The 2019 General Election Result and Aftermath

[Jordan Adam]

Just for clarification I wasn't suggesting that 7 year olds should vote, rather just that my 7 year old was wanting to vote.

Yeah i understood that, i was just adding to it. Although arguably i'm sure you'll agree there's lots of things that a child of that age "wants to do" but legally can't yet - for example driving a car. Hence why there's set legal ages they can do it from, i just think 18 is too old when it comes to voting.

 

[edwin_m]

I agree that it should be repealed, with all the difficulties which I hadn't realised that you point out, but for different reasons.

The ability for MPs, Parliament and the government to know the date of the general election long in advance is of significant benefit to them and to the media but of little benefit to the electorate. Having uncertainty which causes the election date to be driven by political events is much better, even when the final decision is left to the Prime Minister.

I agree with you that this election should have been held earlier, driven by the inability of the government to govern, and on this occasion the circumstances aligned so that it was probably in everyone's interest to have held the election earlier. In general, however, I think the FTPA gives benefit only to the politicians and the media, which is why it was enacted in the first place, and the sooner is it abolished the better. So I do agree with you there.

Under the old system the government could fall if defeated on a major measure. That gave the whips of the governing party a lot of power over MPs, who might disagree on specific issues but wouldn't want to rock the boat enough to trigger an election. Under the FTPA it's possible, as we have seen, for MPs to defy the government more easily without bringing it down. Whether you think this is a good idea depends on whether you thing Britain should move even closer to elective dictatorship.

There's also the issue that the PM could, and usually did, call the election at a time that maximized their chances of winning.

 

[TrafficEng]

There is a feeling among younger people that "older people" (those over 70) shouldn't be allowed to vote because it's not their future, i suspect the frustration of 16/17 year olds not being able to vote is part of the reason some people hold this believe. While i can see the point being made i fundamentally disagree on the basis that a 75 year old could potentially still live for another 30 years so it is their future too.

Part of the problem here is that recently General Elections have been characterised as being about (your) "future", when in reality they are fundamentally about the next 5 years (at most). It is a campaign tactic employed by all sides at various times and in various ways. It works because people's fears tend to be greater for the long-term future than they are for the here and now. This in turn is partly related to the difficulty in predicting and controlling events over the long term, compared to what is happening now.

With Brexit the remain campaign have been relentless in making it about young people's futures. It is a great tactic because it works on people of all ages (e.g. parents and grandparents). But when you analyse the risks of Brexit most of them occur in the short-term (and are harder to mitigate because of the lack of time to do anything).

The current move to reduce the voting age isn't new, but has come into focus through the Brexit debate. And largely because people promoting the idea of a second referendum could see that adding the votes of 16-17 year olds would swing the vote their way. It is possible that idea may recede as the prospect of a second referendum vanishes and Brexit happens.

Another point i'd make is that many people (those over the age of 30 particularly) get stuck in the habit of not paying attention to politics but voting for the same party over and over regardless of their policies. If you asked them who they'd voted for and why their reason would be "because it's always who i've voted for".

I think it is more complex than that. Broadly speaking there are two groups of voters, those who are fixed and those who float. Which group you fall into isn't necessarily an age-driven thing.

The fixed group typically attach to a political side as a product of their background and parental/social influences. If you come from a mining town you'll probably vote Labour. If your parents were Liberals you'll probably vote LibDem. If you come from a comfortably well off property owning family you'll probably vote Conservative. These aren't clear cut and absolute, but form some of the basic building blocks of how long-term political affiliation comes about.

The floating group are more influenced by current events than their background. It is important to remember that this group aren't necessarily making a decision because they have read and understood a party manifesto, it is equally possible they are voting a particular way because all their social group say that is what they are doing. Within that group you can make some generalisations: younger people tend to be drawn to the left, older people tend to move to the right.

So when you make the observation that people "(those over the age of 30 particularly)" get stuck in the habit, what is probably happening is a combination of those people with naturally fixed political affiliation being joined by floating voters whose age is tending to dispose them toward one party.

If you watch some of the interviews with people in mining towns that voted Conservative it is noticeable that many of them are older. These are people who lived through the strikes and were impacted most severely by the closures. They say "I've always voted Labour" or "my dad would be turning in his grave". But they demonstrate that even older 'fixed' voters have the ability to follow politics and make decisions for tactical reasons.

Lastly yes you're pretty much right, most of those opposed to lowering the age hold that opinion because they're aware that the younger generations are generally speaking more to the left so they wish to restrict 16/17 year olds so that their favoured party can remain in power - additionally i think many people, especially those who grew up before the internet underestimate the intelligence of younger people these days.

It isn't unusual for people to be opposed to changes that they see as having a detrimental effect on them. Equally, not everybody supporting a reduction in voting age is doing so because they believe it is fundamentally right for younger people to be able to vote.

It should also be remembered that younger people tending toward the left is not absolute and immutable. Younger people tend to vote against the establishment, and when the establishment becomes Labour (as it did under Blair/Brown), some of those votes will go to the opposition on the right (as they did to Cameron).

The current generation of younger people are quite firmly to the left, but in part because they have grown up in an environment of Conservative government and difficult economics. In the 1970's and early 1980's there was a tranche of young people growing up who saw the left as the 'enemy' and the right as a source of hope and prosperity.

If the next 5 years are prosperous and Brexit turns out not-so-bad then there is a real possibility 16/17 year olds will tend towards the right in 2024 - especially if they form the view that the left misled them over the risks of Brexit and the sale of the NHS. If the voting age is lowered Labour may live to regret it.

I also don't think that older people underestimate the intelligence of younger people. Intelligence is predominantly genetic, it is hardwired into us and changes very slowly over long periods of time. The intelligence of an average 18 year old is broadly the same as the average 60 year old.

The relevance of the internet is it gives us access to far more information than ever before. I suspect the concern of older people is about the ability of people (of all ages) to process that information and avoid inappropriate influence. These innovations are new to the whole human species and we are not (yet) well adapted to cope with them.

 

[furnessvale]

Of course not.

I look forward to the next leader being from the centre left with policies to match.

 

[Ferret]

It’s been an entertaining 4 years though. So many highlights.

- JC telling journalists he was ‘not happy’ with the shoot to kill policy on terrorists.
- the Labour Live festival - £1m poured down the khazi.
- Diane Abbott’s repeated confusion over simple maths.
- Richard Burgon telling everyone he had never said “Zionism is the enemy of peace”, and then a video of him saying just that emerging.
- Richard Burgon’s excellent analysis on Twitter which concluded with the revelation that Boris Johnson is a Tory.
- Jeremy Corbyn denying he’d laid a wreath for a terrorist, saying he was present but not involved, and then subsequently being shown on the front of every newspaper holding the bloody wreath!
- Jeremy Corbyn pretending that he couldn’t get a seat on a Virgin Train, then subsequently getting publicly owned by Virgin releasing the CCTV footage.
- Corbyn outrider Aaron Bastani telling the world that Israel were using the deadly sodium chloride in chemical weapons. I prefer it on chips tbh mate
- Bastani telling everyone that Corbyn would win Scotland back.
- Ash Sarkar telling Piers Morgan she is ‘literally a Communist you idiot’, and expecting to be taken seriously.
- Owen Jones and Hugh Grant doing the electoral Kryptonite thing and devoting their campaigning to seats that they failed to win.
- Corbyn’s hilarious attempt to high-5 Emily Thornberry which resulted in him groping her right tit.
- Corbyn wilf n merving at Pamela Anderson’s ample bosom on TV and the endless Tweets that followed.
- Corbyn telling Parliament that he had been in Brussels with other Socialist leaders and that they had said something to him.... “Who are you?”, asked a Tory, to endless mirth on both sides of the house!
- The Burgon exchange with Kay Burley where she said that the polls were saying Labour can’t win, Burgon replying that they said that last time, and Burley reminding him that they didn’t win last time either.
- Rebecca Wrong-Daily telling the nation that we should take no-deal off the table because the EU doesn’t want no-deal.
- Laura Pidcock telling us that she could never be friends with a Tory, only to find that her own constituency was full of them, and she lost her seat.
- Bastani telling us that PSG paid 198bn for Neymar.
- Corbyn inadvertently shutting his wife in their house.
- Corbynites debating for weeks whether the BBC had doctored a photo to make him look Russian, thus keeping in the news the notion that Corbyn was a Russian mole!
- Releasing a Christmas song along the lines of JC4PM 4 me, then howling about bias when the BBC declined to play it.
- JC’s hatred of being challenged by an interviewer, especially females.
- Owen Jones doing more u-turns than a driver lost in Bristol’s one way system. Pro-Corbyn, anti, pro, anti, pro. He used to be indecisive, now he’s not so sure!
- The repeated insistence that Corbyn was always on the right side of history, when it’s clear that’s bollards. Start with intervention in Bosnia and work from there.
- Lloyd Russell-Moyle nicking the mace in the House of Commons then not knowing what to do next!
- Ellie Mae O’Hagan telling the nation on TV that Jeremy Corbyn was actually the Prime Minister. Er....
- Grace Blakeley having a shouting match with Ayesha Hazarika on live TV, the morning after the night before, clearly demonstrating she’d learned nothing
- Ken Livingstone’s obsession with Hitler embarrassing the leadership time and time again.
- Corbyn cycling hurriedly away from the waiting press and found himself being filmed riding the wrong way up a one-way street.

Corbyn and his associates have provided endless goofs, gaffes and foul ups. I’m sure there’s been many more I’ve forgotten. I thank them for the public service they have provided! And people wonder why the far-left have a credibility problem? That’s why the Tories got a majority of 80...

 

[Starmill]

It’s been an entertaining 4 years though. So many highlights.

- JC telling journalists he was ‘not happy’ with the shoot to kill policy on terrorists.
- the Labour Live festival - £1m poured down the khazi.
- Diane Abbott’s repeated confusion over simple maths.
- Richard Burgon telling everyone he had never said “Zionism is the enemy of peace”, and then a video of him saying just that emerging.
- Richard Burgon’s excellent analysis on Twitter which concluded with the revelation that Boris Johnson is a Tory.
- Jeremy Corbyn denying he’d laid a wreath for a terrorist, saying he was present but not involved, and then subsequently being shown on the front of every newspaper holding the bloody wreath!
- Jeremy Corbyn pretending that he couldn’t get a seat on a Virgin Train, then subsequently getting publicly owned by Virgin releasing the CCTV footage.
- Corbyn outrider Aaron Bastani telling the world that Israel were using the deadly sodium chloride in chemical weapons. I prefer it on chips tbh mate
- Bastani telling everyone that Corbyn would win Scotland back.
- Ash Sarkar telling Piers Morgan she is ‘literally a Communist you idiot’, and expecting to be taken seriously.
- Owen Jones and Hugh Grant doing the electoral Kryptonite thing and devoting their campaigning to seats that they failed to win.
- Corbyn’s hilarious attempt to high-5 Emily Thornberry which resulted in him groping her right tit.
- Corbyn wilf n merving at Pamela Anderson’s ample bosom on TV and the endless Tweets that followed.
- Corbyn telling Parliament that he had been in Brussels with other Socialist leaders and that they had said something to him.... “Who are you?”, asked a Tory, to endless mirth on both sides of the house!
- The Burgon exchange with Kay Burley where she said that the polls were saying Labour can’t win, Burgon replying that they said that last time, and Burley reminding him that they didn’t win last time either.
- Rebecca Wrong-Daily telling the nation that we should take no-deal off the table because the EU doesn’t want no-deal.
- Laura Pidcock telling us that she could never be friends with a Tory, only to find that her own constituency was full of them, and she lost her seat.
- Bastani telling us that PSG paid 198bn for Neymar.
- Corbyn inadvertently shutting his wife in their house.
- Corbynites debating for weeks whether the BBC had doctored a photo to make him look Russian, thus keeping in the news the notion that Corbyn was a Russian mole!
- Releasing a Christmas song along the lines of JC4PM 4 me, then howling about bias when the BBC declined to play it.
- JC’s hatred of being challenged by an interviewer, especially females.
- Owen Jones doing more u-turns than a driver lost in Bristol’s one way system. Pro-Corbyn, anti, pro, anti, pro. He used to be indecisive, now he’s not so sure!
- The repeated insistence that Corbyn was always on the right side of history, when it’s clear that’s bollards. Start with intervention in Bosnia and work from there.
- Lloyd Russell-Moyle nicking the mace in the House of Commons then not knowing what to do next!
- Ellie Mae O’Hagan telling the nation on TV that Jeremy Corbyn was actually the Prime Minister. Er....
- Grace Blakeley having a shouting match with Ayesha Hazarika on live TV, the morning after the night before, clearly demonstrating she’d learned nothing
- Ken Livingstone’s obsession with Hitler embarrassing the leadership time and time again.
- Corbyn cycling hurriedly away from the waiting press and found himself being filmed riding the wrong way up a one-way street.

Corbyn and his associates have provided endless goofs, gaffes and foul ups. I’m sure there’s been many more I’ve forgotten. I thank them for the public service they have provided! And people wonder why the far-left have a credibility problem? That’s why the Tories got a majority of 80...

I don't know.

I still think I'd rather have all of that than someone like the Prime Minister, who doesn't even try to hide that they're a racist, sexist, homophobic, anti-Islamic liar?

 

[Ferret]

I don't know.

I still think I'd rather have all of that than someone like the Prime Minister, who doesn't even try to hide that they're a racist, sexist, homophobic, anti-Islamic liar?

Ah, that pesky electorate that disagree eh?

 

[TrafficEng]

At around 14/15 (around the time of the 2005 election) I had wrote my own manifesto for if ever I got elected (which I still have years later - it included things free school lunches for everyone, banning cars from schools and having schools teach more about British history!)

Obviously I probably wouldn't have got elected on that had I ever stood for parliament as soon as I was eligible to do so, would I?

There is possibly an important truth in there: If you are not old* enough to get yourself elected then you probably aren't old enough to vote.

Or conversely, if 16 year olds should be entitled to vote then shouldn't they also be entitled to stand in the election they are voting in?**

(*For "old" we probably need to substitute "mature", but people mature at different ages.)

(** William Hague was 16 when he made his famous speech, and probably would have been elected at that age if he stood in a safe Conservative seat)

 

[DarloRich]

I don't know.

I still think I'd rather have all of that than someone like the Prime Minister, who doesn't even try to hide that they're a racist, sexist, homophobic, anti-Islamic liar?

lots of normal every day people in the country decided that Corbyn wasn't fit to run a bath. We should be asking why not trying to wish away those choices.

One of the reasons is that a right on student politics Palestine obsessed protest group doesnt appeal.

 

[Esker-pades]

- Jeremy Corbyn pretending that he couldn’t get a seat on a Virgin Train, then subsequently getting publicly owned by Virgin releasing the CCTV footage.

This one was later proved in Corbyn's favour.
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-41036937

New footage has been published of the "traingate" journey that triggered a row involving Jeremy Corbyn and Sir Richard Branson last year.

A year ago, Mr Corbyn was filmed sitting on the floor of a train he said was "ram-packed".

Virgin Trains then released CCTV images and footage it said showed the Labour leader walking past empty seats.

In the newly-released CCTV, people can be seen sitting on the floor between the carriages.

It was released by pro-Corbyn filmmaker Yannis Mendez, whose original film of the Labour leader sitting on the floor sparked the debate.

Mr Mendez made a request to Virgin for the CCTV in which he featured, and it has now been published by his Double Down News company.

This is the video: https://www.facebook.com/watch/?ref=external&v=1434662096619449

Ah, that pesky electorate that disagree eh?

He said nothing about the electorate. He just expressed an opinion. That's still allowed. Good grief.

 

[TheBigD]

I don't know.

I still think I'd rather have all of that than someone like the Prime Minister, who doesn't even try to hide that they're a racist, sexist, homophobic, anti-Islamic liar?

Yeah let's label people whom we disagree with as an "ist" or "phobe". It's such a winning strategy.

 

[Ferret]

He said nothing about the electorate. He just expressed an opinion. That's still allowed. Good grief.

Oh dear. Totally beyond parody, this is. The point still hasn’t sunk in yet, has it? What’s the point of a permanent protest movement that can never appeal to enough people in order to win an election? That’s the way to end up with permanent Tory Governments.

 

[Esker-pades]

Oh dear. Totally beyond parody, this is. The point still hasn’t sunk in yet, has it? What’s the point of a permanent protest movement that can never appeal to enough people in order to win an election? That’s the way to end up with permanent Tory Governments.

This addresses something entirely different. I happen to agree with it. I would rather have Corbyn in than Johnson. The result of the election doesn't change what I would rather have.

"I prefer Corbyn over Johnson."
"That pesky electorate disagreed."
"I said nothing about the electorate; only who I'd prefer of the 2 leaders."
"Permanent protest movement can never appeal to enough people in order to win an election."

You are addressing other points that do not follow on from the original one.

 

[Ferret]

This addresses something entirely different. I happen to agree with it. I would rather have Corbyn in than Johnson. The result of the election doesn't change what I would rather have.

"I prefer Corbyn over Johnson."
"That pesky electorate disagreed."
"I said nothing about the electorate; only who I'd prefer of the 2 leaders."
"Permanent protest movement can never appeal to enough people in order to win an election."

You are addressing other points that do not follow on from the original one.

Good grief! If you want to follow your own ‘logic’, I never mentioned anything about Boris in my post so why was that relevant?! Hilarious, really it is.

 

[Esker-pades]

Yeah let's label people whom we disagree with as an "ist" or "phobe". It's such a winning strategy.

Boris Johnson and Sexism:

• Referring to Emily Thornberry by her husband's surname (Nugee) rather than her own (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43557516)
• Writing this in a column about the 2012 olympics: "As I write these words there are semi-naked women playing beach volleyball in the middle of the Horse Guards Parade immortalised by Canaletto… They are glistening like wet otters and the water is splashing off the brims of the spectators’ sou’westers."
• That comment on Muslim women about them looking like 'letterboxes and bank robbers'

And on that note...anti-Islam and Racism:

• Previously mentioned column about Muslim women in Burqas
• That 2002 Telegraph column which he referred to "cheering crowds of flag-waving piccaninnies” and “the tribal warriors will all break out in watermelon smiles to see the big white chief"
• He said Obama had an "ancestral dislike of the British empire" because he was "part-Kenyan"
• He wrote this in 2012: "The best fate for Africa would be if the old colonial powers, or their citizens, scrambled once again in her direction; on the understanding that this time they will not be asked to feel guilty."

Finally....homophobia:

• Referring to gay men as "tank-topped bum boys"
• This on same-sex marriage: "If gay marriage was OK – and I was uncertain on the issue – then I saw no reason in principle why a union should not be consecrated between three men, as well as two men, or indeed three men and a dog"
• In 2018 he signed off on a law that allowed Bermuda (a British Oversees territory) that imposed a ban on same-sex marriage. This new law was later overturned by the supreme court in Bermuda.

To conclude: it's a comment with evidence behind it.

 

[DarloRich]

Boris Johnson and Sexism:

• Referring to Emily Thornberry by her husband's surname (Nugee) rather than her own (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-43557516)
• Writing this in a column about the 2012 olympics: "As I write these words there are semi-naked women playing beach volleyball in the middle of the Horse Guards Parade immortalised by Canaletto… They are glistening like wet otters and the water is splashing off the brims of the spectators’ sou’westers."
• That comment on Muslim women about them looking like 'letterboxes and bank robbers'

And on that note...anti-Islam and Racism:

• Previously mentioned column about Muslim women in Burqas
• That 2002 Telegraph column which he referred to "cheering crowds of flag-waving piccaninnies” and “the tribal warriors will all break out in watermelon smiles to see the big white chief"
• He said Obama had an "ancestral dislike of the British empire" because he was "part-Kenyan"
• He wrote this in 2012: "The best fate for Africa would be if the old colonial powers, or their citizens, scrambled once again in her direction; on the understanding that this time they will not be asked to feel guilty."

Finally....homophobia:

• Referring to gay men as "tank-topped bum boys"
• This on same-sex marriage: "If gay marriage was OK – and I was uncertain on the issue – then I saw no reason in principle why a union should not be consecrated between three men, as well as two men, or indeed three men and a dog"
• In 2018 he signed off on a law that allowed Bermuda (a British Oversees territory) that imposed a ban on same-sex marriage. This new law was later overturned by the supreme court in Bermuda.

To conclude: it's a comment with evidence behind it.

Sadly the electorate considered that and still rejected Corbyn. You should be asking why.

 

[Esker-pades]

Good grief! If you want to follow your own ‘logic’, I never mentioned anything about Boris in my post so why was that relevant?! Hilarious, really it is.

"Here's what Corbyn and others have done wrong."
"I'm not sure about that. I'd take it over what Johnson has done wrong."
"That pesky electorate disagreed."
"I said nothing about the electorate; only who I'd prefer of the 2 leaders."
"Permanent protest movement can never appeal to enough people in order to win an election."
"<Whatever that last comment was>"

Sadly the electorate considered that and still rejected Corbyn. You should be asking why.

I really cannot show all my thoughts on this election in this thread. Just because I haven't said something on this thread (or this forum as a whole) doesn't mean I'm not thinking about it.

 

[TrafficEng]

This one was later proved in Corbyn's favour.

The original claim was "ram packed" - which it clearly wasn't.

But aside from the minutiae, the key issue for many people was what the whole scenario said about his leadership abilities.

If he and his team were not capable of thinking ahead and making reservations on an apparently notoriously busy service, then what does it say about his ability to run a country?

Or, if you are of the view that making train reservations has no relevance on the ability to run a country, then how about the failure to foresee that a PR stunt has the capability to go so badly wrong and be misinterpreted by so many people?

 

[Esker-pades]

The original claim was "ram packed" - which it clearly wasn't.

But aside from the minutiae, the key issue for many people was what the whole scenario said about his leadership abilities.

If he and his team were not capable of thinking ahead and making reservations on an apparently notoriously busy service, then what does it say about his ability to run a country?

Or, if you are of the view that making train reservations has no relevance on the ability to run a country, then how about the failure to foresee that a PR stunt has the capability to go so badly wrong and be misinterpreted by so many people?

Yes. I did get very annoyed at Corbyn around 'Traingate'. There are so many properly ram-packed trains, and he chose one that wasn't too full to badly make a reasonable point. And then the focus (predictably) went on the "how busy was his train?" debate rather than the "our rail system is bursting, what can we do to solve it?" debate.

 

[DarloRich]

@FelixtheCat

I am going to write something you and others wont like. It does not represent my view but is added for context.

If you said to many people I know (some in my wider family) that Boris Johnson called gay men tank top wearing bum boys they would shrug and say aye, well they are and not see a problem.

By all means point out the issue but dont expect it to have the same traction with everyone.

As I say that isnt my view.

 

[Arglwydd Golau]

He should have gone already. It is becuase the succession to another barm pot hasnt been secured that he hasnt.



In large parts of the country, especially in areas without active/strongly led local parties, the silly entriest swp/momentum types are in charge.

It isn't universal but it is a big problem for labour.

have you any real evidence for that? From my experience in Wales I'm unaware of 'momentum types' (do you mean members of Momentum?) in charge of constituency parties. There may be a lot of Socialists, not necessarily the same thing!

 

[Esker-pades]

@FelixtheCat

I am going to write something you and others wont like. It does not represent my view but is added for context.

If you said to many people I know (some in my wider family) that Boris Johnson called gay men tank top wearing bum boys they would shrug and say aye, well they are and not see a problem.

By all means point out the issue but dont expect it to have the same traction with everyone.

As I say that isnt my view.

I understand that entirely. I realise that such people exist. I only brought up Johnson's record because I interpreted a previous comment as saying that it wasn't legitimate. In the same way that I would disagree if a Corbyn supporter said the same comment but with 'anti-semitic' replacing the 'racism & sexism'.

 

[Arglwydd Golau]

It’s been an entertaining 4 years though. So many highlights.

- JC telling journalists he was ‘not happy’ with the shoot to kill policy on terrorists.
- the Labour Live festival - £1m poured down the khazi.
- Diane Abbott’s repeated confusion over simple maths.
- Richard Burgon telling everyone he had never said “Zionism is the enemy of peace”, and then a video of him saying just that emerging.
- Richard Burgon’s excellent analysis on Twitter which concluded with the revelation that Boris Johnson is a Tory.
- Jeremy Corbyn denying he’d laid a wreath for a terrorist, saying he was present but not involved, and then subsequently being shown on the front of every newspaper holding the bloody wreath!
- Jeremy Corbyn pretending that he couldn’t get a seat on a Virgin Train, then subsequently getting publicly owned by Virgin releasing the CCTV footage.
- Corbyn outrider Aaron Bastani telling the world that Israel were using the deadly sodium chloride in chemical weapons. I prefer it on chips tbh mate
- Bastani telling everyone that Corbyn would win Scotland back.
- Ash Sarkar telling Piers Morgan she is ‘literally a Communist you idiot’, and expecting to be taken seriously.
- Owen Jones and Hugh Grant doing the electoral Kryptonite thing and devoting their campaigning to seats that they failed to win.
- Corbyn’s hilarious attempt to high-5 Emily Thornberry which resulted in him groping her right tit.
- Corbyn wilf n merving at Pamela Anderson’s ample bosom on TV and the endless Tweets that followed.
- Corbyn telling Parliament that he had been in Brussels with other Socialist leaders and that they had said something to him.... “Who are you?”, asked a Tory, to endless mirth on both sides of the house!
- The Burgon exchange with Kay Burley where she said that the polls were saying Labour can’t win, Burgon replying that they said that last time, and Burley reminding him that they didn’t win last time either.
- Rebecca Wrong-Daily telling the nation that we should take no-deal off the table because the EU doesn’t want no-deal.
- Laura Pidcock telling us that she could never be friends with a Tory, only to find that her own constituency was full of them, and she lost her seat.
- Bastani telling us that PSG paid 198bn for Neymar.
- Corbyn inadvertently shutting his wife in their house.
- Corbynites debating for weeks whether the BBC had doctored a photo to make him look Russian, thus keeping in the news the notion that Corbyn was a Russian mole!
- Releasing a Christmas song along the lines of JC4PM 4 me, then howling about bias when the BBC declined to play it.
- JC’s hatred of being challenged by an interviewer, especially females.
- Owen Jones doing more u-turns than a driver lost in Bristol’s one way system. Pro-Corbyn, anti, pro, anti, pro. He used to be indecisive, now he’s not so sure!
- The repeated insistence that Corbyn was always on the right side of history, when it’s clear that’s bollards. Start with intervention in Bosnia and work from there.
- Lloyd Russell-Moyle nicking the mace in the House of Commons then not knowing what to do next!
- Ellie Mae O’Hagan telling the nation on TV that Jeremy Corbyn was actually the Prime Minister. Er....
- Grace Blakeley having a shouting match with Ayesha Hazarika on live TV, the morning after the night before, clearly demonstrating she’d learned nothing
- Ken Livingstone’s obsession with Hitler embarrassing the leadership time and time again.
- Corbyn cycling hurriedly away from the waiting press and found himself being filmed riding the wrong way up a one-way street.

Corbyn and his associates have provided endless goofs, gaffes and foul ups. I’m sure there’s been many more I’ve forgotten. I thank them for the public service they have provided! And people wonder why the far-left have a credibility problem? That’s why the Tories got a majority of 80...

You have been busy!! (or was it copy and paste?) Could do similar with May/Johnson over the last 4 years!

 

[DarloRich]

have you any real evidence for that? From my experience in Wales I'm unaware of 'momentum types' (do you mean members of Momentum?) in charge of constituency parties. There may be a lot of Socialists, not necessarily the same thing!

The lunatics are running the asylum in many places. The leadership of my former local party changed and was much more momentum.

Like I said if there was a strongly managed and led local party it is less likely to have been infiltrated.

 

[Starmill]

Yeah let's label people whom we disagree with as an "ist" or "phobe". It's such a winning strategy.

I'm calling him out on things he's said that are wrong, not things he's done that I disagree with.

Of course there's always people willing to defend the worst leaders because they enact beneficial policy to them.

 

[DarloRich]

I understand that entirely. I realise that such people exist. I only brought up Johnson's record because I interpreted a previous comment as saying that it wasn't legitimate. In the same way that I would disagree if a Corbyn supporter said the same comment but with 'anti-semitic' replacing the 'racism & sexism'.

Personally I feel it is a language issue. I know most of them would react in horror if you said all gays should be strung up.

It is a strange world!

 

[Starmill]

Ah, that pesky electorate that disagree eh?

What's it got to do with them me calling the Prime Minister a bad man?

 

[Ferret]

You have been busy!! (or was it copy and paste?) Could do similar with May/Johnson over the last 4 years!

Nah, it’s all off the top of my head! There has to be more I’ve forgotten!

As for the Tory side, Theresa May’s dancing springs to mind! Johnson - prorogation of Parliament for partisan means while pretending otherwise is a more grievous sin, though less amusing than Corbyn’s many gaffes.

Have there been many really amusing Burgon-esque moments of comedy on the Government side? Jacob Rees-Mogg being photographed lying on the front bench was an extraordinary gaffe.

 

[Ferret]

What's it got to do with them me calling the Prime Minister a bad man?

What was the relevance of it? I made no mention of Boris, nor do I support him. It is merely making the point that Corbyn lacked the credibility to win, whereas Boris somehow convinced swathes of people he was a good bet. The whataboutery that has followed my partly light-hearted post is epic!

 

[TheBigD]

I'm calling him out on things he's said that are wrong, not things he's done that I disagree with.

Of course there's always people willing to defend the worst leaders because they enact beneficial policy to them.

Perhaps I didn't word my response right. Regardless of whether someone is or isn't a homophobe, sexist etc, constantly calling them racist, sexist etc simply doesn't win other people over. It becomes white noise and people turn off. You and I may not like that, but for many people that's the reality. The constant name calling is a turn off and people stop listening.