Train delayed, then skipped Castleford (but not cancelled!)

[LMS 4F]

If this service was curtailed as suggested and did not go to Sheffield then this would have the effect of moving people onto either XC or the direct services on this route. In either case this would just lead to more overcrowding on these trains.
The journey times from the stations denied a direct service would of course be increased due to the need to change. The present service seems to be well used and copes well but like most services in the Northern area could do with longer trains at peak times.

 

[tbtc]

If this service was curtailed as suggested and did not go to Sheffield then this would have the effect of moving people onto either XC or the direct services on this route. In either case this would just lead to more overcrowding on these trains.
The journey times from the stations denied a direct service would of course be increased due to the need to change. The present service seems to be well used and copes well but like most services in the Northern area could do with longer trains at peak times.

There's a half hourly Leeds - Kirkgate - Barnsley - Sheffield service operated by Northern - this overtakes the "via Castleford" service en route - for example the 10:32 slow from Leeds gets to Normanton at 10:57 but the 10:38 semi-fast has already passed Normanton at speed at 10:49.

Nobody using the "via Castleford" service is going to swap onto the XC service (which runs a different route between Leeds and Meadowhall and doesn't serve any of the same intermediate stops) - the hourly XC service overtakes one of the two semi-fast Northern services (as well as overtaking the Dearne Valley stopper between Leeds and Sheffield too). The small number of people doing Castleford/ Normanton to Sheffield would just change at Kirkgate.

However the fact that the Castleford section means around fifteen minutes penalty for anyone doing a journey like Leeds - Kirkgate/ Barnsley (compared to the semi-fast) shows how unattractive that service is for any medium/longer distance passengers. Hence the suggestion that it's either diverted away from Castleford or cut somewhere further south.

If the Northern Connect service through Westgate ever happens (?), it might be time to just accept that the semi-fast isn't much use for long distance passengers and insert stops at Darton/ Normanton (and use the current Leeds - Castleford path for a service that extends to Pontefract/ Knottingly instead).

The fifteen minute penalty just to serve Castleford is a waste of resources (given that Castleford has another service to Wakefield - the Huddersfield service) and dates back to the days when BR tried to stretch their resources to provide a service that ticked as many boxes as possible but without being of much use for longer distance passengers.

 

[LMS 4F]

There's a half hourly Leeds - Kirkgate - Barnsley - Sheffield service operated by Northern - this overtakes the "via Castleford" service en route - for example the 10:32 slow from Leeds gets to Normanton at 10:57 but the 10:38 semi-fast has already passed Normanton at speed at 10:49.

Nobody using the "via Castleford" service is going to swap onto the XC service (which runs a different route between Leeds and Meadowhall and doesn't serve any of the same intermediate stops) - the hourly XC service overtakes one of the two semi-fast Northern services (as well as overtaking the Dearne Valley stopper between Leeds and Sheffield too). The small number of people doing Castleford/ Normanton to Sheffield would just change at Kirkgate.

However the fact that the Castleford section means around fifteen minutes penalty for anyone doing a journey like Leeds - Kirkgate/ Barnsley (compared to the semi-fast) shows how unattractive that service is for any medium/longer distance passengers. Hence the suggestion that it's either diverted away from Castleford or cut somewhere further south.

If the Northern Connect service through Westgate ever happens (?), it might be time to just accept that the semi-fast isn't much use for long distance passengers and insert stops at Darton/ Normanton (and use the current Leeds - Castleford path for a service that extends to Pontefract/ Knottingly instead).

The fifteen minute penalty just to serve Castleford is a waste of resources (given that Castleford has another service to Wakefield - the Huddersfield service) and dates back to the days when BR tried to stretch their resources to provide a service that ticked as many boxes as possible but without being of much use for longer distance passengers.

If the direct service to Sheffield from Cas was removed then my options for the journey would be to change at Kirkgate into a faster Northern or go to Leeds for either that or XC. I would chose XC as it is the fastest as do many people already leading to overcrowding on a long distance service which is the source of much complaint elsewhere.
Many other services have a reversal although admittedly the Castleford one is longer than most.
My final point is that a lot of services in this area are supported by Council money and I would suggest they wouldn't be in favour of any service cuts.

 

[northernchris]

If the Northern Connect service through Westgate ever happens (?), it might be time to just accept that the semi-fast isn't much use for long distance passengers and insert stops at Darton/ Normanton (and use the current Leeds - Castleford path for a service that extends to Pontefract/ Knottingly instead).

This would be a sensible approach, and would be the perfect chance to improve Normanton's service to Leeds

The fifteen minute penalty just to serve Castleford is a waste of resources (given that Castleford has another service to Wakefield - the Huddersfield service) and dates back to the days when BR tried to stretch their resources to provide a service that ticked as many boxes as possible but without being of much use for longer distance passengers.

The current timetable works out nicely with 3 diagrams though, by removing the Castleford diversion may not necessarily means less units and crew are required