SWR Longest Strike - December 2019

[Robertj21a]

Mark Hopwoods first day as MD and he says in an interview with the Times that he will not give in to union demands and has ‘recruited 100s of extra guards to break the strikes’.

I’m sure there’s a bit of Murdoch smoke and mirrors going on there but even still, great way to start your tenure!!

It will be great for the travelling public if someone can grab hold of all these management/DOO/guard/PTI/RMT issues and get them sorted out once and for all. I'm sure most of those paying good money to travel on the trains are thoroughly fed up (with everyone involved).

 

[WA_Driver]

Mark Hopwoods first day as MD and he says in an interview with the Times that he will not give in to union demands and has ‘recruited 100s of extra guards to break the strikes’.

I’m sure there’s a bit of Murdoch smoke and mirrors going on there but even still, great way to start your tenure!!

But they want DOO. So why employ more guards??

 

[dgl]

And hundreds of extra employees on a franchise that is not doing so well?, if true teh government must have their hands in their pockets.

 

[WA_Driver]

Mark Hopwoods first day as MD and he says in an interview with the Times that he will not give in to union demands and has ‘recruited 100s of extra guards to break the strikes’.

I’m sure there’s a bit of Murdoch smoke and mirrors going on there but even still, great way to start your tenure!!

Anyway isn’t illegal to employ permanent placement staff for employees on legal industrial action

 

[Meerkat]

I assumed they meant recruited temporary guards from within their current staff.
If they had actively been recruiting externally for hundreds more guards than currently needed the RMT would surely have noticed and squealed their head off?

 

[387star]

There was talk of Overground taking the inners

I'd guess they would ditch guards silverlink style

 

[Robertj21a]

Anyway isn’t illegal to employ permanent placement staff for employees on legal industrial action

Is that true ?

I can't see why a company can't employ however many staff it feels are necessary. They are not replacing anybody, just additional ?

 

[Meerkat]

There was talk of Overground taking the inners

I'd guess they would ditch guards silverlink style

That wouldn’t be any easier than SWR doing it in industrial relations terms would it?

 

[swt_passenger]

That wouldn’t be any easier than SWR doing it in industrial relations terms would it?

This will probably considered going off-topic, but LO routes have definitely lost guards since TfL takeover, so it would have to be assumed that this policy would continue IF any further inner suburban routes still using guards transfer to TfL. But that would presumably be a TfL decision, not one by a big bad TOC...

 

[Goldfish62]

There was talk of Overground taking the inners

I'd guess they would ditch guards silverlink style

It was TfL that ditched the guards once the 378s had been introduced and bedded in.

 

[Goldfish62]

But they want DOO. So why employ more guards??

Because they don't want DOO. They want DCO.

 

[kristiang85]

This will probably considered going off-topic, but LO routes have definitely lost guards since TfL takeover, so it would have to be assumed that this policy would continue IF any further inner suburban routes still using guards transfer to TfL. But that would presumably be a TfL decision, not one by a big bad TOC...

This is where the RMT have lacked long-term strategy. By being belligerent and not allowing job descriptions to be modernised, despite promises of no job losses, they are now encouraging the kind of scenario where the powers that be will look at changes such as LO taking over the suburban routes, and then many jobs will be lost in the long run.

 

[Goldfish62]

I was just thinking the other day that Hopwood had been at GWR for a very long time!

Judging from various staff at GWR he appears to be infinitely more capable than Mellors.

 

[adamello]

This is where the RMT have lacked long-term strategy. By being belligerent and not allowing job descriptions to be modernised, despite promises of no job losses, they are now encouraging the kind of scenario where the powers that be will look at changes such as LO taking over the suburban routes, and then many jobs will be lost in the long run.

not the first time, in Maritime world they will bleat about a safe manning level not being enough, so what does a ship owner do? flag to another country, rather than protecting rights, has effectively cost British Officers theres.

 

[Chris999999]

Travelling today on SWR it is clear that the month long strike has had an effect. Whereas passengers were previously mostly in favour of trains always having guards on them, the consensus is now much more "We would prefer trains with guards on, but if the guards don't want to work, then we would opt for trains without guards in preference to no trains".

 

[lewisf]

Travelling today on SWR it is clear that the month long strike has had an effect. Whereas passengers were previously mostly in favour of trains always having guards on them, the consensus is now much more "We would prefer trains with guards on, but if the guards don't want to work, then we would opt for trains without guards in preference to no trains".

I doubt most people on the suburban routes realised the trains had guards before the dispute. They’re non commercial guards so they don’t do ticket checks, and it’s very rare to see them leave the middle driving cabs. Surely an OBS style role where they patrol the train would be better for passenger safety.

 

[Horizon22]

A similar loss of experience happened when the joint control office for Sussex was moved from Croydon to Three Bridges. I was working in Wessex route when the move of the Control Office was suggested and pointed out that the problems that Sussex were suffering. A month before I took my retirement (from an engineering function) I was asked would I like to stay on to train new controllers! ( Half a dozen shifts in a Control Office 20 years ago is not sufficient experience!)
Never mind, NWR are consistent at reproducing mistakes. Just look at what happened with train planning moving to three centres then to Milton Keynes. Most of the experienced train planners retired, moved to a TOC/FOC, moved to possession planning or are consultants.

Cheers, Neil

It's not so far to Three Bridges, but I appreciate your point. It often feels like an afterthought. As I said, I'm all for combining operations into a centralised location where it will be beneficial (a Control Centre for example certainly is) but it needs to be managed appropriately.

 

[Horizon22]

I was just thinking the other day that Hopwood had been at GWR for a very long time!

It's a secondment apparently.

 

[43096]

Judging from various staff at GWR he appears to be infinitely more capable than Mellors.

That’s not exactly saying much. Muppet Mellors replaced by Hapless Hopwood.....

 

[Meerkat]

This will probably considered going off-topic, but LO routes have definitely lost guards since TfL takeover, so it would have to be assumed that this policy would continue IF any further inner suburban routes still using guards transfer to TfL. But that would presumably be a TfL decision, not one by a big bad TOC...

my point was that changing to TfL doesn’t make it any easier to get rid of the guards - they get TUPE’d over and still go on strike, and you still have to make a deal with the drivers.

 

[theironroad]

my point was that changing to TfL doesn’t make it any easier to get rid of the guards - they get TUPE’d over and still go on strike, and you still have to make a deal with the drivers.

Guards working for Silver link north London lines were tuped over when London overground/MTR took over.

Once the tupe period of protection had expired, they were made redundant to allow the full doo that operates today.

Tupe is not infinite protection.

 

[Robertj21a]

Guards working for Silver link north London lines were tuped over when London overground/MTR took over.

Once the tupe period of protection had expired, they were made redundant to allow the full doo that operates today.

Tupe is not infinite protection.

Nor should it be.

 

[theironroad]

Nor should it be.

Not sure anyone here has claimed it should be....

 

[theironroad]

Mark Hopwoods first day as MD and he says in an interview with the Times that he will not give in to union demands and has ‘recruited 100s of extra guards to break the strikes’.

I’m sure there’s a bit of Murdoch smoke and mirrors going on there but even still, great way to start your tenure!!

Is anyone able to paste the full article as it is behind a paywall.

Thanks.

 

[Meerkat]

Guards working for Silver link north London lines were tuped over when London overground/MTR took over.

Once the tupe period of protection had expired, they were made redundant to allow the full doo that operates today.

Tupe is not infinite protection.

But SWR could make the guards redundant. TUPE them and the RMT would go on strike to get a commitment to keep them, as they have done everywhere else.
It wouldn’t be a huge issue if you had delivery of DOO capable trains and drivers willing to drive them.....

 

[theironroad]

And this is one reason the guards are striking as they know a big percentage of them will most likely be made redundant when tfl gain control of swr metro services.

One of the biggest ironies is that it a labour mayor, in Sadiq khan, who is the champion of bringing more metro services under tfl and ultimately making hundreds of people redundant.

 

[Carlisle]

And this is one reason the guards are striking as they know a big percentage of them will most likely be made redundant when tfl gain control of swr metro services.
.

If TFL took over it’d almost certainly come with a commitment to first to last train staffing of all stations, so no need for redundancies other than those who wish to volunteer.

 

[Robertj21a]

And this is one reason the guards are striking as they know a big percentage of them will most likely be made redundant when tfl gain control of swr metro services.

One of the biggest ironies is that it a labour mayor, in Sadiq khan, who is the champion of bringing more metro services under tfl and ultimately making hundreds of people redundant.

If it's going to happen at any time then now isn't too bad for timing - very low unemployment in most parts of the country. Some could probably take a sizeable redundancy payoff and find another job quite quickly.

 

[387star]

If TFL took over it’d almost certainly come with a commitment to first to last train staffing of all stations, so no need for redundancies other than those who wish to volunteer.

That was what Merseyrail originally wanted (guards redeployed) but have since given assurances guards will remain and in a safety critical capacity

 

[Bookd]

I still remain puzzled that the most belligerent staff seem to be at the coastal depots which will not be affected by any changes in the foreseeable future.