Wessex Class 31's!

[SussexSpotter]

Does anyone remember the Wessex 31's that used to run on Friday's from Cardiff - Brighton - Bristol? They also used to run on the Weymouth line too. We are talking 2003 - 2006 if I can recall?

Who thinks FGW should bring them back? Anyone want to have a go at turning a 31 into FGW local lines livery using photo editing software? Just think how much money First Great Western would make from rail enthusiasts if they brought these beasts back, also think how much many extra seats would be available rather than using the 2/3 car 158's and 150's.

All they would need is 4 Class 31's and 2 sets of 5 MK2 coaches. There are plenty of these available doing nothing.

If they did bring these back it would be a goldmine And would certainly add a bit of extra capacity on the West Coastway and Weymouth line too. Friday's and weekends are the busiest times especcially in the Summer months.

The Class 67's arn't the same and they only run down to Weymouth too, not Brighton They are better off on VSOE duties....BRING BACK THE PED'S!

 

[37401]

There is going to be an open access comp using 31s soon, DCR I think its called

 

[starrymarkb]

Um, they did last summer, mostly 67s, but the last weekend was a pair of 37s

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g9AZgFXjrxY

 

[37401]

Um, they did last summer, mostly 67s, but the last weekend was a pair of 37s

I think he means bring back the pink peds, not 67s

 

[SussexSpotter]

I think he means bring back the pink peds, not 67s

Indeed

 

[Drsatan]

I remember traveling on a Brighton-Bristol service from late 2004 consisting of top and tail 31s and 4 Mk2D coaches. The train lost time en route (because it couldn't keep up with the timings for a 158) and arrived at Romsey seven minutes late. Despite that, I think 31s and Mk2s would be a better alternative to 158s on Brighton/Pompey-Cardiff services, simply because four, five or even six Mk2Ds can carry more passengers than a single 158, without any underfloor engine noise.

I think NR use most of the operational 31s on track testing services so I'm not sure whether they'd have enough available for FGW to hire.

 

[SussexSpotter]

I think NR use most of the operational 31s on track testing services so I'm not sure whether they'd have enough available for FGW to hire.

Surely there are some still available that could be used? Im sure there are some sitting in warm storage somewhere

 

[TDK]

Surely there are some still available that could be used? Im sure there are some sitting in warm storage somewhere

They will be too unreliable now unless completely overhauled for using seriously

 

[90019]

Just think how much money First Great Western would make from rail enthusiasts if they brought these beasts back

Probably very little.

 

[GearJammer]

I did'nt think FGW run through to Brighton anymore (feel free to correct me if im wrong)
i thought they only went to Portsmouth?

Not all that bothered if they put 31's on the service TBH.......... however.... a crompton and 5 mk1's would certainly grab my attention and cash, along with a few others i should think

 

[SussexSpotter]

I did'nt think FGW run through to Brighton anymore (feel free to correct me if im wrong)
i thought they only went to Portsmouth?

FGW still opperate services to Brighton, but there are only 2 services Monday-Saturday, and 3 services on Sunday. All FGW services too/from Brighton are opperated by Class 158's and 150's. Here's the timetable......

---------------------------


MONDAYS - SATURDAYS:


Portsmouth Harbour - Brighton 0815
0900 Brighton - Great Malvern


Great Malvern - Brighton 1614
1700 Brighton - Worcester Shrub Hill


---------------------------


SUNDAYS:

Romsey - Brighton 1005
1108 Brighton - Cardiff Central

Cardiff Central - Brighton 1506
1545 Brighton - Bristol Temple Meads

Cardiff Central - Brighton 1705
1745 Brighton - Bristol Temple Meads

--------------------------
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Not all that bothered if they put 31's on the service TBH.......... however.... a crompton and 5 mk1's would certainly grab my attention and cash, along with a few others i should think

Now there's an idea
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Probably very little.

You would be suprised! Look how many were out for the 37's down to Weymouth on the last loco hauled run last year

 

[Pumbaa]

You would be suprised! Look how many were out for the 37's down to Weymouth on the last loco hauled run last year

Yes - and they're told to run those; it's not their choice. With this stupid idea, cranks pay the fare, train which is LHCS runs behind times and fGW get fined delay minutes. Result = fGW loses all the money you gibbers paid and more.

 

[37401]

Yes - and they're told to run those; it's not their choice. With this stupid idea, cranks pay the fare, train which is LHCS runs behind times and fGW get fined delay minutes. Result = fGW loses all the money you gibbers paid and more.

re-time for locos hahaha

 

[Pumbaa]

re-time for locos hahaha

"Hello NR - yes we'd like to retime 2 of our Friday paths for some LHCS so we can lose money, and please some cranks at the same time."
"Why the **** would you want to do that fGW? Are you that desperate to improve your popularity with enthusiasts?"
"No - we just thought we'd lower our service levels further, provide a slower service and annoy all the other TOCs that we affect as well."
"Ah I see - seeing as you've given valid reasons for your decision, we'll have to turn it down I'm afraid. Here at NR we only like stupid ideas".

That's how I imagine the phone conversation.

 

[37401]

"Hello NR - yes we'd like to retime 2 of our Friday paths for some LHCS so we can lose money, and please some cranks at the same time."
"Why the **** would you want to do that fGW? Are you that desperate to improve your popularity with enthusiasts?"
"No - we just thought we'd lower our service levels further, provide a slower service and annoy all the other TOCs that we affect as well."
"Ah I see - seeing as you've given valid reasons for your decision, we'll have to turn it down I'm afraid. Here at NR we only like stupid ideas".

That's how I imagine the phone conversation.

 

[90019]

You would be suprised! Look how many were out for the 37's down to Weymouth on the last loco hauled run last year

That was a one off, do you seriously think the same number would've used it every day for months or years?

 

[37401]

It would be no more than when 37s were out on north Wales service trains, plus having 37s on mon-fri service trains in this day and age would mean the dusty seat generation would never be at school

 

[The Planner]

Or they could do what Virgin do with the 90 set and take the hit anyway. Thats not got its own specific timings and runs in a Pendo path.

 

[SussexSpotter]

That was a one off, do you seriously think the same number would've used it every day for months or years?

Yes I would! It's about time we had more variety on our railways, mainline loco hauled passenger services (unless on railtours or steam tours) seem to be a dying breed these days, all DMU's and EMU's with very few exceptions. FGW have the 57's in the West Country, so why not loco hauled on the longer distance services to Brighton? Even if it was summer only (which is peak time for train travel to the seaside towns and cities) and it wasn't 31's because they were unavailable, surely FGW could hire some 47's, just something different like the good old days of travel?

If FGW want to do something different, make themselves known to other TOC's for their uniqueness.....then bringing back summer heritage loco hauled services to the seaside to remind people of the good old days of travel, is one way of doing it Besides you can add and take away coaches on a loco hauled service, but not neccesarily on a DMU e.g 150.

 

[SussexSpotter]

Yes I would! It's about time we had more variety on our railways, mainline loco hauled passenger services (unless on railtours or steam tours) seem to be a dying breed these days, all DMU's and EMU's with very few exceptions. FGW have the 57's in the West Country, so why not loco hauled on the longer distance services to Brighton? Even if it was summer only (which is peak time for train travel to the seaside towns and cities) and it wasn't 31's because they were unavailable, surely FGW could hire some 47's, just something different like the good old days of travel?

Personally I think the 31's would have the edge if loco hauled was ever to be brought back, there must be some available somewhere? If Wessex Trains can do it, so can FGW

 

[SussexSpotter]

Personally I think the 31's would have the edge if loco hauled was ever to be brought back, there must be some available somewhere? If Wessex Trains can do it, so can FGW

47's would drive more people onto the trains, not neccesarily the 31's, you see them enough on test trains......BORING! 'Time for Change' It's the 47's that makes a railtour!

 

[SussexSpotter]

It would be no more than when 37s were out on north Wales service trains, plus having 37s on mon-fri service trains in this day and age would mean the dusty seat generation would never be at school

I think you'll find it depends what time of the day you run the service If you were to run it in peak time like Wessex Trains used to on Fridays, on the Cardiff- Brighton-Cardiff services then you wouldn't have the dusty seat generation skipping school

 

[royaloak]

So the issues of increased access charges, crew training, higher maintenance costs, doors being left open at stations etc is lost on you!

A lovely idea but it would be a nightmare to administer.

 

[Greenback]

If FGW want to do something different, make themselves known to other TOC's for their uniqueness.....then bringing back summer heritage loco hauled services to the seaside to remind people of the good old days of travel, is one way of doing it Besides you can add and take away coaches on a loco hauled service, but not neccesarily on a DMU e.g 150.

Who says FGW want to do any of that? The actual mechanics of operating the service would be a nightmare, as royaloak pointed out!

 

[tbtc]

A lovely idea but it would be a nightmare to administer

Simply and accurately put.

 

[yorkie]

Yes, I did them once, I think it was the penultimate Friday, and they ended in late 2004. It was a good response by a decent company to provide extra capacity on Fridays. In most countries extra capacity on Fridays is the norm. It is only in the UK where it is considered a "nightmare" for TOCs to go some way toward meeting this demand.

When I did it the train was packed, if this went to a 2-car 158 then there would have been people left on the platform. But I guess that's easier to administer because you just tell people to drive or get a coach instead. Or even bump up the fares so much that they choose to anyway.

 

[tbtc]

It was a good response by a decent company to provide extra capacity on Fridays. In most countries extra capacity on Fridays is the norm. It is only in the UK where it is considered a "nightmare" for TOCs to go some way toward meeting this demand

Genuine question - what do these other countries do with their stock the rest of the week?

 

[Aictos]

Genuine question - what do these other countries do with their stock the rest of the week?

Pretty much what First do with the sleeper stock, maintain them

I guess the same is said for other countries as well, it's just not economic to leave them standing around doing nothing.

Which is why I guess BR ran trains such as Specials to boost capacity when needed and Merrymakers using stock which otherwise would just be sitting in some yard.

 

[yorkie]

Genuine question - what do these other countries do with their stock the rest of the week?

They don't use their stock so intensively. When I went to Ireland in 2007 I was surprised at how many Friday Only trains there are, including trains that are loco hauled on a Friday to release units to allow other services to be strengthened. I went on some of the Friday additionals and they were well loaded.

It is only relatively recently that East Coast have been running a 19:30 additional from King's Cross, and Virgin have the 18:46 from Euston. This is of course welcome, and better than nothing, but more can be done.

 

[Drsatan]

When I did it the train was packed, if this went to a 2-car 158 then there would have been people left on the platform.

In 2006 I traveled on the same service from Brighton to Bristol on a Friday, only for it to be operated by a sole 158 with broken air conditioning. There were people standing from Brighton all the way to Southampton Central. It's experiences like that which put off occasional travelers from using the train
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They don't use their stock so intensively.

Indeed, I traveled on a DB Regio service from Frankfurt am Main to Koblenz (as far as Rudesheim on the right bank of the Rhine) formed of an elderly electric locomotive and five coaches in push-pull formation a couple of years back. Even though it was the evening rush hour there were plenty of coaches, locomotives and multiple units sitting in the sidings near Frankfurt.

I'm assuming that it wouldn't be viable for TOCs to have lots of spare coaches sitting around because TOCs wouldn't to pay leasing fees to the ROSCOs and track access charges to NR to have spare coaches sitting in carriage sidings all day.