yes?

 

[_toommm_]

Greater London has pretty much everything bar TPE, Northern, TfW, Merseyrail and Scotrail.

Good shout, I forgot about the ceremonial counties, I was thinking of the original 14 or so counties.

 

[pompeyfan]

So in terms of counties with the fewest, I would imagine there is several with just 2 TOCs operating. Cornwall only has GWR and XC, and as far as I can work out, West Sussex only has GWR and GTR.