Spotted this coach on a Friends Facebook page today

[Dixie]

I subscribe to the photo feed of Mario Stefani, the Swiss Railway photographer. In today's feed of old slides he has scanned was this very British looking carriage (except for what looks a pantograph on the roof!) It appears to have a UIC no. of LKM10A 39 SIG X 60 85 99 93 110 2

 

[father_jack]

Wikedpedia said

Switzerland
In 1994, three sleepers were sold to Swiss bogie manufacturer Schweizerische Industrie Gesellschaft for tilt train testing.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Mark_3
Is this it ?

 

[Dixie]

May have been something to do with further developing the bogies on the MK 4 coach which was developed with tilting in mind, but never actually achieved.

 

[Jamesrob637]

I'm sure I saw a picture of these on the move somewhere. A makeshift cab was fitted to the end of one of the coaches.

 

[Dixie]

Mario has replied that the SIG car or self-propelled car served as a vehicle to develop the pendulum bogies that would be used on the Swiss ICN trains.

 

[43096]

Mario has replied that the SIG car or self-propelled car served as a vehicle to develop the pendulum bogies that would be used on the Swiss ICN trains.

There were three Mark 3 sleepers exported for that project: 10581/673/705.

 

[James James]

You can find some more pictures starting here, interestingly in the first photo they seem to be being used as barrier coaches for the old pendolinos:
https://www.bahnforum.ch/index.php/Thread/21691-Räder-und-Kleber/?postID=442537#post442537

(None of those photos show it driving itself, and none of the forum posts mention such operation, whcih of course doesn't mean much.)

 

[contrex]

You can find some more pictures starting here, interestingly in the first photo they seem to be being used as barrier coaches for the old pendolinos:
https://www.bahnforum.ch/index.php/Thread/21691-Räder-und-Kleber/?postID=442537#post442537

(None of those photos show it driving itself, and none of the forum posts mention such operation, whcih of course doesn't mean much.)

One of the photos linked to partly shows a vehicle end which seems to have a window in the sealed central corridor connection area, and a 'cow catcher' below.

 

[Dixie]

From Mario: The SIG car, Ex BR, was used to test the pantographs, it was motorized with a Te IV engine, there were 3 cars fitted, they went back and forth in the Emmental also to test the pendulum. 10003 had a collision with a truck on a level crossing in Schüpfheim on 06-11-1996 and was scrapped on 27-03-1997.

 

[Dixie]

You can find some more pictures starting here, interestingly in the first photo they seem to be being used as barrier coaches for the old pendolinos:
https://www.bahnforum.ch/index.php/Thread/21691-Räder-und-Kleber/?postID=442537#post442537

Thanks for that link, very interesting.

 

[Jamesrob637]

They were used due to the smaller UK loading gauge meaning that the tilt was still well within the profile limitations.

 

[Mitchell Hurd]

How weird - I was having a nosy last night on Wikipedia regarding Class 37's being regeared / refurbished for Nightstar services.

I guess it the train carriage in the photo has something to do with it?

 

[43096]

How weird - I was having a nosy last night on Wikipedia regarding Class 37's being regeared / refurbished for Nightstar services.

I guess it the train carriage in the photo has something to do with it?

No, totally unrelated.

The photo that started this thread is one of three Mark 3 sleepers sold to SIG in Switzerland back in 1994. They were used as a test train for SIG's tilting bogies - the restricted UK loading gauge making them ideal for this. The technology developed by SIG was used under the tilting ICN sets built for SBB (SBB class 500).

So, nothing to do with Nightstar. In fact, probably more to do with Class 390 Pendolinos as SIG's rail business was sold to Fiat Ferroviaria and then on to Alstom.

 

[James James]

Now at first I thought the photo with the Pendolino was with the Mk3's being used as barrier coaches. But since the loco isn't attached, maybe they were actually using the Pendolino as traction (to push or pull the MK3's), since the Pendolino is the only train that can go full speed on the curves on that stretch (and/or any of the tilt-required stretches)?

(I'm guessing they also needed the pantograph to test the tilting pantograph mechanism regardless of who provided traction.)

I was curious about the "Te IV engine", I'm guessing that means they borrowed the motors from the Te IV (which is an older shunting loco). That makes sense: that would make these coaches capable of propelling themselves at lower speeds, but they'd use external traction (either conventional locos on some lines, or Pendolino on tilting lines) for higher speeds?

 

[hexagon789]

How weird - I was having a nosy last night on Wikipedia regarding Class 37's being regeared / refurbished for Nightstar services.

I guess it the train carriage in the photo has something to do with it?

The Nightstar sleeping cars went to Canada where they were refurbished and put to use on the Montreal-Quebec corridor and The Océan night train.

 

[edwin_m]

Some Mk3 sleepers were converted for use as generator cars for Nightstar services when hauled by 37s. I think a generator car was to be sandwiched between a pair of locos. Other than using the same donor design I don't think there was any connection between the generator cars and the SIG conversions.