Northern to use loco hauled services?

[royaloak]

why? there are still some off lease.

 

[MCR247]

why? there are still some off lease.

Are they in condition that they could just be brought back in service with a clean? Really, Northern if want something short(ish)-term, so overhauling and refurbishing MK3s is pretty pointless.

 

[142094]

For Hartlepool it would be short term, but unless they get some more DMUs from somewhere else then a long term solution to the Manchester - Blackpool would be to do up a few mk3s and use them for a while. However since the franchise is going to change in a few years they probably won't want to spend the money.

 

[Aictos]

Aren't there any MK3 DVTs available? With some work, you could get have a setup like WSMR but longer and the DVT would come in very handy for all the lugguage, bikes, spades etc...

With the 180s on that route, is the 1st Class declassified or not? If there's no First Class on the route or there's no demand for it then surely a formation of DVT, Buffet, TSO, TSO, TSO, TSO, TSO and 67 be viable, okay there's no First Class but such is life.

 

[WatcherZero]

Seems to be half a dozen MK3 DVT's stored by DB regio (may be old info)

 

[Dreadnought]

Aren't there any MK3 DVTs available? With some work, you could get have a setup like WSMR but longer and the DVT would come in very handy for all the lugguage, bikes, spades etc...

With the 180s on that route, is the 1st Class declassified or not? If there's no First Class on the route or there's no demand for it then surely a formation of DVT, Buffet, TSO, TSO, TSO, TSO, TSO and 67 be viable, okay there's no First Class but such is life.

Although there are spare DVTs they would need modifying to allow them to work with the 67 as per 82146 & 82301-305. The Mk3s that would be used also need to have additional wiring fitted to enable the 67 to "talk" to the DVT.

 

[Mojo]

Those 158s were not part of an exchange - they were additional stock funded by Yorkshire Forward.

Additional stock that came from FGW, who needed something else so had no choice to take on some 142s, a few of which were returned later.

So to say that "the only pacers Northen are missing are the 7x 142s down with FGW" is somewhat misleading as:
a. they were stored anyway
b. FGW had to take them on because of the 158s lost to Northern

 

[ukrob]

Aren't there any MK3 DVTs available? With some work, you could get have a setup like WSMR but longer and the DVT would come in very handy for all the lugguage, bikes, spades etc...

With the 180s on that route, is the 1st Class declassified or not? If there's no First Class on the route or there's no demand for it then surely a formation of DVT, Buffet, TSO, TSO, TSO, TSO, TSO and 67 be viable, okay there's no First Class but such is life.

To be fair the 180s work commuter services. I mean who takes spades and luggage to Blackpool these days?

Platforms are not long enough for that formation.

 

[37401]

Mk2e's?

 

[175001]

Hmm, as a Vic guard, a lot of my colleagues have been recently trained up on to the 180's as recently as last week, so that could indicate that they will be with us a bit longer!

 

[Aictos]

To be fair the 180s work commuter services. I mean who takes spades and luggage to Blackpool these days?

Platforms are not long enough for that formation.

As to the platforms, just get passengers to use a door that's at the platform like East Coast do with the Inverness and Aberdeen trains or s FGW do - simple!

 

[ukrob]

As to the platforms, just get passengers to use a door that's at the platform like East Coast do with the Inverness and Aberdeen trains or s FGW do - simple!

You need to look-up grandfather rights

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

You need to look-up grandfather rights

And SDO

 

[ukrob]

And SDO

Which spare loco hauled carriages have SDO?

 

[43034 The Black Horse]

Which spare loco hauled carriages have SDO?

None, I wasn't on about that. I was on about FGW using it on their short formed platforms....

 

[ukrob]

None, I wasn't on about that. I was on about FGW using it on their short formed platforms....

Ah, fair enough

 

[transportphoto]

As to the platforms, just get passengers to use a door that's at the platform like East Coast do with the Inverness and Aberdeen trains or s FGW do - simple!

I know GC were doing / are doing that at Heartlepool and Sunderland. This time the passengers were told not to us the doors in the front two carriages due to the platform works. Many passengers obeyed although the platform was there (and doors unlocked)!

 

[142094]

Probably no doubt due to health and safety, even if the platform looked clear. Would only take one person to fall over or something and a call to Mr Ambulance Chaser for people to start complaining. At Hartlepool it might be to do with the roof, the platform may be clear but could still be dangerous overhead.

 

[WatcherZero]

The sooner it can get anymore stock the better for Northern:

About 100,000 commuters are squeezed onto overcrowded trains each week because of a lack of carriages.
Eleven rail companies are failing to provide the number of seats required by contracts with the Government.
More than 1,000 trains a week are shorter than they should be. Offenders include London Midland, Southern, Southeastern, South West Trains, c2c, First Capital Connect and Chiltern.
London Midland runs 148 trains with missing carriages a week. Southern, Southeastern and South West together run 194 shortened trains. Worst hit is Northern, which runs 722.
The Government warned of financial penalties. Louise Ellman, chairman of the transport select committee, said: “This is totally unacceptable.”

 

[devon_metro]

How is fining them going to help? The government is at fault, as usual, for not providing adequate provision! Hypocrites.

 

[ChrisCooper]

Typical how they list off all the London commuter lines as offenders, with no mention of others, then point out that northern run nearly 4 times as many short formed trains as the 3 "Southern" TOCs combined. I wonder how many of LMs 148 are in the Birmingham area.

The DfT though does seem more to blaim than the TOCs though. They allocate stock, they deal with new train orders, and they don't make life easy when TOCs want to hire in additional stock.

There is plenty of hauled stock around that could be used to boost services, not to mention stored and preserved units that I'm sure would be suitable for certain workings (there must be plenty of self contained branches where a 1st generation DMU or even one of the preserved Thumpers could work, and there are a few CIGs and VEPs able to run), and TOCs often come up with ideas for using it but seem to get blocked somewhere along the lines. This is before we get onto the rediculous HSE rubbish that means that means a lot of stock would be restricted to self contained branches. I'm sure most passengers given the choice between being packed onto, or not even able to board, a brand new train, and actually getting a seat on an old train would take the latter. From the safety point of view, yes there might be a slight additional risk from the use of Mk1 stock, but surely the risk to the individual is higher if overcrowding forces them into their car.

 

[87015]

How is fining them going to help? The government is at fault, as usual, for not providing adequate provision! Hypocrites.

I'm pretty sure thats talking about on the day short formed, because the contract (SLC) from "failing to provide the number of seats required by contracts with the Government" is what is set out to use the existing fleet.

If the TOCs don't bother to maintain there trains enough to get them reliable enough or just don't bother to get the units into service thats not the DfTs fault, and no TOCs TPU is going to diagram out levels of units that are known to be unreachable because of the penalties that would incur.

 

[devon_metro]

I'm pretty sure thats talking about on the day short formed, because the contract (SLC) from "failing to provide the number of seats required by contracts with the Government" is what is set out to use the existing fleet.

If the TOCs don't bother to maintain there trains enough to get them reliable enough or just don't bother to get the units into service thats not the DfTs fault, and no TOCs TPU is going to diagram out levels of units that are known to be unreachable because of the penalties that would incur.

Fair enough, I was assuming it was referring to general short formings as to what DFT expects trains to be formed, as a result of a lack of rolling stock.

 

[WatcherZero]

Ironic then that Today its just been awarded as the first operator to recieve the Investors in Excellence Standard.

The fact is Northern doesnt have the standby trains to fill in for breakdowns on its old stock and has had to add new services and strengthening without extra carriages.