HS2: South Yorkshire Parkway Report

[Jorge Da Silva]

I did not suggest that either. I pointed out the disadvantages of running two fairly closely located stations. That does not lead logically to the notion of closing the one most convenient to the settlement it serves and relocating all services to a skanky industrial area on the periphery of town that isn't even directly on a major road.

I am not suggesting closing Central either. The area could be redeveloped around Masborough.

 

[MarkyT]

I am not suggesting closing Central either. The area could be redeveloped around Masborough.

It could I agree, but is far less suitable for that, being located close to existing terraced housing. Reopening Masborough seems to me to be a very 1980s type of solution. It is really very poor for the town centre, without the easier road access of a Parkgate site, which would be awful for the town centre and public transport connectivity. Just because there was once a station at Masborough and there are still a few original buildings there doesn't make it a good site at all.

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

It could I agree, but is far less suitable for that, being located close to existing terraced housing. Reopening Masborough seems to me to be a very 1980s type of solution. It is really very poor for the town centre, without the easier road access of a Parkgate site, which would be awful for the town centre and public transport connectivity. Just because there was once a station at Masborough and there are still a few original buildings there doesn't make it a good site at all.

it is a more feasible solution and a far more likely option that they will go with.

 

[HST43257]

Personally I think that Wakefield loses a lot out of HS2, with (I’m guessing) a reduction of services to London via the ECML because of HS2 serving Leeds. If you could have a Wakefield station near the junction of the Leeds and York HS2 lines, that would be pretty good I think. It is also worth mentioning that it would be close to the M62, on a part where both the M1 and A1(M) are not far away. It is also a place where you can build platforms for the Normanton to Wakefield bit of line. I’ll pop a picture below to help explain it all better. It will be a screenshot of the HS2 interactive route map with a red dot to show the station location.

Alternatively (or also), I think that Sheffield isn’t the biggest winner out of HS2. Where the M1 meets the M18, you could build a parkway that serves Sheffield, Rotherham and the surrounding area. This could also mean the construction of an extra branch of the Sheffield Supertram towards this HS2 station, perhaps using the lesser used line through Tinsley and Catcliffe, before joining up with the Supertram At Meadowhall, where it would join up with the existing Supertram network. Once again, a picture is below in the same for most as the Wakefield one.

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

Personally I think that Wakefield loses a lot out of HS2, with (I’m guessing) a reduction of services to London via the ECML because of HS2 serving Leeds. If you could have a Wakefield station near the junction of the Leeds and York HS2 lines, that would be pretty good I think. It is also worth mentioning that it would be close to the M62, on a part where both the M1 and A1(M) are not far away. It is also a place where you can build platforms for the Normanton to Wakefield bit of line. I’ll pop a picture below to help explain it all better. It will be a screenshot of the HS2 interactive route map with a red dot to show the station location.

Alternatively (or also), I think that Sheffield isn’t the biggest winner out of HS2. Where the M1 meets the M18, you could build a parkway that serves Sheffield, Rotherham and the surrounding area. This could also mean the construction of an extra branch of the Sheffield Supertram towards this HS2 station, perhaps using the lesser used line through Tinsley and Catcliffe, before joining up with the Supertram At Meadowhall, where it would join up with the existing Supertram network. Once again, a picture is below in the same for most as the Wakefield one.

Definitely not also. Wakefield may still retain its London services that may go to Bradford or have more stops. Wakefield one is not a bad idea but too close to Leeds and does not serve South Yorkshire.

 

[johnnychips]

Personally I think that Wakefield loses a lot out of HS2, with (I’m guessing) a reduction of services to London via the ECML because of HS2 serving Leeds. If you could have a Wakefield station near the junction of the Leeds and York HS2 lines, that would be pretty good I think. It is also worth mentioning that it would be close to the M62, on a part where both the M1 and A1(M) are not far away. It is also a place where you can build platforms for the Normanton to Wakefield bit of line. I’ll pop a picture below to help explain it all better. It will be a screenshot of the HS2 interactive route map with a red dot to show the station location.

Alternatively (or also), I think that Sheffield isn’t the biggest winner out of HS2. Where the M1 meets the M18, you could build a parkway that serves Sheffield, Rotherham and the surrounding area. This could also mean the construction of an extra branch of the Sheffield Supertram towards this HS2 station, perhaps using the lesser used line through Tinsley and Catcliffe, before joining up with the Supertram At Meadowhall, where it would join up with the existing Supertram network. Once again, a picture is below in the same for most as the Wakefield one.

If they chose Hemsworth, that is almost Wakefield Parkway; if they chose Wales there is your Sheffield solution. Rotherham - Central or Masborough -is not suitable.

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

If they chose Hemsworth, that is almost Wakefield Parkway; if they chose Wales there is your Sheffield solution. Rotherham - Central or Masborough -is not suitable.

Although Rotherham Main Line Station is likely under NPR but not the best option as a South Yorkshire Parkway

 

[johnnychips]

Although Rotherham Main Line Station is likely under NPR but not the best option as a South Yorkshire Parkway

Yes, there are so many ideas flying round it gets confusing. Another idea I’m sure I read in the above report is that HS2 trains could continue to Leeds from Sheffield via Wales (but I assume this is not contingent on the station being built there, and would need a chord). In either case, the problem of the bottleneck just north of Sheffield station needs a solution (2-track, in a rock cutting, very near to Park Hill flats).

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

Yes, there are so many ideas flying round it gets confusing. Another idea I’m sure I read in the above report is that HS2 trains could continue to Leeds from Sheffield via Wales (but I assume this is not contingent on the station being built there, and would need a chord). In either case, the problem of the bottleneck just north of Sheffield station needs a solution (2-track, in a rock cutting, very near to Park Hill flats).

not via Wales but via Dearne Valley Parkway or Hemsworth continuing North to Leeds.

 

[Glenn1969]

But why build a South Yorkshire Parkway when existing services will continue to serve these areas with an HS2 connection from changing at Sheffield Midland? Just stop XC services at Rotherham and save the expense

 

[johnnychips]

not via Wales but via Dearne Valley Parkway or Hemsworth continuing North to Leeds.

5.4.6.
A station at Wales would have good existing transport
connectivity, including conventional rail links, potentially providing connectivity between Sheffield and Leeds via Wales, and the possibility of extending NPR services between Manchester and Sheffield onwards to Wales to enhance connectivity with NPR. The station at Wales would also require the lowest length of mainline realignment and platform loops to enable passive provision.

So from what I can gather, this would be an NPR service. In general the report seems to conclude that a parkway station would serve S Yorkshire better, and be more cost effective than extending HS2 services beyond Sheffield, which will have been slowed down because of their conventional journey via Chesterfield

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

5.4.6.
A station at Wales would have good existing transport
connectivity, including conventional rail links, potentially providing connectivity between Sheffield and Leeds via Wales, and the possibility of extending NPR services between Manchester and Sheffield onwards to Wales to enhance connectivity with NPR. The station at Wales would also require the lowest length of mainline realignment and platform loops to enable passive provision.

So from what I can gather, this would be an NPR service. In general the report seems to conclude that a parkway station would serve S Yorkshire better, and be more cost effective than extending HS2 services beyond Sheffield, which will have been slowed down because of their conventional journey via Chesterfield

How can it operate via Wales thats the line that runs between Sheffield and Lincoln???????

If Wales was chosen it could be:

1. 1tph: Sheffield to Cleethorpes via Gainsborough Central
2. 1tph: Leeds to Lincoln via Sheffield
3. 1tph: Manchester Piccadilly to Lincoln (New NPR service or the third Hope Valley Fast service???)
4. 2tph: Birmingham Curzon Street to Leeds
5. 1tph: London to York

 

[johnnychips]

How can it operate via Wales thats the line that runs between Sheffield and Lincoln???????

Put a chord in from the Sheffield to Lincoln line going onto HS2? I thought it was strange too. Unless it is suggesting Sheffield to Leeds passengers change at Wales, which I can’t imagine being much quicker than XC, if at all. In general the report is hamstrung by not having concrete proposals from NPR.

 

[Jorge Da Silva]

Put a chord in from the Sheffield to Lincoln line going onto HS2? I thought it was strange too. Unless it is suggesting Sheffield to Leeds passengers change at Wales, which I can’t imagine being much quicker than XC, if at all. In general the report is hamstrung by not having concrete proposals from NPR.

There was no mention of a chord as far as i read it. I think it was suggesting changing at Wales not running a service via there.