"Network Rover" ticket

[StephenHunter]

Why is there no 'rover ticket' available that covers entirely of the Network Gold Card area? It seems like an obvious thing to have.

 

[JonathanH]

Why is there no 'rover ticket' available that covers entirely of the Network Gold Card area? It seems like an obvious thing to have.

There could never be any agreement between the many different operators on cost and the distribution of revenues.

It would need to be around £200 for three days and even then the operators would consider it potentially revenue negative.

Non starter I am afraid.

 

[RJ]

Why is there no 'rover ticket' available that covers entirely of the Network Gold Card area? It seems like an obvious thing to have.

If you get a job with GTR you get a free pass covering most of the south and south east. Partner with someone who works for First and you get lots of cheap day tickets for SWR, GWR and soon, Avanti. That about covers the south side. North side, too many different operators and parent companies.

 

[Wallsendmag]

If you get a job with GTR you get a free pass covering most of the south and south east. Partner with someone who works for First and you get lots of cheap day tickets for SWR, GWR and soon, Avanti. That about covers the south side. North side, too many different operators and parent companies.

Would it not just be simpler to invent a time machine go back to the early 90s and get a job with BR?

 

[Silver Cobra]

It would need to be around £200 for three days and even then the operators would consider it potentially revenue negative.

At £200, that would be entering the territory of the All Line Rover. If a 3-day version of the ALR existed, based on the current cost of a 7-day standard ALR at £540, it would be around £230-£250 (£250 more likely as a small mark-up would probably be added for being a shorter length). So a rover for only the south-east would have to cost a fair bit less than that to be worthwhile.

 

[RJ]

Would it not just be simpler to invent a time machine go back to the early 90s and get a job with BR?

Maybe

 

[JonathanH]

At £200, that would be entering the territory of the All Line Rover. If a 3-day version of the ALR existed, based on the current cost of a 7-day standard ALR at £540, it would be around £230-£250 (£250 more likely as a small mark-up would probably be added for being a shorter length). So a rover for only the south-east would have to cost a fair bit less than that to be worthwhile.

Yes, but the Gold Card area is too large for a rover ticket and involves too many operators. An off-peak day return from Waterloo to Weymouth is £72.40. I'm not convinced of the usefulness of an all-directions rover from London - the ambitions would be better served by having rovers for the areas covered by each franchise area. In what way is a rover better for normal passengers than simply buying off-peak day returns to the desired destinations and using break of journey as necessary?

 

[MikeWM]

At £200, that would be entering the territory of the All Line Rover. If a 3-day version of the ALR existed, based on the current cost of a 7-day standard ALR at £540, it would be around £230-£250 (£250 more likely as a small mark-up would probably be added for being a shorter length).

Unfortunately that seems a bit optimistic, given that the only two remaining rovers that come in both 3-in-7 and 7-day varieties (East Midlands and Heart Of England) have their 3-day version at around 76% of the cost of the 7-day version.

The Thames Rover is better, but that is 3 consecutive days, rather than 3 in 7, and the 3 day version is still at about 55% of the cost of the 7-day.

 

[MikeWM]

...the ambitions would be better served by having rovers for the areas covered by each franchise area.

An Anglia one would be particularly useful, given the number of dead-end branches. Despite living fairly nearby, I still haven't done the Southminster, Braintree, Sudbury or Walton-on-the-Naze branches. It would be nice to get them all done in one go with one ticket.

 

[AM9]

Why is there no 'rover ticket' available that covers entirely of the Network Gold Card area? It seems like an obvious thing to have.

Given the size of the NSE area and the diversity of rail travel destinations, (as in city, seaside, countryside, and other potential attractions), it is unlikely to appeal to many tourists and general leisure travellers, but I'm sure that many rail enthusiasts would want it.
In reality, fares from London to the extremities aren't that expensive, so the only interested buyers of a rover ticket would be those wanting to spend all day travelling on trains. That is probably why the question has been asked on a niche forum such as this.

 

[RJ]

Given the size of the NSE area and the diversity of rail travel destinations, (as in city, seaside, countryside, and other potential attractions), it is unlikely to appeal to many tourists and general leisure travellers, but I'm sure that many rail enthusiasts would want it.
In reality, fares from London to the extremities aren't that expensive, so the only interested buyers of a rover ticket would be those wanting to spend all day travelling on trains. That is probably why the question has been asked on a niche forum such as this.

True, although sharp customers will cotton on if there's a good, if unintended deal to be had and spread the word. The ALR had to be changed and I presume people clocking that it was cheaper than the cheapest available return in some cases played a part in this.

 

[JonathanH]

An Anglia one would be particularly useful, given the number of dead-end branches.

In the late 90s / early 00s the multi-council sponsored Sunday Rover ticket was valid for travel on all of the Great Eastern branches - eg Wickford to Southminster, Witham to Braintree, Colchester to Clacton / Walton, Manningtree to Harwich Town - as Essex County Council subsidised part of the Sunday service.

It is a shame that ticket (or something with similar validity) didn't survive. A local area ticket makes much more sense for exploring new places than one over a wider area.

 

[stevetay3]

There was a Network Rover covering the whole network south east area. I traveled with one in the late eightys.

 

[dutchflyer]

Given the size of the NSE area and the diversity of rail travel destinations, (as in city, seaside, countryside, and other potential attractions), it is unlikely to appeal to many tourists and general leisure travellers, but I'm sure that many rail enthusiasts would want it.
In reality, fares from London to the extremities aren't that expensive, so the only interested buyers of a rover ticket would be those wanting to spend all day travelling on trains. That is probably why the question has been asked on a niche forum such as this.

Well, there Is such a ticket specifically aimed at foreign tourists, see it as a slimmed down version of a BritRailpass. And its considerably cheaper as the prices mentioned here (Iĺl try to look into that to follow up).
Compared to what most foreign tourists are used to in paying for a similar distance @ home, ATOC/exBR fares are astronomically high in general.
The best advice for the OP; get yourself an adress out of the UK for 6 monthes and then qualify for a InterRail thats also usable in the UK.

 

[A0]

There was a Network Rover covering the whole network south east area. I traveled with one in the late eightys.

I think there were a few 'one day' specials - certainly there was one shortly after Network South East launched and another a couple of years later. But I don't think there's ever been a regular 'walk up and buy' south-east Rover / Ranger.

It's probably impractical given the split of operators and the fact that all routes lead to London. That said there are a few gaps which it would be nice to see filled - for example the Anglia rangers all end at Ipswich / Cambridge south whereas covering Colchester / Clacton / Sudbury might be popular.

South West don't really have any day rangers to speak of - they're covered in the Heart of Wessex but that's the Weymouth - Westbury line. Chiltern are even more limited - they are part of the WM Day ranger north of Leamington and on Oxfordshire but only between Banbury and Kings Sutton - Bicester - Kings Sutton and Bicester to Oxford, the latter all in Oxon isn't covered by the Oxfordshire ranger.

It would also be nice to see some of the 'circular' type rangers / rovers you see in the north replicated in the south - for example Oxford - Cotswold Line - Worcester - Cheltenham - Swindon - Didcot - Oxford could be a good marketing opportunity all around the Cotswolds.

 

[JonathanH]

There was a Network Rover covering the whole network south east area. I traveled with one in the late eightys.

But I don't think there's ever been a regular 'walk up and buy' south-east Rover / Ranger.

There was one - late 80s / early 90s - obviously gone by the time of privatisation. I'm not sure how long it lasted or whether it was only valid on NSE trains in the area. The point is that there was one organisation at the time. I'll have to see if I can find a leaflet from back then.

 

[JonathanH]

It would also be nice to see some of the 'circular' type rangers / rovers you see in the north replicated in the south - for example Oxford - Cotswold Line - Worcester - Cheltenham - Swindon - Didcot - Oxford could be a good marketing opportunity all around the Cotswolds.

Like this - covers the most relevant bits without the risk of revenue extraction
https://www.cotswoldsaonb.org.uk/vi...swolds-train-station/discoverer-one-day-pass/

 

[JonathanH]

South West don't really have any day rangers to speak of - they're covered in the Heart of Wessex but that's the Weymouth - Westbury line. Chiltern are even more limited - they are part of the WM Day ranger north of Leamington and on Oxfordshire but only between Banbury and Kings Sutton - Bicester - Kings Sutton and Bicester to Oxford, the latter all in Oxon isn't covered by the Oxfordshire ranger.

The problem with linear routes with a reasonable frequency is really working out what a day ranger offers that a off-peak day return doesn't. In the South Western Rail case, if you buy a return from London to Portsmouth you can travel out via Winchester and back via Guildford, you can break your journey on the way at multiple places. The same is true on the Chiltern routes if you buy a return from London to Aylesbury you can use both routes and break your journey where you want to.

What is the attraction to the operator of giving away more travel for not much more cost?

 

[Nunners]

Like this - covers the most relevant bits without the risk of revenue extraction
https://www.cotswoldsaonb.org.uk/vi...swolds-train-station/discoverer-one-day-pass/

You would think that, but it does undercut some fares to Yate as well as undercutting bus fares (if bought with railcard). So it extracts revenue even if bus and train aren't used together (it's even better if you need a bus and train)

 

[coxy]

I believe Barry Doe (Rail Magazine) gave an example of using a weekly season ticket as a Rover.

I can't find the article, so nothing to fact check at present, but it was something like a Southampton Central to London Terminals ticket which was around £170 for 7 days.

Although this ticket does not allow travel across the entire Network Area, it does give you an idea of how a carefully selected ticket can give you a large number of routes to travel on.

In the example above, you could head up to Basingstoke, then Woking and into Waterloo, or Basingstoke to Reading and into Paddington, or back onto SWR services at Reading and head to Waterloo that way. Travel was also permitted along the South Coast towards Brighton, then head north through Gatwick and into Victoria.

If I can find the article I'll post an update.

 

[JonathanH]

Yes, £94.90 for a seven day season between Weymouth and Birchington via Barnham could get you a lot of travel for a week.

You would be fairly hard pressed to make that return journey in a day.

 

[Ianno87]

I believe Barry Doe (Rail Magazine) gave an example of using a weekly season ticket as a Rover.

I can't find the article, so nothing to fact check at present, but it was something like a Southampton Central to London Terminals ticket which was around £170 for 7 days.

Although this ticket does not allow travel across the entire Network Area, it does give you an idea of how a carefully selected ticket can give you a large number of routes to travel on.

In the example above, you could head up to Basingstoke, then Woking and into Waterloo, or Basingstoke to Reading and into Paddington, or back onto SWR services at Reading and head to Waterloo that way. Travel was also permitted along the South Coast towards Brighton, then head north through Gatwick and into Victoria.

If I can find the article I'll post an update.

Yes, £94.90 for a seven day season between Weymouth and Birchington via Barnham could get you a lot of travel for a week.

You would be fairly hard pressed to make that return journey in a day.

I used to call my Cambridge-London season ticket a "West Anglia Great Northern Rover".

 

[route101]

I thought about this other day , you have the Oyster/Travelcard area then if you want to do the lines outwith , nothing .

 

[JonathanH]

I thought about this other day , you have the Oyster/Travelcard area then if you want to do the lines outwith , nothing .

You don't need to travel all of them in a day. What is wrong with using off-peak day returns beyond the Oyster / Travelcard area?

 

[route101]

You don't need to travel all of them in a day. What is wrong with using off-peak day returns beyond the Oyster / Travelcard area?

Can get confusing and expensive , buying multilple tickets.

 

[Haywain]

Can get confusing and expensive , buying multilple tickets.

If you think that could be expensive, imagine how a rover ticket might be priced.

 

[Rover]

I believe Barry Doe (Rail Magazine) gave an example of using a weekly season ticket as a Rover.

I can't find the article, so nothing to fact check at present, but it was something like a Southampton Central to London Terminals ticket which was around £170 for 7 days.

Although this ticket does not allow travel across the entire Network Area, it does give you an idea of how a carefully selected ticket can give you a large number of routes to travel on.

In the example above, you could head up to Basingstoke, then Woking and into Waterloo, or Basingstoke to Reading and into Paddington, or back onto SWR services at Reading and head to Waterloo that way. Travel was also permitted along the South Coast towards Brighton, then head north through Gatwick and into Victoria.

If I can find the article I'll post an update.

I believe this is what you are referring to; extract from Rail 878 May 2019.

"Seasons
As ordinary season tickets are valid by all permitted routes, many effectively offer a network and (as I have said in previous years) can be excellent value for a holiday. Also, they are not time-restricted. So, a Weekly Season from Southampton Central to London, for example, is £147 Standard or £249.90 First Class, and you get validity as follows:
Southampton to Waterloo via Woking, including from Weybridge via Chertsey; to Waterloo via Reading & Staines; to Paddington via Reading; to Waterloo via Portsmouth & Guildford, including via Effingham Junction; to Victoria via Horsham and via Brighton.
In addition, for ‘Waterloo’ or ‘Victoria’, above, read also Charing Cross, London Bridge, Cannon Street and City Thameslink.
Bearing in mind one Anytime Day Return to London is £87.30 Standard or £148.40 First, and even an Off-Peak Day Return is £47 Standard, £77.50 First Class, a Weekly is excellent value.
Do remember 7-day seasons can commence any day, but you do need a photocard."

 

[RJ]

Years ago I used a West Hampstead to Denmark Hill ticket as a rover covering a sizeable amount of North and South London and beyond. The powers that be eventually got rid of the generous and extensive validity of tickets like this though. I suspect the number of people making good use of the permitted routes of these kind of tickets was in single figures!

I later used a Mottisfont to Sandwich season to get validity across most of the South and South East, including pretty much all of the lines in South London except the branches. It was dirt cheap for what it was.